Teaching to go forwards when breaking in

S

somethingorother

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 June 2008
Messages
5,395
Location
Lancashire
Visit site
How do you do it? Or how would you do it?

I have a friend with achy legs from teaching her just backed 3yo to go forwards, first time on her back.

I personally think it's a bad sign and would rather have someone on the ground to help forward-ness, rather than kicking until my legs ached!

Or am i wrong?
 
Forwardness is learnt - and she can kick all she likes, but until the horse starts understanding the basic commands and is confident in themselves it aint' going to go anywhere.

Is she using voice commands?
 
I think if she has the help she should teach the horse voice aids on the lunge and then have someone lunging whilst she's riding and use just voice aids, then voice aids and small leg aids and then the legs aids on their own so she can get used to going forward without becoming dead to the leg. If she doesn't have the help it will be a bit harder but voice aids should help whether she can have someone on the end of a lunge line or not.

I read once that you should use one small leg aid followed by a huge pony club kick if the horse ignores it (they start to learn that they get a small leg aide followed by legs taken off then a huge kick - they eventually start to listen and may only need the legs to be taken off or small leg aide and start to anticipate more) but I wouldn't advise that on a younster being backed.

ETA I've never backed a horse so are by no means an expert it is just what I would try.
laugh.gif
 
[ QUOTE ]
Forwardness is learnt - and she can kick all she likes, but until the horse starts understanding the basic commands and is confident in themselves it aint' going to go anywhere.

Is she using voice commands?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ditto! Voice commands are essential (taught on the lunge!) I've actually just bid goodbye to a client who came to ride their baby for the second time - before she goes home. Her voice commands are so good that my rider - standing at the opposite end of the manege from horse and owner - got her to stop SO quickly rider nearly ended up on her neck!
grin.gif
And from the same place, put mare into canter when owner was struggling a bit.

We don't get on until voice aids are word perfect. Then you use legs and reins (LIGHTLY) at the same time as voice command until they understand the aids without the voice - at LEAST weeks- with voice being used to re-inforce for up to months!
 
I'm with JG on this one, voice commands are worth their weight in gold. They also work then if the horse gets loose, and whenI am riding and leading both neds pull up on my voice, as well as trotting on.
Invaluable for children's ponies too, so its worth taking time teaching them.
 
You use a schooling whip not your legs.. Your friend needs to have accustomed the horse to the schooling whip first by touching all over and being able to gently wrap the lunge whip round each of it's legs and over it's body without it flinching.
The other good method is once it's rideable go hacking, provided her basic flatwork was correct it will have brakes and steering from that.
I agree have help from the floor but be very careful, using a lunge whip can bring about some shooting forward, the lunger needs to know exactly how little encouragement to give.
 
Good God don't use the pony club kick thing on a youngtser, surely?!

the pony just needs to learn what to do - no wonder it's no responding as it obviously hasn't got a clue, and beating with heels isn't going to get either of them anywehre (well, rider mgiht end up on the floor but that's about it!)!

i agree that voice commands are MUCH more useful, and also if the pony is really anxious i find having someone on the ground dangling a carrot a metre or so off is excellent because the pony automatically steps forward and is automatically rewarded immediately. Also, it has its mind on the food, not on the fact that it feels reallt weird to move wiht weight on it (some horses react badly to their first step or two!). That would be for its first steps though so this maybe a little late!

i once broke in a pony who got confused about the cantering aids (didn't get that she could change pace), and found the best thing to do was to go out for a hack wiht someone else whose horse could canter, then i could use my legs, she could copy the other horse and she could learn (whilst having fun!) that she could change pace wiht me on her.

honestly i dont mean to be rude but this person needs to get some help IMO - the poor horse is not going to learn anything and is jsut going to end up with some very bruised ribs, whihc is the last thing she needs as her first experience of being ridden.

if she can't get help on the ground, tell her to use voice commands first (a clicker and groundwork are excellent for this).
 
[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Forwardness is learnt - and she can kick all she likes, but until the horse starts understanding the basic commands and is confident in themselves it aint' going to go anywhere.

Is she using voice commands?

[/ QUOTE ]

Ditto! Voice commands are essential (taught on the lunge!) I've actually just bid goodbye to a client who came to ride their baby for the second time - before she goes home. Her voice commands are so good that my rider - standing at the opposite end of the manege from horse and owner - got her to stop SO quickly rider nearly ended up on her neck!
grin.gif
And from the same place, put mare into canter when owner was struggling a bit.

We don't get on until voice aids are word perfect. Then you use legs and reins (LIGHTLY) at the same time as voice command until they understand the aids without the voice - at LEAST weeks- with voice being used to re-inforce for up to months!

[/ QUOTE ]

Agree exactly. The idea is what is learnt from lunging, long reining is transferred onto ridden work... You use your voice and leg as the horse in time will learn from just the leg and there is no need for the voice anymore... But it's the important part at the start.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Good God don't use the pony club kick thing on a youngtser, surely?!

[/ QUOTE ]

Noo, I said would be a bad idea on a younster just being backed but was a top riders advise for something that knows what it is doing. Maybe it will always be a more laid back horse and she can use it to sharpen him up later on. Gosh, I may have never backed a horse before but I'm not THAT silly.
wink.gif
 
By the age of 3 the youngster should really know "walk on". I use this command from the word go and 3 years on my youngsters know what it means so that when I first start breaking them it is simply converting the "walk on" in hand, to using it when lunging and then riding and for the first few ridden times a schooling whip to back up the leg aids is normally all that is needed to encourage forward motion in the horse.
 
The horse needs to going forward correctly on the lunge first with the voice, backed up with a lunge whip if need be.

Then once the horse has been backed, by the sounds of your friends horse, they need to start ridden work on the lunge, so the horse learns that 'leg on' means forward, with the person lunging bringing up the lunge whip behind (just lifting it) and using the voice (one voice..the person who is lunging) no kicking should even be involved at this stage.

Then eventually the horse will learn leg on, means forwards, and it doesnt matter if they bob into a trot, let them, so long as there going forwards thats all that matters at this stage and reward them by taking your leg off again, remaining silent and sitting quiet.
 
QR, basic ground work, leading, teaching" walk on " ," Woa "," back up", then progressing to long reining, using the voice. Imo, until control from the ground has been taught, walk on , stop , back up turn left, right etc you should not try to ride the horse.
 
thanks for the reassurance, i said to her if her legs are aching then she obviously doesn't know that leg aids mean 'move forwards' and she just said she knows, but thats why her legs are achy, because she's not learnt yet, but she got it after a bit and walked on.

It seemed a bit abrupt, so i don't know if i should say anything else as we're not very close friends and she came across as 'i know what i'm doing you numpty'... i just wanted to see what other people thought. She also called her stubborn, which got my back up.

I too would have used voice aids, i do with my riding anyway. I would be doing anything i could BUT for kicking that much my legs ached.

Meh, suppose there's not much i can do, apart from being sure in myself now that that is -not- the way to go about it.

I've never backed a horse from scratch, have always come in once they are sort of moving forwards etc and just need riding away. So i didn't want to sound pushy with her...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top