Teaching horse to work into a "shape"

[ownedbyaconnie]

So as a lot of you know I got my green connie mare when I was also (and still am) green as grass. The last 3 years have been a slow process of sorting her teeth issues, associated headshaking and bringing her on super slowly working on suppleness, impulsion, rhythm etc etc to get her to a point where she is now actually starting to seek the contact and I can actually feel her at the end of my reins! She came to me straight from Ireland where she'd hacked and hunted so schooling literally started from scratch.

My instructor has mentioned we are getting to a point where we can start trying to work in some kind of a shape. I just wanted to find out how other people have gone about this so I can go into this with some kind of an idea (I trust my instructor completely so not doubting her at all, I just like to hear how people go about things differently!). Will try and find some pics to show our progress so far!

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Think this is around March 2019, had had her a year but unbeknownst to me at this point she had a fractured tooth (fractured root in her gum, dentist and vet could see no sign of anything in the mouth causing headshaking so we all assumed it was allergies until about two months after this where the split finally went down to the crown and was then spotted and extracted).
October 2020. Much more relaxed but was a bit spooky this day and wasn’t as forward as I’d have liked!

 

[milliepops]

I think you need to just concentrate on what your instructor is suggesting especially as you are both learning together, but my approach is quite direct, as soon as the horse is strong enough for short spells then I ask it to soften to the contact straight away just as a basic understanding and control thing. I'd expect a newly broken horse to understand the concept early on, and a re-training project to pick it up within a couple of weeks unless there was something significantly physically wrong. I would then want to work the horse into the contact like that for frequent short periods to build the physical and mental ability to work correctly.

 

[emilylou]

If I was teaching you I'd be getting you to do walk- trot transitions on a circle/figure 8 without stirrups. May be a good exercise to try.
Also, the book The Classical Seat Sylvia Loch is helpful reading.
'Correct shape' is a sliding scale with many components and no singular route to achieve it.

 

[tatty_v]

Thinking back, I went on a similar journey with my Connie, although he was much older. I bought him at 15 and he hadn’t done much schooling, I remember he used to go round the school bent to the outside like a banana with his head in the air! I had regular lessons and as @milliepops suggests, asked him to flex (the key with him) and soften to the contact for brief periods, building up as he got stronger. I also found plenty of lateral work helped and getting him really active from behind.

The two pictures below are about 6 months apart - the first from one of my early lessons when I’d just bought him (and was both terrified and confused, hence the perching!) and the second is his first prelim dressage test that summer. You can see the improvement (especially in his top line) - that came from just regular schooling (3-4 times a week) and lots of lessons (he’s my first horse so I was learning too).

We didn’t get everything right (and still don’t!) but hopefully it shows you it can be done!

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Thanks all. As I say have complete faith in my instructor, was just interested to see what other people found helped or go-to exercises.

Tatty_v your connie sounds very similar to mine. I remember that first day I got actual inside bend, I cried! The banana still comes out when she's particularly aggrieved at something she doesn't want to do. I am gradually increasing the lateral work, the foundations are there I just need to push us both.

 

[Littlebear]

Its a tricky one without seeing things in real time, you both look lovely but you need to learn to sit with your seat bones under you and your leg around the horse more otherwise you will end up pulling the front end in, i would personally start with some lunge lessons, really work on that position first of all, have the instructor pop a set of side reins on that aren't too tight and just do 10 mins or so to work on you.
Alongside this warm your pony up before you get on, its cold, warm up the back with something warm or a massage pad if you have one, then do a little in hand work or even just walking around before you get on. Really start to consider what suppleness is now, the use of the muscles etc, its years of understanding but you sound a lot like you are on the right tracks and wanting to learn.

I would look at introducing some lateral flexion from the poll a few seconds each way and then playing with the bend don't stay with your usual routine all the time, when you ask for a little flexion think of keeping your seat in the same rhythm but closing the thigh on the same side to give them support. Look at doing this hacking as well, flex one way then the other, do a little shoulder fore, little leg yields etc, don't just wander round the edge of a school, if you are in there stay away from the track to make sure you are using both reins and both legs. When you use poles don't just go straight go sideways and that doesn't have to be perfect just think of getting the hindleg to go over and across not just straight.

For flexibility and suppleness to develop the pony needs to work in different frames/angles/ speeds etc, but you have to be able to ride leg to hand and your position whilst nice in the pics just needs a few tweaks to help the pony be able to get there x

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Its a tricky one without seeing things in real time, you both look lovely but you need to learn to sit with your seat bones under you and your leg around the horse more otherwise you will end up pulling the front end in, i would personally start with some lunge lessons, really work on that position first of all, have the instructor pop a set of side reins on that aren't too tight and just do 10 mins or so to work on you.
Alongside this warm your pony up before you get on, its cold, warm up the back with something warm or a massage pad if you have one, then do a little in hand work or even just walking around before you get on. Really start to consider what suppleness is now, the use of the muscles etc, its years of understanding but you sound a lot like you are on the right tracks and wanting to learn.

I would look at introducing some lateral flexion from the poll a few seconds each way and then playing with the bend don't stay with your usual routine all the time, when you ask for a little flexion think of keeping your seat in the same rhythm but closing the thigh on the same side to give them support. Look at doing this hacking as well, flex one way then the other, do a little shoulder fore, little leg yields etc, don't just wander round the edge of a school, if you are in there stay away from the track to make sure you are using both reins and both legs. When you use poles don't just go straight go sideways and that doesn't have to be perfect just think of getting the hindleg to go over and across not just straight.

For flexibility and suppleness to develop the pony needs to work in different frames/angles/ speeds etc, but you have to be able to ride leg to hand and your position whilst nice in the pics just needs a few tweaks to help the pony be able to get there x

Ah I'm glad you said this! Since the above photos I've actually been working really hard on getting my bum under me. I had an injury along with my mares tendency to pull me forward has meant I've developed a habit of tilting my pelvis the wrong way! Will try and get a more up to date photo/video. I have noticed since trying to sit more on my seatbones that my half halts especially in canter are becoming a lot more effective, when we do poles in canter she has a tendency to speed up and I'm now finding it much easier to keep her in balance. I've also dropped my stirrups a hole or two since the last photo! Looking at it now it looks like I'd got lost and was meant to be showjumping, not dressage! Was a brand new saddle and was still getting used to it.

In terms of warming her up I tend to ride after she comes in from the field, so hopefully a bit looser than if she'd been in the stable overnight.

Will definitely give the flexions a try, interesting you say about not sticking to the edge of the school. In my lesson today we were doing poles away from the track and as you say really showed where on one rein in particular she was really straying out of my outside rein (partly due to her own slightly lopsided weakness but I think also my left hand and leg is a bit pathetic!).

I'll try and get a video this week and pop it on and hopefully have a much improved video in time to compare!

 

[Bernster]

Well, my new loan horse is making a nice inverted banana shape right now, so I feel ya! Sounds like your instructor thinks you’re ready to ask for a bit more, and expect a bit more. Which is very encouraging.

Can only go on the snapshot pic but id say well done on the improvement but it does look like she has more to come in really working over her back, pushing from the back end, and lowering her frame (through to the head and neck) and working into the contact. But it’s a comp photo, so that might not be representative.

I’d say my boy is probably at a similar stage to yours from this pic. For him (he’s quite laid back), it’s been a case of really getting the engine/hind end working and pushing through, me not blocking with my seat or hands, and working on more bend and suppleness through his body using my seat and legs, into a supporting outside rein. Lots of lateral work and being hot on transitions (he’s got to be quicker off the aids). I doubt we’re quite ready to do that in a comp but at home we’re getting some nice moments.

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Well, my new loan horse is making a nice inverted banana shape right now, so I feel ya! Sounds like your instructor thinks you’re ready to ask for a bit more, and expect a bit more. Which is very encouraging.

Can only go on the snapshot pic but id say well done on the improvement but it does look like she has more to come in really working over her back, pushing from the back end, and lowering her frame (through to the head and neck) and working into the contact. But it’s a comp photo, so that might not be representative.

I’d say my boy is probably at a similar stage to yours from this pic. For him (he’s quite laid back), it’s been a case of really getting the engine/hind end working and pushing through, me not blocking with my seat or hands, and working on more bend and suppleness through his body using my seat and legs, into a supporting outside rein. Lots of lateral work and being hot on transitions (he’s got to be quicker off the aids). I doubt we’re quite ready to do that in a comp but at home we’re getting some nice moments.

I agree, she does definitely have way more to go in terms of pushing from behind and over her back but yes she is also naturally a bit more backward and tense in competitions than at home so photo probs isn't the best representation of her normal work. But I don't have any nice photos of us at home .

Yes sounds like we're at very similar stages! Sharper transitions are my main aim at the moment along with my dodgy seat.

 

[Somewhat Off The Way]

Sorry if it's already been said but I found hill work and raised poles really helped engage and strengthen up the hind which in turn made working in a shape easier for my horse.

Please keep us updated, I'm enjoying following your progress. Me and my horse are green and learning together too so it's encouraging to see how well you're doing

 

[ownedbyaconnie]

Sorry if it's already been said but I found hill work and raised poles really helped engage and strengthen up the hind which in turn made working in a shape easier for my horse.

Please keep us updated, I'm enjoying following your progress. Me and my horse are green and learning together too so it's encouraging to see how well you're doing

Ah thank you that's really kind! I've had a few moments where I've thought how nice it would be to learn from the horse or have an "easy" ride but deep down I've absolutely loved the whole process.

Yes we do lots of hill work although I am guilty of cantering up them, really need to do more in walk and trot to work her hind!

 

[maya2008]

I teach them to soften in-hand first so they understand the idea, then begin to ask for short periods in halt, then walk and so on. I have a great book by Philippe Karl that made it much easier and quicker than the way I had originally been taught. Most paths lead to the same ‘road’ though. I just find this way nicer now, the other way worked fine too and you couldn’t tell which horse was started using which method now!