TB Breeding to be listed in FEI competitions and Olympics

[reynold]

Thoroughbreds to be recognised at Olympics, but still can’t contest World Breeding Championships

Thoroughbreds are to be recognised at the Olympics from Paris 2024, and breeding will now appear on start lists and results following a new agreement

www.horseandhound.co.uk

It's a step in the right direction to recognise TBs, particularly retired racehorses. TB blood is so important, particularly for eventing.

Maybe one day TBs will be fully recognised.

 

[Squeak]

I'm really surprised that Thoroughbreds weren't already recognised as a breed and had to compete as 'unknown' breed at the Olympics and FEI events. I'm not sure I see the argument of keeping them out of the world breeding championships either, that just sounds like it's purely political.

 

[humblepie]

I hadn't realised until I saw the article that they were listed as "unknown" when their breeding is so traceable. It is good this is being done.

 

[ihatework]

I hadn't realised until I saw the article that they were listed as "unknown" when their breeding is so traceable. It is good this is being done.

I’m embarrassed to admit I didn’t know either!!

 

[ycbm]

I’m embarrassed to admit I didn’t know either!!

Ditto. How crazy to list them as unknown when you can trace them back a dozen or more generations and there's a tightly controlled stud book.

 

[catkin]

Ditto. How crazy to list them as unknown when you can trace them back a dozen or more generations and there's a tightly controlled stud book.

That's just bonkers when TB blood was often a foundation of lots of Sport Horse registers. Why leave it out?

 

[fetlock]

I didn’t know either. How utterly bizarre

 

[eggs]

Another who is slightly ashamed to admit that I didn't realise this either. Sounds like political nonsense to keep them out of the world breeding championships especially where there is a good dollop of TB blood in a lot of warmbloods that would be eligible.

 

[tristar]

the fear of being usurped......

 

[LEC]

I knew they were not on WBFSH but had never looked at how they were recorded on FEI. I just knew which horses were TB so tended to look them up on racing post or Horse telex. There are also some TBs who fell under SHBGB as not bred for racing but sport.

 

[toppedoff]

this is all i found when it was shared on twitter from a user replying to people who asked why werent tbs valid till then, still vey odd though

 

[Cortez]

Actually it's because the TB studbook didn't want to be associated with the sport horse bodies or their requirements, nothing to do with being political or afraid of being "usurped", on the warmblood side anyway. There aren't all that many pure TB horses in international sport, and TB blood has always been thoroughly appreciated, and listed as such in WB pedigrees.

 

[tristar]

a lot of top competition horses by pedigree could and should be classified as part thoroughbred, some with a high percentage, and are really that, predominantly thoroughbred and not acknowledged as such, because the continental breeders have used the tb to create the warmblood so its their product.

i`ve thought for a long time the tb should have its own part bred register to claim its place in competition horse breeding, and not just the NTR, if that still exists

 

[Cortez]

a lot of top competition horses by pedigree could and should be classified as part thoroughbred, some with a high percentage, and are really that, predominantly thoroughbred and not acknowledged as such, because the continental breeders have used the tb to create the warmblood so its their product.

i`ve thought for a long time the tb should have its own part bred register to claim its place in competition horse breeding, and not just the NTR, if that still exists

In order to do so it would have to comply with the regulations required of recognised studbooks, and the TB stud book (Weatherbys) don't want to do that; fair enough. TB breeding in warmblood stud books is always listed and acknowledged as such. You sound as if you are suspecting some sort of slight towards the TB? There is no such conspiracy going on and the non-inclusion of purebred TBs is entirely down to their own studbook's decision.

 

[tristar]

of course the tb blood is listed otherwise their would be gaping holes in pedigrees

i wish it had been the other way around that the brits had taken the continental horses and produced their own warmblood competition horse studbook


i`ve always thought the english are the best horse breeders and the lack of a national strategy and government support and encouragement is so pathetic

 

[Cortez]

of course the tb blood is listed otherwise their would be gaping holes in pedigrees

i wish it had been the other way around that the brits had taken the continental horses and produced their own warmblood competition horse studbook


i`ve always thought the english are the best horse breeders and the lack of a national strategy and government support and encouragement is so pathetic

I thought they did, there was the Anglo Dutch something something wasn't there? Or was that affiliated to the Dutch Warmblood book? Can't remember, I've been out of the breeding and stud book admin world for a long while now.

What do you base the English being the best horse breeders on?

 

[tristar]

well for start they developed the TB.

the english riding pony can be perfection in miniature

9 fabulous breeds of native pony

at one time you could go newmarket in march and see 50 0r 60 TB stallions available for breeding in one day

lady anne blunt importing arabs from the desert over a hundred years ago, travelling around the desert buying....




could go on but have go outside and ride a hoss, english of course!

 

[Cortez]

well for start they developed the TB.

the english riding pony can be perfection in miniature

9 fabulous breeds of native pony

at one time you could go newmarket in march and see 50 0r 60 TB stallions available for breeding in one day

lady anne blunt importing arabs from the desert over a hundred years ago, travelling around the desert buying....




could go on but have go outside and ride a hoss, english of course!

The TB I'll give you; superb horses for going really, really fast.

8 breeds of pony, one of them's ours

Lady Ann Blunt didn't invent the Arabian, you said it yourself, she bought them from the people who did.

You've left out quite a few: the Cleveland Bay, Shire, other heavies. But I query the "best" bit, there are lots of places that produce more and better sports horses. Enjoy your ride

 

[stangs]

8 breeds of pony, one of them's ours

How are you getting 7 native pony breeds? If you just do English pony breeds, that's 6, 7 only if you include the DHP. If you do British pony breeds, you get 10, presuming you count the Welshies as one breed.

You've left out quite a few: the Cleveland Bay, Shire, other heavies. But I query the "best" bit, there are lots of places that produce more and better sports horses. Enjoy your ride

(And the Hackney!)

Besides, why do you have to breed dressage/SJ/eventing horses to be the 'best horse breeders'? England produced breeds for everything from driving to hunting to showing: all hardy, intelligent animals perfectly suited for their jobs, genetically diverse, and many of which fetch ridiculous prices worldwide.

And you can't just gloss over the impact that the TB has had globally with one sentence. The TB is far more influential than all of Europe's WB breeds put together - almost every country, from Vietnam to Libya, races them. Not to mention the influence they've had on producing WBs.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

How are you getting 7 native pony breeds? If you just do English pony breeds, that's 6, 7 only if you include the DHP. If you do British pony breeds, you get 10, presuming you count the Welshies as one


1. Dartmoor
2. Exmoor
3. Shetland
4. Welsh
5. Dales
6. Fell
7. Highland
8. New Forest

If you count the Irish Connemara you get 9 British Native breeds.

DHP are cross breeds of everything thay chucked out on the Moor. If you want to be pernickety then there is also the Eriskay in Scotland and the Kerry Bog in Ireland.

 

[stangs]

Why would it be pernickety to include the Eriskay? The breed's very genetically distinct from our other native breeds. And do you not include the Hackney pony as a native breed?

 

[Cortez]

Well, arguably the most influential horse breed in all modern breeds, including the TB, is the Spanish. The Byerly Turk (origin is in the name....) being the first recognised sire in the TB stud was mainly put to "the King's mares", which were predominantly of Spanish blood.

For Stangs; a sports horse is anything used for sporting purposes, including hunting, hacking, pony trekking, whatever. I didn't mention dressage, SJ or eventing. Only a registered TB can race under JC rules, so of course they are raced (and bred) all over the world. How is that "glossing over"?

 

[skint.spotty]

Well, arguably the most influential horse breed in all modern breeds, including the TB, is the Spanish. The Byerly Turk (origin is in the name....) being the first recognised sire in the TB stud was mainly put to "the King's mares", which were predominantly of Spanish blood.

For Stangs; a sports horse is anything used for sporting purposes, including hunting, hacking, pony trekking, whatever. I didn't mention dressage, SJ or eventing. Only a registered TB can race under JC rules, so of course they are raced (and bred) all over the world. How is that "glossing over"?

The Byerley Turk was an akhal teke or arabian, not a spanish breed.

 

[Cortez]

The Byerley Turk was an akhal teke or arabian, not a spanish breed.

I didn’t say he was Spanish, I said he was Turkish, as designated by his actual name. He was not an Arabian, nor an Akhal Teke, he was Turkomene.

 

[rabatsa]

As we are talking HORSES surely the native breeds are the Suffolk, Clydesdale, Shire, Cleveland Bay & Hackney?

 

[DabDab]

Trad cob? British, not British? We certainly Breed a lot of them

 

[DabDab]

I would also tend to agree that the range of British breeds has got to be one of the best sets of national breeds going

 

[honetpot]

I always think of our native breeds and basically happy accidents for the majority of their breed history, and that the nature of the terrain has mainly shaped their development, with the odd stallion thrown out to improve them, which often would be a small TB type or had a bit of blood horse in it. Anyone who loves native ponies likes the fact they are not small horses, and have the ability to survive with little outside help.
About thirty years ago when I was looking at 'warmblood'breeding, it was far more obvious that they were based on TB blood, the stallion line was more obvious, and if you wanted a cheap warmblood you could buy a TB for £500, and I think some of the snobbery is based on marketing, to make the warmblood seem a better product. I do not agree with breeding anything just for one physical activity, but really the TB is the most recorded sports horse, results based breed there is.

 

[reynold]

I'd also think that the Arab horse has a fairly long recorded breeding and it provided founding blood for the TB.

It is a shame these days that the anglo-arab has fallen out of favour as a cross as they generally were good horses (Tamarillo e.g.) I find it a shame that the Arab is now seemingly only used for showing and endurance plus racing.

Also seemingly out of favour is Welsh x TB - generally a bit 'hot' but lovely competition horses and also found in the bloodlines of the (FEI competing) German dressage ponies/small horses.

 

[tristar]

The TB I'll give you; superb horses for going really, really fast.



8 breeds of pony, one of them's ours

Lady Ann Blunt didn't invent the Arabian, you said it yourself, she bought them from the people who did.

You've left out quite a few: the Cleveland Bay, Shire, other heavies. But I query the "best" bit, there are lots of places that produce more and better sports horses. Enjoy your ride

i mentioned lady anne blunt arabians, crabbet, because through her the arabian horse had world wide influence, as a part bred and pure bred, a lady with excellent breeding skills, many breeders even today comment how they long for crabbet blood in their breeding lines.

i have 2 horses with the blood of comet the polish arab selected by lady anne lytton as an outcross, many years ago i saw horses by comet, superb, strong, big moving horses.