The sacked horse hitting ex teacher is going to court

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Pearlsasinger

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That's purely your interpretation.

Why do you think she lost her job then? Lets hear your explanation.
Of course I knew the outcomes to the meetings I attended. What a ridiculous thing to say.

You knew the outcome of the meetings that you were the minute taker for but you were not apprised of the outcome of the disciplinary processes that the employees were subject to, as that was not part of your role.


As a matter of interest, do you now consider yourself to be able to design buidlings,or do the job of a quantity surveyor?
 

Arzada

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The Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals had no choice but to take action. What message would it have sent to animal abusers if they had done nothing?

The fact that you may have seen worse abuse doesn't make what she did any better.
In this case then I'd suggest that it is time that the RSPCA set up an online reporting site so that any of us can film and submit footage and they can get on with prosecuting all offenders. In the meantime we could upload the same footage to eg YouTube, Facebook, Twitter to generate the social media uprising which is clearly essential to the RSPCA decision to go to court because apparently they have to be seen to take action. Interestingly dashcam footage of road traffic offences/dangerous situations submitted to the Police should not be uploaded to social media before the outcome is known in order not to prejudice any case.
 

dorsetladette

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No they just want soft targets.

I reported 2 starved horses to them, they were skeletal and there was a pony who had died of starvation in the same field.
My Vet said it was one of the worst cases he had seen (i called him because they were loose on the road so i herded them into my stables)

The horses and my vet were both in my stables when the RSPCA inspector turned up. Inspector decided they knew more that the vet and there was no evidence of starvation.
Refused to do anything about it.

I've had similar. A dozen starving ponies in an acres or less with no shelter/ hay etc only an automatic water trough. on our track on the way in to our field. Reported numerous times to RSPCA, they come and look put a note on the gate and do no more. A laminitic pony in our field comes down with an abscess over night, poulticed and farrier contacted. They were on the phone that same afternoon demanding a vet attend in their presence due to reports of neglect. My vet pointed out that we had done the correct thing and confirmed pony was prone to foot problems but was improving since being in our care. Vet also pointed out the ponies in the field on the lane and inspector dismissed the vets comments as 'they had already investigated those ponies and found no issues' - not long after this (2 months maybe) a pony in that field went down and we couldn't get it up, it was put to sleep and a small charity ended up taking the rest. Really sad and never needed to happen.

I don't condone what the woman did, but RSPCA are just going for low hanging fruit.
 

mini_b

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These are the 2 offences …

Moulds caused ‘unnecessary suffering’ to Bruce by ‘kicking and hitting’ him.

She also did not take reasonable steps to ‘protect the animal from pain, suffering, injury or disease’

the amount of footage we have seen from notorious, even prolific horse abusers - I think should be sent to the paper as well then!
RSPCA not prosecuting Harry Evans is a f*cking joke considering the above.

honestly it absolutely sickens me - trial by social media or what.

i don’t have twitter but someone should tweet the RSPCA with a link to Harry’s videos (if they are around still!) and ask if they are going to act on this as well?
 

Birker2020

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You knew the outcome of the meetings that you were the minute taker for but you were not apprised of the outcome of the disciplinary processes that the employees were subject to, as that was not part of your role.


As a matter of interest, do you now consider yourself to be able to design buidlings,or do the job of a quantity surveyor?
why you feel the need to constantly ridicule, oppose and undermine me over and over again says more about you than me.
 

honetpot

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how fascinating that what she did has generated lots of posts, while mule`s thread about bloodying of 4 years olds mouths in competing and training, which i find utterly shocking has so few responses

funny old place the horse world

and i don`t like what she did, the worst part is the fact the pony did nothing wrong, from what i saw of the video

whilst realizing this thread is about does the punishment fit the crime
I didn't look because I am so fed up with sticking an extra gadget or a bit of metal in or on a horse, unfortunately seems to be normal. It's prolonged exposure to pain or discomfort, which it can not evade in the name of training, or sport.
In this case, you could see on video what ever harm was caused. When you look at a picture of say the 17thC and 18thC, you used to think we wouldn't use that bit or spurs, now I just think if they could get away with it, they would.
 

Fellewell

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They're making an example of her because the story went viral. That said, I don't know what they think the case will achieve?
The story went viral because they were desperate to link it to hunting (legal trail hunting at that). Ricky Gervais retweeted the video to his 14 million followers and Chris Packham in his role as vice president of the RSPCA ordered them to act on it.
 

YorksG

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The story went viral because they were desperate to link it to hunting (legal trail hunting at that). Ricky Gervais retweeted the video to his 14 million followers and Chris Packham in his role as vice president of the RSPCA ordered them to act on it.
If that is Packhams role within the organisation, then his statement about tweeting the video to get the rspcas attention, was disingenuous at best, a downright lie at worst.
 

dorsetladette

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The story went viral because they were desperate to link it to hunting (legal trail hunting at that). Ricky Gervais retweeted the video to his 14 million followers and Chris Packham in his role as vice president of the RSPCA ordered them to act on it.
And we all know how much Chris Packham loves hunting and horses/ponies in general. Wasn't long ago that he was campaigning to remove all the new forest ponies from the forest.
 

sunnyone

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Ok here's here's my two pennorth. I think I see both sides of the argument for and against hunting, but I have no sympathy for this person. The Cottesmore did the right thing by getting rid of her asap as the legal sport of hunting currently has a bad reputation in the public eye.
However,

1. How come the incident was filmed by the Sabs? Balance of probabilités leads me to think they were aware that something similar might just happen because it's happened before. Well done them for being in the right place at the right time.

2. The RSPCA might have been awaiting evidence to allow them to deter others from simply thinking they could get away with mistreatment. Presumably the police rejected taking any action.

3. A criminal conviction has to be declared in job applications, would you want her to be able to work with animals/children / vulnerable adults? Without a formal record she could do.

4. Her actions brought her own professional behavioural standards (teaching) into question as well as sullying the school's reputation. Hence after investigation she was dismissed, but may still be a "qualified teacher" due to no criminal record.
If somebody cannot control their frustrations then they have no place being in a position of a trust.
 

lannerch

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how fascinating that what she did has generated lots of posts, while mule`s thread about bloodying of 4 years olds mouths in competing and training, which i find utterly shocking has so few responses

funny old place the horse world

and i don`t like what she did, the worst part is the fact the pony did nothing wrong, from what i saw of the video

whilst realizing this thread is about does the punishment fit the crime
I saw mules friend and it was shocking especially as I know mule is brilliant at bringing on youngsters and whose opinion I value. The lack of responses compared to this thread is also got a lot to do with the fact that mule posted in the competition forum which does not have the footfall of here.
 

Birker2020

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Ok here's here's my two pennorth. I think I see both sides of the argument for and against hunting, but I have no sympathy for this person. The Cottesmore did the right thing by getting rid of her asap as the legal sport of hunting currently has a bad reputation in the public eye.
However,

1. How come the incident was filmed by the Sabs? Balance of probabilités leads me to think they were aware that something similar might just happen because it's happened before. Well done them for being in the right place at the right time.

2. The RSPCA might have been awaiting evidence to allow them to deter others from simply thinking they could get away with mistreatment. Presumably the police rejected taking any action.

3. A criminal conviction has to be declared in job applications, would you want her to be able to work with animals/children / vulnerable adults? Without a formal record she could do.

4. Her actions brought her own professional behavioural standards (teaching) into question as well as sullying the school's reputation. Hence after investigation she was dismissed, but may still be a "qualified teacher" due to no criminal record.
If somebody cannot control their frustrations then they have no place being in a position of a trust.
100% on all this
 

Gallop_Away

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1. How come the incident was filmed by the Sabs? Balance of probabilités leads me to think they were aware that something similar might just happen because it's happened before. Well done them for being in the right place at the right time.
Or very convenient depending on how you look at it......
 

ycbm

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1. How come the incident was filmed by the Sabs?
They film constantly when they are out otherwise they get accused of being violent and breaking the law themselves and can also be the victim of nasty assaults.

Some sabs also behave very badly, but there is nothing sinister about them having singled her out to film. She just happened to be there.
.
 

conniegirl

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Or very convenient depending on how you look at it......
Or they wound her up to the point she just wanted to get out of there and get her children safe and away from any potential blow up as fast as physically possible, the pony getting loose may well have been the final straw. Fear makes people do strange and uncharacteristic things.

I don’t condone what she did however i do think the punishment is disproportionate.

It would be like being slightly over the limit but instead of getting a speed awareness course you lose your licence, get locked up, lose everything you have and your family get dragged into it to.
 

Gallop_Away

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They film constantly when they are out otherwise they get accused of being violent and breaking the law themselves and can also be the victim of nasty assaults.

Some sabs also behave very badly, but there is nothing sinister about them having singled her out to film. She just happened to be there.
.
Sorry but I must disagree with you there. Sabs film as an intimidation tactic. They were focused on her and her children before anything kicked off with the horse.
I've experienced first hand how they will try and intimidate and wind people up to get a reaction. Then conveniently have recording equipment on them when they get the reaction they seek.
If they simply submitted the footage to the authorities for investigation that would be one thing but no its plastered all over social media for their gaggle of baying followers to rip to shreds. Images of children and all.
I'm not condoning what she did towards the pony, but if there was a bunch of masked randomers filming my kids I would want to load up and get the hell out of there as quickly as I could to.
 

Gallop_Away

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Or they wound her up to the point she just wanted to get out of there and get her children safe and away from any potential blow up as fast as physically possible, the pony getting loose may well have been the final straw. Fear makes people do strange and uncharacteristic things.

I don’t condone what she did however i do think the punishment is disproportionate.

It would be like being slightly over the limit but instead of getting a speed awareness course you lose your licence, get locked up, lose everything you have and your family get dragged into it to.
My thoughts exactly conniegirl
 

smolmaus

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If she had lost her temper and slapped a person (let's say a big fella who is more than capable of defending himself and took no real hurt) would people still give her the "oh but she might have had a really bad day" excuse? Of course not.

I said to myself I wouldn't comment on this again but the extents to which people will stretch to excuse or mitigate her behaviour is still wild 😂
I'm not condoning what she did towards the pony, but if there was a bunch of masked randomers filming my kids I would want to load up and get the hell out of there as quickly as I could to.
Would you make sure and take the time to punch and kick your horse before you left though? (Of course you wouldn't!)
 

ycbm

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Sorry but I must disagree with you there. Sabs film as an intimidation tactic. They were focused on her and her children before anything kicked off with the horse.
I've experienced first hand how they will try and intimidate and wind people up to get a reaction. Then conveniently have recording equipment on them when they get the reaction they seek.
If they simply submitted the footage to the authorities for investigation that would be one thing but no its plastered all over social media for their gaggle of baying followers to rip to shreds. Images of children and all.
I'm not condoning what she did towards the pony, but if there was a bunch of masked randomers filming my kids I would want to load up and get the hell out of there as quickly as I could to.

I think it's more important to argue against the point I was arguing against. The post I responded to was making a strong suggestion that she was being filmed because the people filming knew that she was in the habit of hitting ponies.

I think that suggestion is probably libellous and certainly unfounded.
.
 

ycbm

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If she had lost her temper and slapped a person (let's say a big fella who is more than capable of defending himself and took no real hurt) would people still give her the "oh but she might have had a really bad day" excuse? Of course not.

The law would. Provocation is a recognised mitigation in sentencing for assault.
.
 

Gallop_Away

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If she had lost her temper and slapped a person (let's say a big fella who is more than capable of defending himself and took no real hurt) would people still give her the "oh but she might have had a really bad day" excuse? Of course not.

I said to myself I wouldn't comment on this again but the extents to which people will stretch to excuse or mitigate her behaviour is still wild 😂

Would you make sure and take the time to punch and kick your horse before you left though? (Of course you wouldn't!)
I say in the post that you quoted that I do not condone her actions but people make mistakes. I don’t think the punishment fits the crime.
 

laura_nash

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It would be like being slightly over the limit but instead of getting a speed awareness course you lose your licence, get locked up, lose everything you have and your family get dragged into it to.
More like being a bit over the alcohol limit or driving tired and being unlucky enough to cause something dreadful. Lots of people do it and get away with it, but wrong place and wrong time means you pay 100x worse for the same action. Unfortunate but life isn't fair. Shouldn't have done it in the first place.
 

Gallop_Away

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I think it's more important to argue against the point I was arguing against. The post I responded to was making a strong suggestion that she was being filmed because the people filming knew that she was in the habit of hitting ponies.

I think that suggestion is probably libellous and certainly unfounded.
.
Now that is a very good point.....
 

smolmaus

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The law would. Provocation is a recognised mitigation in sentencing for assault.
.
Well in this hypothetical the slapped man did as much to "provoke" as the horse did, which is to be vaguely in the wrong place. I don't see a court taking too much time over that.
I say in the post that you quoted that I do not condone her actions but people make mistakes. I don’t think the punishment fits the crime.
The excuse of her being scared or frightened that you seem to be giving credence to is implausible based on her behaviour, is what I was trying to point out.
 

YorksG

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Well in this hypothetical the slapped man did as much to "provoke" as the horse did, which is to be vaguely in the wrong place. I don't see a court taking too much time over that.

The excuse of her being scared or frightened that you seem to be giving credence to is implausible based on her behaviour, is what I was trying to point out.
So do you agree with the vilification, on social media, the interest by main stream media, the total disruption of her life and that of her family? Do you believe that the reaction is proportionate?
 

Gallop_Away

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Well in this hypothetical the slapped man did as much to "provoke" as the horse did, which is to be vaguely in the wrong place. I don't see a court taking too much time over that.

The excuse of her being scared or frightened that you seem to be giving credence to is implausible based on her behaviour, is what I was trying to point out.
How is it implausible exactly?...how can you say how people will react under stress?

Again I am not condoning her actions. Yes it was wrong and should have resulted in a ban from the hunt and pony club....but to have her face and her children's faces plastered all over social media, her place of work named, to loose her job, be hounded on social media and the press, and now to face prosecution!? That goes way beyond her offence in my opinion.
 

smolmaus

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So do you agree with the vilification, on social media, the interest by main stream media, the total disruption of her life and that of her family? Do you believe that the reaction is proportionate?
I don't think I have ever said that.

I think the only comment I have made on the subject was that if it hadn't been made available publicly that it probably would have been swept under the rug entirely which is also not the correct outcome in my opinion. I am not going to answer for the behaviour of lunatics who like to chuck abuse at people on twitter as that has absolutely zero to do with me. It isn't a binary choice between thinking she should maybe be allowed to hit her horses if she is stressed vs getting the torches and pitchforks out.
 

smolmaus

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How is it implausible exactly?...how can you say how people will react under stress?

Again I am not condoning her actions. Yes it was wrong and should have resulted in a ban from the hunt and pony club....but to have her face and her children's faces plastered all over social media, her place of work named, to loose her job, be hounded on social media and the press, and now to face prosecution!? That goes way beyond her offence in my opinion.
If (and it's a big IF made up on the previous thread) she was afraid for her children being filmed I just don't think a reasonable person would a) give the sabs something to look at and report or b) take up time punching her horse when it would have been quicker to just load him herself. I just don't find that plausible, therefore the mitigating excuse of "the sabs made her do it by being there" doesn't hold any water with me.
 
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