tetanus anti toxin and liver failure help needed

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louisegripton

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I shall be contacting my vet but I would just like to know if anyone else has had similar experience. Last June my mare had her foal and had a few complicaitons. Mare was given tetanus anti toxin few days after foal was born. Thought nothing more of it till few months down the line and she had scabs all over - vet said it was photosensitivity so took bloods just to check no liver damage (horse was well apart from scabby skin). Bloods cam back that liver v v bad and expec ther to die. She did not die and cam back into work well. Just this last month she has been lethargic and not herself so I thikn liver problem coming back. What I am wondering is if the anti toxin caused the liver problem and mare somehow beat it, is her liver damaged forever or can it regenerate after damage from the anti toxin? ANy experiences would be great!
 
We are off for a liver scan tomorrow (and biopsy if they find anything worth testing), we have a mare that has had liver problems. We have had an improvement in her condition which my vet does not understand and her ACT & Gamma GT (think i have it right) have halved although she has had lymphangitis (sp?) and been on antibiotics etc that the vet has considered will inhibit repair and perhaps even damage.

Anyway the liver has an amazing capacity to repair, which means if it has enough healthy cells there is a chance it can. We haven't told our vet that we also asked a healing friend to help and much as we are sceptic we can't rule out this helping too.

The best thing is probably to get her bloods tested to see if it is back and then try to get her back on track again. We are using Hepaticil (milk thistle and other herb stuff) echinacea and a very low protein diet. PM me if you want to know more about our case, we've discussed it in detail with our vet and have done a bit of research on it, athough not the anti toxin.
 
PM =Private message

I will let you know, we are quite anxious about it, more getting there in this weather and also as a biopsy is done via the chest past the lungs, but our vet has a lady from the Royal Vet college who locums for them and does the scans, so we will apparently have the best person to look at her.

We only found out the problem when she collapsed on the road with me on her
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, unfortunatley with most liver cases we have been told the symtoms only show when the liver is quite damaged, but to quote my vet "if there is an organ to damage its probably the one as it can repair whereas others don't!"

When we were doing our research we came across the anti toxin thing but have been advised that it is more likely to be ragwort or an infection - our mare had a foal 20 months ago and because of the late show of symptoms we can't tell either what caused it and it is unlikely we will ever find the true cause although unfortunately we can't rule out the ragwort
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How long have you had your mare dasiydaisy and do you know what her background was before you had her. Sadly, many horses have often had iffy care before (often years before) the current owner acquires them. Iffy care can often mean ragwort infested fields that the horse has to eat to stay alive. Ragwort is a cumulative poison, that is to say the horse can appear well for many years but the ragwort has damaged more and more liver. So any final trauma or additional demands on a liver that is struggling to cope can push it over the edge into liver failure. Livers do indeed have the most amazing powers of regeneration but NOT if the damage is caused by ragwort. The alkaloids in ragwort cause damage that the liver cannot recover from. Normally, signs of liver damage will not be visible until at least 70% of the liver is damaged. And at approx 76% and above, Prof Knottenbelt of Liverpool University advises is fatal to all horses.

It is possible that your mare was on the brink and the demands of carrying and feeding a foal were the last straw.

It is possible to pull a horse back from the brink as long as they have enough functioning liver to survive. To support a damaged liver and to give it the least amount of work possible, the horse needs a VERY low protein diet, but what protein they do have (all animals need some) must be of the very best quality. In addition, milk thistle supports the liver and Yea Sac aids hind gut digestion which is often compromised in such cases. It is also a mild appetite stimulant as one of the symptoms is loss of weight and appetite. Watch out also for depression, lack of interest in life, standing in corners, pressing thehead against the wall, jaundice, blindness and neurological problems.

Having said all this, an "ordinary" liver infection would give the same early symptoms but the horse can recover from this. Sadly, the only way to tell whether a horse's liver is damaged due to infection or due to ragwort poisoning is to biopsy the liver. Even then, it is difficult to know what % remains functioning. The Prof and his team are working on a reliable test but lack of funding has halted the work. If you e-mail the Prof (world expert in liver damage in horses) he always tries to help ordinary horse owners. His e-mail is knotty@liverpool.ac.uk

Very best of luck and do let us know how she does xxx

PS: my rescued mare Angel was 24hrs from being pts from ragwort poisoning. Tragic, tragic story. But we pulled her back from the brink and she is now happy and healthy and backed and FULLY INSURED as her bile salts are back within normal range. Miracles do happen. The Prof and D&H helped save Angel. Marvellous, caring people.
 
if you need any help please pm me i had a horse with liver diease dash faliure i can help with medication surportives and diet of only my knowledge and what went on with my pony!
 
from my post above i am no vet but i can give my exspersenices and help if i can. thanks for your vote of honesty favour. i have pm you hope all things go well with your pony speak soon!xx
 
I promised to come back and give you an update about the scan, we didn't do the biopsy and the vet is very pleased with her progress, she puts it down to low protein diet, hepatacyl and the supportive drugs she has been on. We are hopeful for a good recovery.

It looks as our horse has no legions on the liver it is unlikely to be ragwort, therefore there has to be another cause. She is a specialist in this area with the RVC and was suprised that there wasn't even any shrinkage which is quite normal (apparently) in older horses.

She also re-confirmed that the liver is the only organ that can be damaged and regenerate, therefore there is always hope.

I hope you get a chance to get yours tested to see what level of damage there is and to what, then to get her on the right diet and suppliments to support her repair.

Let me know how you get on and if I can be of any help

L
xx
 
WOW had more bloods taken today. Everything back to normal ranges!!! Last year her G something counts were over 2000 they should be under 87! Today they are 59. I'm am so thrilled after months of worrying.

When she was first given the grim outlook last year I put her on supplement from the vets which had milk thistle in it. She had a few months off then worked in walk for about a month before prgressing onto trot and a bit of jumping.
I have no secret as to the management that has done this. She has Top Spec Comprehensive feed supplement, again no idea if this has helped?? Normal chaff, sugar beet and a few oats. No other additives or supplements not even from the vets after the initial supplement ran out.


What an amazing horse!!
 
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