Terrier recall.... An impossible dream?

Cherryblossom

Cherryblossom

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Does anyone have a terrier with 100% recall? If so please can you share tips?

We've had our wee rescue 8months now, and he's come on brilliantly in that time. We thought we had our recall sorted, then had a bit of a scare up in the mountains when he proved he's quite like to be a sheep worrier! They were on the other side of a big river, so never in danger, but taught us that he's not a good as we thought!

After that we got a dog trainer out, because we really want to nail it.... A small fortune later, we were told that his recall is good, but being a terrier, he'll consider commands to be 'suggestions'! We really worked on the recall, and have him that I can recall him away from dogs, cyclists and even horses cantering past, which is all real progress (and costs another fortune in 'high value treats'). Then tonight, a door at a friends house was unexpectedly opened revealing their cat, and away he went again.

So should I just accept his limitations (cats, birds and sheep), and safety net accordingly? Or is there other tricks I could try? We carry good treats, a clicker and a squeaker (which is usually irresistable). It's hard when in practice, and mostly in reality he's foot perfect.

We think he's a JRT X patterdale, so plenty of brains and stubbornness on both sides!
 
I rather enjoy being cruel to terrier owners by showing this video, so it can be done. But don't ask me how! :)

[video=youtube_share;NAHJV0CqGNE]https://youtu.be/NAHJV0CqGNE[/video]
 
Loving Mr Murphy, what a character, and typically always having the last word! Still not sure I'd trust him to come back if he spotted something more exciting though. Starting classes with my terrier pup in a couple of weeks....should be a hoot.

Sorry cherryblossom, I can't offer any advice but it sounds like you've made brilliant progress already, well done.
 
That video is amazing!

And I really believed some wise old terrier owner would be on here to tell me that
I'm clearly an idiot, and if I do X,Y & Z, he'll definitely come back! Clearly I've underestimated terriorists!

So I guess it's time for plan b.... Anyone know how long range a taser is? 😂
 
Our terrier is totally reliable in a training situation. It is a very different story in the real world however! Training/competition grounds do not provide rabbit/pheasant/deer scents.
 
Cherryblossom said:
That video is amazing!

And I really believed some wise old terrier owner would be on here to tell me that
I'm clearly an idiot, and if I do X,Y & Z, he'll definitely come back! Clearly I've underestimated terriorists!

So I guess it's time for plan b.... Anyone know how long range a taser is? ��
Click to expand...

The 'trick' to a perfect recall is to convince the dog that when it is aware of some specific trigger ("Come Here"), the best and safest place to be is beside the owner. You won't achieve that with treats or squeaky toys. Not all training is achieved by being nice, that's why Nature invented pain! Sorry, but you know it's true.

In my youth, I hunted a pack of hounds and one thing you learn quite quickly is to get hounds to love you and realise that not everything 'out there' is pink and rosey. That's why they are called whippers in! The huntsman is NEVER nasty to his hounds (at least, not that they'd know!).

Dog trainers use various tricks to convince a dog that when the Come Here whistle is blown, being anywhere other than with the boss is kinda dangerous. We don't shout about this as it inevitably involves an element of "negative reinforcement".

The negativity can be created by applying anything the dog doesn't like and countering it with lavish praise and caressing when it gets back to the boss. The negativity is always applied in a way that the dog doesn't understand, so human logic where the dog gets punished for doing bad things (not coming to call) is counter productive. The negativity has to be inexplicable (to the dog) and is best immediate to the offence. The recall is a warning that there are evil forces out there and to get back to mum as quickly as possible.

Sometimes a handful of gravel will work, sometimes letting the dog drag a light cord and giving it a tug, sometimes just a loud shout may act as a reminder. You need to use your imagination. But remember, the negative element is always like a bolt of lightening from above -- immediate, inexplicable, and unpleasant, having shock value rather than pain.

In the past, I have cured a dog of the habit of being diverted by digging at rabbit holes as soon as it was let out and ignoring the recall. I let it trail a light cord, then when it's head was down a hole, I sneaked up and tied the end of the cord to a tree. Ten minutes later, I repeatedly called it, then after a suitable interval when it realised it was trapped and was thoroughly worried, released it and had a happy reunion. Another time, one of my GSDs was too busy digging out a rabbit to come to call. I approached unseen from behind and gave her a good smack on the butt! To be a successful trainer, you need to be cunning and devious-- and don't let a fault become a habit.

But I wonder if your dog has in fact trained you? Always be unpredictable. Hide from your dog and make it come and find you. If the dog takes the left path, you go right. Don't call repeatedly. Give one call and disappear and make the dog find you. (Assuming, of course, that it hasn't already found that rabbit hole or isn't securely fastened to a sheep's throat).
 
Cherryblossom said:
Does anyone have a terrier with 100% recall? If so please can you share tips?

We've had our wee rescue 8months now, and he's come on brilliantly in that time. We thought we had our recall sorted, then had a bit of a scare up in the mountains when he proved he's quite like to be a sheep worrier! They were on the other side of a big river, so never in danger, but taught us that he's not a good as we thought!

After that we got a dog trainer out, because we really want to nail it.... A small fortune later, we were told that his recall is good, but being a terrier, he'll consider commands to be 'suggestions'! We really worked on the recall, and have him that I can recall him away from dogs, cyclists and even horses cantering past, which is all real progress (and costs another fortune in 'high value treats'). Then tonight, a door at a friends house was unexpectedly opened revealing their cat, and away he went again.

So should I just accept his limitations (cats, birds and sheep), and safety net accordingly? Or is there other tricks I could try? We carry good treats, a clicker and a squeaker (which is usually irresistable). It's hard when in practice, and mostly in reality he's foot perfect.

We think he's a JRT X patterdale, so plenty of brains and stubbornness on both sides!
Click to expand...

Best of luck Cherryblossom! Our Jackos were a nightmare! Fine at home - but outside in the real world, when they went into "hunt" mode - forget it!! Did consider using a bungee cord, but never got around to trying one.
 
Let me know if you find a solution! My JRT is fab...most of the time...but has selective hearing.

What makes me giggle that , on returning from a walk sooner than he agrees to, I've been caught out many a time, having turned for home, to find he has planted himself, some fields back and has no intention of returning homewards unless I go and forcefully collect home.
 
I've had two JRTS with great recall so they can definitely do it :)

Been recommended the book Total Recall for our new pup so worth a try for training ideas?

Fiona
 
I have 2 terriers, dubious parentage, and once out and about I have absolutely no control over them. I do not let them off their leads around here, too many scents to follow. I can let them off at the beach but that's it. I had a terrier years ago and his recall was very good, but these 2 are something else - real lap dogs in doors but my God, when outside all they do is look to pick up a scent and follow it until they find their prey!!! Walks with them off lead were just too stressful.....
 
I teach recall with something that comes to call so walk with a friends dog that comes back and you will find your young dog will come back with it.
 
My terrier was an absolute nightmare until she lost one of her back legs, now she's a dream, follows at my heels and always hops back immediately.

The new terrier puppy is a nightmare, but does come back when I use the no nonsense 'car come back now' urgent tone, but I try to limit it in practice as don't want it to become less effective. Once they're on the scent it's hard to get them off.

So, in short, chop a leg off and you might find them more amenable!
 
My JRT had a great recall for the first 4 years of his life and then we moved to a property with a lot of trees and a lot of squirrels and he went bonkers! I had to go back to basics and long line him.

The basics include:
- the recall game: enclosed space, two people take it in turns to call the dog over a short distance, treat and call again. Repeat ad nauseum.
- super dooper treats for recall.
- jackpot treating
- two fingers under collar at every recall

Long line: attach a lightweight long line to the dog that is left to trail behind him. Use your lead as normal, let of lead, recall when you want. If he comes, praise, treat and release. If he does not come step on the line without saying anything, walk up to the dog stepping on the line all the way there, put a couple of fingers under the dog's collar and gently reverse back to where you were when the dog failed to recall, praise, treat and release. The line should be light weight enough so the dog forgets about it,me thinks he is free but as soon as you say "Dog come" you 'magically' have control of him when he though he was free.
 
I think you have to accept their limitations to a certain extent I'm afraid. My little terrier has fab recall provided there isn't a cat/ rabbits/ sheep etc. If there's anything she can chase she just goes deaf and there is no chance of me getting her! I'm just super vigilant on walks, keep her on the lead if we're going on tracks near people's gardens where there could be cats/ chickens etc. I'm getting a dog that doesn't have any terrier in next. They're challenging to say the least :D
 
Not impossible but very hard work. Training and more training. Long line is good for control initially but also what are they coming back for? Some love food but for others this is a pleasing thing over too quickly - chasing and running off = much more fun for longer. Try recall to a tuggy, favourite squeaky toy etc and when called and comes back play. Swing them round on the tug make noises and make yourself really fun. You have to be more fun than the thing they were chasing or were interested in when called them. A good leave command is also a good thing to teach, they then learn not to chase things but it doesn't always involve coming back to you and potentially being on a lead. My working Lakeland is 99% (I don't believe any dog to be perfect), wanders round chickens, sheep etc no problem. Does like to chase squirrels etc but will come when called so i let him have his fun when safe to do so.
 
Yup, my younger JRT comes back like a bullet to a whistle. I trained him by blowing the whistle and instantly treating him as he will sell his soul for food, now he knows he gets a treat when I whistle him (not always now but 75% of the time).
 
Kaylum said:
I teach recall with something that comes to call so walk with a friends dog that comes back and you will find your young dog will come back with it.
Click to expand...

If possible you can attach the dogs together, I did it with a friends JRT (who I now have lol!) and my collie dog and now the JRT has fairly reliable recall.
 
Its a dream most of the time! We have 4 PRT, dad is 99%, mum is 99%, mum and number 1 son together - no chance, number 2 son on his own brilliant, sons 1 & 2 eventually. I'm going to try the long line thing.
This is mainly with squirrels/rabbits/pheasants, but they never catch anything despite a lot of hunting, they're okay with hens surprisingly,
 
Kaylum said:
I teach recall with something that comes to call so walk with a friends dog that comes back and you will find your young dog will come back with it.
Click to expand...

I am glad it has worked for you but it does not for mine. He could not care less where his mates are. I remember standing on a hill with two lurchers who had come back when called while below in the valley the little so-and-so could be seen diving in and out of gorse bushes. Twenty minutes before he remembered our existence. Cue severely curtailed freedom in open spaces!
 
I sometimes think that ours know exactly where I am, as often if they don't come back when I call , I walk back home (we live 'off road') and as I turn onto the drive they appear from no-where!!
 
Our is a little devil, we took it to dog training and agility classes. Picked up all the tricks and lessons, got our obedience cert exam acting like a little angel. It would happy fly around the agility ring doing everything you asked and then just before we finished would ***** off under the fence of the the training ring and just disappear into a hedge for about 20 mins every time. It's a little git and the dog trainer people just shrugged and said 'terrier!'

The worst thing was that one of the tricks it leant was to sit back on its hind legs and wave its front paws up and down like its bowing. Little git realised everyone loved it and then we found it it was digging under the fence and going to the chipper up the road and doing its little trick outside the front door and people were giving it bits of food. It was delighted with itself.

the worse thing is it turns and gives a big guilty look before it runs off. so it knows its being bold. We have a retriever thats a big dopey thing, and it just doesn't have the same level of cunning or trying to get one over on you!
 
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I struggled with my Border Terrier x Springer Spaniel. He is obsessed with birds, I mean obsessed. He will spend every waking moment chasing them if he could. The only thing that worked for me was reprimanding him if he didn't immediately respond to recall. He loves his freedom, so the best thing for me was to short leash him and keep him behind me at all times when out walking, or when on the yard or farm, stick him in a locked pen while everyone else is out having fun. You have to be quick to recall him if he sees or smells a bird and always use the same word. For us a loud, sharp ahhhhtt works well. He then sheepishly comes back with his tail between his legs, even though our other dogs are off playing. He's just coming out of the puppy stage and things seem to be going very well.
 
You're fighting instinct with a terrier when recalling. Chasing and tugging games simulate this and would be your best bed to simulate the reward of catching a rabbit (for example). You could use this to reward a recall :) keep dog on lead in situations that could go wrong as every time they do you'll be reinforcing what you don't want
 
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