Teaching a dog to come out riding

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catherine22

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Hi,
I want to teach my dog Max, (4 year old weimeraner) to come out riding with me. He will need to be on a long rope while we walk down the road, then will be let off once we get to the forest.
The problems I have are, that he wont come close enough to me on my horse while we're walking down the road (tried it with my OH out walking with us) he ends up in the middle of the road.
Once we get to the forest and he's let off the lead he then has no respect for my horse and wont think twice about cutting in front of us if we're cantering along (rather disconcerting!). He is also like this around the yard, he'll wander through horses' legs and try and play with him like another dog.

Not sure how to go about it, we do try and practice when my OH comes out walking with us but its never particularly successful but we're still trying - it would make life so much easier!!, our old weimeraner just knew what to do so never needed teaching but he was too old and poorly to come out with us to teach Max

Any ideas?

There was wine on offer but I've finished it off, can offer stella cidre and garlic bread though
 
You need to train the manners on the ground first.
Like Ibot says, start on foor or a bike, just straddling it around the yard, keep the dog in a heel position on the left ideally and use a command like 'follow', something completely new, and keep his shoulder at your knee. Just waddle around to begin with and feed him or praise him while he stays with you. Ideally he would be able to do this on a flat collar but at his age he might need some power steering to encourage him to stay close in the beginning, like a slip lead, check or half check chain or a headcollar.

Re the playing around the horses legs, shoot me down but you might need to use an aversive to correct the dog, better than him getting kicked, something like your voice or a lead correction from someone on the ground.

Slow and annoying but there are some things you can't cut corners with and some dogs don't just 'know what to do' and it's dangerous when it fouls up - he'll get run over or kicked.
 
Thanks for the replies, he's fine following my oh on his bike, but will still cut him up but is starting to get better and he will walk to heel 90% of the time when on foot, it's the horse aspect that throws him off!
Funnily enough we do use follow as a command so he is starting to grasp it, so we'll keep reinforcing it.

My horse is very good with him however one day he will try and walk under the wrong horse. Hadn't thought of using treats, will try that, hopefully it will keep his attention as he doesnt have the longest attention span!

Will keep persevering with him. Thank you
 
Don't feed him before you start training this - he needs to be hungry!
If he is still cutting up on the bike he needs to go back on a lead. I'm not averse to giving a nudge with the wheel if the dog gets ahead of me or comes across me, as long as the dog is strong enough to take it and won't freak out.
 
Ok plan will be, hungry dog, on lead next to oh on bike,being told to follow (dog not oh!) I will ride horse as well just to get him more used to the horse being out with him. Dog is more than capable of receiving a nudge from the wheel.
I think it will take a while, but will be so worth it when he's Sussed it!!
 
CaveCanem said:
Don't feed him before you start training this - he needs to be hungry!
If he is still cutting up on the bike he needs to go back on a lead. I'm not averse to giving a nudge with the wheel if the dog gets ahead of me or comes across me, as long as the dog is strong enough to take it and won't freak out.
Click to expand...

totally agree i have had my dog out with the bike and i tell you it does not take long for them to cope on.

My pup is now 9 months old and hacked with me for a while now he is getting much better but he just knows :D:D i think my last dog must have come back and told him bless him :)
 
I personally think that if you have to any kind of road work then it is highly dangerous to take a dog with you when riding your horse. The roads these days are too busy and frankly in this litigious society you leave yourself wide open to claims of the dog causing accidents.

I personally was involved when one of my neighbours used to take her dogs when she rode out. I had stopped the car as often she had a youngster and the road was narrow. We exchanged pleasantries and she rode on past taking the dogs with her. I pulled off and one of the dogs galloped straight under my wheels and I had no hope of avoiding him and ran over him. He had an enormous amount of damage poor boy and I took him straight to a vet as she was in no position to be able to. Dog survived after lengthy hospitalisation and the most enormous bill. I was most upset about it all but categorically it was not my fault. It doesn't take much for what seems like a good idea to turn to disaster.

If you have nothing but endless off road then it's a really good idea but if you have any roads ( and who doesn't these days) then I would ask you to please not do it.
 
I have to say that what you propose is very very dangerous.

Below is the only report I can find with a quick search but I gather a dog owner was trying to handle her horse with her dog on a retractable lead. The lead got tangled around the horse's feet who then bolted dragging the dog. The dog was killed when the horse kicked. Sorry to have to be the bearer of bad news but what you propose is NOT a good idea.

http://www.team-oakden.com/1/post/2012/5/hot-hot-hot.html

I'd just like to finish my blog off by saying Sorry to the person yesterday who's dog got killed at Scotsburn after it was kicked in the collecting ring due to getting wrapped round a horse's leg.....(Im not really sure what happened) I think I know the person whos dog it was so, I'm so sorry..........an awful thing to happen that probably couldn't have been avoided....one of those things.
 
Second above post about trying to use a retractable lead. DON'T DON'T DON'T. Very stupidly in a rash idea moment I did try it with my old boy and our JRT we had at the time. He was a really sensible horse and thank god nothing happened coz the dog got herself all wrapped up around his legs with the nylon string, and it could have had catastrophic consequences.

I'd love to take my two dogs out riding with me; but daren't as they're both suicidal when out on the roads and I'm just not prepared to risk it. If I didn't have to do road work I would, but I'm unfortunately not in that position. A pity, but there it is.

Years ago when I had my first pony we'd hack out with the dog we had then; she was a lovely sweet dog, never any trouble, would just tuck in behind the horse's tail and if a car did come I always knew she'd be there - never even had to look round just knew I could rely on her to be sensible. Not so the two I've got now!!! Blimmin dogs.
 
Personally think it's asking for trouble if there is any road work involved. I ride out with Ruby but only round the farm block which involves no roads except to cross one where the yard track ends - I don't mount until after crossing the road as it's not a nice crossing and would never forgive myself if something happened. I also dismount before crossing to get back to the yard.
 
I never mentioned a retractable lead, he would be on a long rope.

When I say road, it is a very quiet country lane down to the forest, we hardly ever see a car but I'd rather have him on a lead in case he saw anything to chase and the time a car came. Once we're there (about 1/2 a mile) we dont need to see a road again until we come back.

Horse never kicks so that wouldn't be an issue and all are insured in case the worse did happen.

Will continue to go out with OH on bike and see how it goes
 
My dog has always come out with me (for last 11 years!), I did used to take him on roads but no longer do due to the traffic being so fast and busy. I still take him down one country lane which is very very quiet to get to off road riding but it is very quiet and I choose my times to go - mostly I take him when we box up - he does occasionally do a dash in front of the horse but 99.9% of the time I forget he is there he is soo good.

The key tbh with mine is ...... he is a border colllie !!!!! his instinct is to stay behind the horse at all costs ! no training required as it is in built into him - he will stay behind the horse even when there are loose sheep etc around as he thinks its his job !

I would never ever use a lead of any kind - dog always has a flourescent on and I always carry a schooling whip to hold behind me when a car is approaching to reinforce keeping dog in behind horse - not that its needed but its a habit !
 
imagine if the lead got caught round horses leg with dog attached to end and horse panicked !! if you have to use a lead (which I never ever would) make sure it will break under tension and obviously attached to a sturdy collar not a slip lead that loops around neck. I would prefer to have a shock collar type thing to stop dog in tracks in emergency than use a lead I think - have never used either but just a thought.
 
Wouldnt have to dismount, horse will stand in stream, dog will sit on bank which is then pretty level with us and easy to unclip (we have practiced this)
If he did try/ start to go under horses legs while on a lead I would just let go of lead, so they wouldnt end up tangled together.
Wondering if it would be easier to lead both horse and dog down then get on once we're off road (once we've sorted the cutting in front of horse/ bike problem)
 
I always used to hack out with my Border terrier. For any road work I would be on the left side of the road on foot with horse held by the reins on my left and dog on a very short lead on my right. I would not have done it on busy roads or with a horse likely to play up. Once off road I would let dog loose and mount up. The dog was trained to lie down and wait on command anywhere anytime, heel or get behind the horse if necessary, he was also extremely laid back with other animals we met. I would never lead a dog from a horse as the potential for disaster is just too great.
 
My dogs are really good now and heel whether that be walking/cycling or on horseback. I started off with cycling and they are awesome now. Both dogs trot along to the inside of me on leads beautifully.
However - I would never do this on the roads.
With my last horse (God rest his soul) I would trailer him to Bedgebury or Bewl Water and the dogs would run with me off lead as it was all off road.

My dogs are everything to me and I would never forgive myself if anything happened to them. I stress enough trying to keep my horses safe on the road. They are just too busy/dangerous. Even on a quiet country lane - it only takes one car to be going to fast and getting a horse and dogs out of the way in time would be nigh on impossible.
 
It was one of my best pleasures to take my dog out hacking with me, but I do think you have to have the right dog for it. Mine was a rottie x gsd and was born trained and both he and the horse were rock solid in traffic. My current 4 year old Weimaraner just doesn't have the nous or road sense and I wouldn't risk it. I wish I could :( I wish you all the best with it!
 
In my mind i think some dogs just can naturally do this and others can't. Our old collie x lab was very very very loyal and was brilliant at heel etc andshe would walk on the pavement to heel with the horse on the lanes. When we had to cross a road we taught her to jump up with paws on the horse (obviously you have to have a willing, trusting horse too) and we'd clip the lead on. She was brilliant though to be honest, she didn't actually need a lead really ro cross a road.

As she got older though she decided when it was too much for her to come and she'd just stay on her bed. It was so sad as, as a kid I used to love taking my pony out and having her with me - we used to race!

Funny thing is, even though as an adult now I feel I know more about training dogs than I did then, I would not take my current dog out hacking as I don't trust her to stay alongside me so it would be dangerous. I just think some dogs can't do it no matter what you try but then maybe that's just my theory!
 
Thanks to help from this forum and a very long suffering friend, youngest staffie can now hack safely. Before we started this, Honey had to be really taught, stay, leave, come and heel. Repeated ad finitum. I used treats, she loses focus if I go out empty handed. Then we tried walk and ride ( a walker plus rider), then out with a well behaved dog and very long suffering old mare.

It did go wrong badly at one point as, while it sounds obvious, friend had to point out that simply shouting my dogs name with no command was a waste of breathe... Whoops! We also struggled with leave sometimes as well so really reinforced heel to ensure she is focused on me and not walkers etc.

But I don't have any road work, apart from crossing a b road...
 
I do hack with my dogs but not on "proper" roads. I occasionally take them round our local circuit but only at times when I know I wont meet anyone. They are both trained to go onto the verge and lie down if they see a car. Hubby is not really happy about it though so it very rarely happens.

I did go a lovely hack with a friend recently. I led my horse in one hand and my dogs in the other hand and we walked for the half mile of road work it took to get off road. Then we all had a fun time :D
 
I think it very much depends on the dog. Our old lab came EVERYWHERE with me and the horses. She had good natural road sense and was extremely obedient and not highly strung or excitable. She would never chase anything and always stuck to the edge of the road or pavement, by herself. She was the kind of dog who was never ever on a lead when walked so riding was no diffrerent.

She learnt a couple of vital commands and could be trusted to obey them instantly and without question. She learnt In/Off (off the road or into the side) and would scrabble up bankings to obey. Wait was essential and Cross (she would cross the road instantly at right angles to the other side). She knew all the other 'stay, sit, come, heel' etc.

She also had a healthy respect for horses without being frightened of them.

Current lab needs a lot more work and to calm down a bit before she could come out with the horses. Like most dogs she has no concept of 'roads' and will wander off the pavement when distracted. She is however extremely quick to obey, very attentive and naturally sticks close. Once she's learnt In/Off she will be able to come riding with me on certain routes (with minimal roadwork)
 
I'm lucky that my yard goes straight onto bridlepaths.

I haven't hack out with H much, but I will always remember the first time. I rode off the yard and he just stood there looking heartbroken that I'd left him!!!! Took him a minute for the penny to drop that I was calling him and he should come with me! Bless him. At walk he potters along in front, but if I go any faster he just follows me.

I don't think it's a great idea to lead him off your horse on a road. Better idea is to walk and lead them both I think.
 
I would only ever do this on private land... with no road work at all.

What will you do if you meet walkers with a loose dog that decides it would like yours for tea? Can you be 100% sure your dog will not approach another dog when you are out?

I wont even lead a horse and dog together, I prefer my dog alive.
 
Kallibear said:
I think it very much depends on the dog. Our old lab came EVERYWHERE with me and the horses. She had good natural road sense and was extremely obedient and not highly strung or excitable. She would never chase anything and always stuck to the edge of the road or pavement, by herself. She was the kind of dog who was never ever on a lead when walked so riding was no diffrerent.

She learnt a couple of vital commands and could be trusted to obey them instantly and without question. She learnt In/Off (off the road or into the side) and would scrabble up bankings to obey. Wait was essential and Cross (she would cross the road instantly at right angles to the other side). She knew all the other 'stay, sit, come, heel' etc.
Click to expand...

That is exactly what our old lab x was like - some dogs just seem to be naturals! :)
 
littlemisslauren said:
I would only ever do this on private land... with no road work at all.

What will you do if you meet walkers with a loose dog that decides it would like yours for tea? Can you be 100% sure your dog will not approach another dog when you are out?

I wont even lead a horse and dog together, I prefer my dog alive.
Click to expand...

Good point about other loose dogs. I have taught mine to come to heel when I see other dogs and keep her attention on me and the treats in my hand. Doesn't work with all dogs. I am sure the oldest Stafford would love to come out but I do not have 100% total control of her off lead so it's a no go for her. Having staffords means I am perhaps a little overboard in their manners but as a lot people assume they are bad dogs, I really do try to ensure mine are well behaved and oldest dog will randomly bu**er off after another dog fields away. Done it twice, does not get to do it a 3rd.
 
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