The start of Lami??

eekmon

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I have a 30 year old TB x Polish Arab not fat but his neck is a bit cresty and quite hard. Fed 16+ cubes, veteran chaff, TopSpec balancer and sugarbeet.On haylage but have got hay coming on sat, which will be soaked. Turned out 4 days a week on not too good grazing. Ridden 4-5 days a week 1-2 hours a time. Have taken him off sugarbeet today. Should I be worried, it could be the start of lami? Got vet in yard on Thurs so will get him to take a look. Wondering what you guys think,do I need to take a bit more action eg feed ect.
 

bensababy

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speaking from having had a Lammi pony - a cresty neck is one sign of the onset of Lammi, its difficult to say really unless we can see him, good idea removing the sugarbeet and soaking hay, untill the vet comes its hard to say, have you checked the digital pulse do his feet feel hotter than normal?
 

eekmon

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Yes, he has no pulse and feet feel normal ( warmth ) Rode him today and he was as bright as a button. Just a bit worried as he is 30. One of the horses I do has cushings related lami so never got any 'real' lami signs( weight, cresty neck ect) Is it an age thing, as he is not fat ?
 

Fairynuff

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A 'cresty ' neck is NOT a sign of laminitis, nor is it Cushing related! Cresty necks are either due to male hormones(stallions or cut late) or obesity. Cushing related laminitis has the classical symptoms of laminitis however its been triggered off! Try googling laminitis. Mairi.
 

filly190

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I would reduce the haylage, this can be a cause, as you mentioned you have hay coming and limited grass. I would also be tempted to drop the sugar beet.

Best to nip this one in the bud, may sound dramstic actions, but I would rather turn out 24/7 on poorer grazing with no feed and see how the horse gets on, than risk lami
 

TURBOBERT

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Change to Speedibeet. Non Mollassed and recommended by the Laminitis Society/Trust. It gives bulk without many calories. Then how about Baileys Lo Cal balancer to go with it - and hay - not haylege.
 

Chex

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Just what I was going to say - keep the sugarbeet as long as its unmollassed. I would probably stop the 16+, I imagine its full of sugar. My pony has quite a cresty neck, despite not being that fat, and I'm going to get him tested for cushings and EMS (cresty neck is a sign of EMS I think)
 

amandaco2

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cresty necks are a sign of being over weight or full of testosterone.
being overweight can increase the chances of getting lami.
cushing horses (can have uneven fat distribution such as crests or around the eyes) which makes them more likely to get lami.
 

eekmon

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Had vet today, hes got to eat just high fibre cubes, restricted grazing and soaked hay. Got to keep a close eye as it could be the start of lami! Even though hes not fat got to slim him down a bit more and keep him excersising .Thanks for all replies
 

MagicMelon

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Cresty necks arent always a sign of laminitis. Ive had a pony who went down with serious laminitis years ago - he was never even overweight and certainly didnt have a cresty neck. Now he does have a crest but he's 20 so I believe its due to age (he's slim). So that cant be used as a sign.

Definately restrict the grazing, that IS your first point of call! Vet knows what he's talking about
 

bensababy

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[ QUOTE ]
A 'cresty ' neck is NOT a sign of laminitis, nor is it Cushing related! Cresty necks are either due to male hormones(stallions or cut late) or obesity. Cushing related laminitis has the classical symptoms of laminitis however its been triggered off! Try googling laminitis. Mairi.


[/ QUOTE ]

Have to disagree with you unless my vet is wrong!? my pony wasnt obese (wasnt even over weight) and he wasnt a stallion and he developed a cresty neck before he got Lammi - and even to this day when he looks like hes heading in that direction his crest pufss up... each case is different - you cant say Lammis dont get it.. my pony is living proof.
 

bensababy

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sorry to be a "told you so" kind of person but please see symptoms below and link to website i took it from;

Chronic Laminitis Symptoms Include:
Rings in hoof wall (in accordance w/ other symptoms)
Bruised soles
Chronic abscesses, wide white line or seedy toe
Dropped and flat soles
Thick cresty neck
Dished hooves even when properly maintained. The "ski" look


http://www.smartpakequine.com/laminitis.aspx
 

eekmon

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[ QUOTE ]


Have to disagree with you unless my vet is wrong!? my pony wasnt obese (wasnt even over weight) and he wasnt a stallion and he developed a cresty neck before he got Lammi - and even to this day when he looks like hes heading in that direction his crest pufss up... each case is different - you cant say Lammis dont get it.. my pony is living proof.

[/ QUOTE ]

This is exactly what has happened to me, my horse is not fat at all, but will have to be careful in the future.
 

Tia

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Well to be fair bensababy; you are describing chronic laminitis. Acute laminitis, which is what this horse may or may not have, is the condition being discussed I would say. In the acute phase a cresty neck is definitely NOT one of the symptoms.
 

bensababy

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Tia, thats fair enough - you can never be too cautious with Lammi - my boy had the chronic lammi which happened overnight (due to some idiot thinking it was ok to feed him grass cuttings!) im just describing what my pony was like.
 

Tia

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See with my pony, she came down with acute laminitis; no cresty neck, quite slim and in good physical fitness. Same thing are you though; well meaning caretaker fed her incorrectly and bang!

Anyway my pony subsequently developed chronic laminitis before we could make it back to England and she almost died. Thankfully with a very understanding vet and a lot of care, she recovered and is now out here with us in Canada. At no time did she develop a cresty neck though; such is the weirdness of this condition eh?
 

bensababy

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yep mine was in the peak of his condition - only 5 years old - just started successfuly showing him, could have killed the person that fed him grass cuttings

It is weird - but i suppose every horse is different - i didnt have much luck with his recovery - due to a bad farrier and even worse vet - they screwed me for all my insurance trying to get him right - and continued to hinder his recovery, i got a second opinion and it was the best thing i ever done!

How has your pony recovered from this? Is she as normal as she was before?
 

Tia

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Well she came down with it full blown in all 4 feet way back in Spring of 2004. Poor little soul apparently couldn't even walk. I had a terrible time with trying to get the carer to do as I was asking but eventually she moved her to a stable but on the way the pony collapsed in the middle of the lane and had to be carried by loads of big burly blokes into the stable. The moment I heard that I frantically phoned a friend of mine to ask her to take over the care of Cloud until I got a flight back to England. The vet was booked in to come and put her to sleep about 2 hours after our arrival back in England...anyway cut a long story short we felt that Cloud was a fighter so we gave her every chance in the world to recover. She did, actually quite quickly aswell gauging by other peoples recollections of their experiences of laminitis. By the end of the summer she was sound, although her feet were somewhat distorted; the soles were hanging off the bottom of her 2 front feet.

I had her re-x-rayed just before flying her out here to Canada in December 2004 and her pedal bone rotation had amazingly rotated back to it's position.

We've owned Cloud for 10 years and she has never had it before and has never had it since living out here. She has been turned out 24/7 ever since arriving in Canada and not once shown any signs of a relapse. Her feet recovered totally and now when you look at them they look completely normal - the soles became sucked back up and she has no ridges or boxy feet. She just had a foal almost 7 weeks ago, still no signs; she's flown half way around the world and no signs......so I can only put this down to being a totally freak accident....a one off!

The trigger was found however - she had been fed 2 bags of coarse mix over a period of 10 days and this was the most likely explanation for it. Bet she loved it though as she's never been fed coarse mix in her life....but boy did she pay for it dearly.

How about your guy? Did he recover fully in the end? I have to say my vet and farrier were absolutely terrific throughout the whole thing. VERY very supportive of all the (perhaps) weird things that I tried with Cloud and both were totally blown away by her full recovery. I went the whole hog also and blew all of her insurance money on sorting her out; didn't make much difference as I knew I was moving and wouldn't be able to claim again in Cloud's lifetime, so I went all out and did everything possible.

Anyway it was a happy ending for me...but I have to say when I read any posts about laminitis my heart always always sinks and I feel dreadful sadness for the person and horse having to cope with this condition. I'd never wish it on anyone or any horse.
 

bensababy

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Crikey i thought i had it bad glad to hear your mare has recovered!!.

Well i have had my New forest pony for 13 years now (got him wild off the forest at 8months old), where i used to keep him he was out during day and in at night, the next door neighbour decided to empty his lawn mower over the horses field - and of course being piglets they ate it... i bought him in that night (not knowing about the cuttings) and he looked very bloated and that was when i noticed his fat crest, put him in with just a slice of hay, got up the next morning and he was absolutely crippled.... my old farrier put amerian styled shoes on him (frog and sole supports) but where he never fitted them correctly they caused a split in his foot (which they thought was the pedal bone breaking through)... mad panic straight to vets and he had his toes bled.... after 6 months with no improvement i asked for a 2nd opinion and they took all shoes off and left him barefoot and had his feet trimmed/reshaped every 4 weeks... it took my farrier and vet 2months to have him sound..... so it was nearly a year he was out for.

There are certain things which he struggles with - uneven ground etc (even with shoes on) but hes now back to his best as is out on loan to a young girl who is riding him western now and hes loving it.

i would not wish this upon anyone.
 

Tia

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Eek! Yours sound waaay worse than mine...perhaps it's all subjective though. The biggest overall feeling I remember about laminitis is the fear factor; the worry, the upset, the horror and uncertainty of it all; that's why I get all cold when I read the word nowadays. I don't think you are really aware of how much it deeply affects you until after the event though, thankfully.

I hope your little guy does recover totally from it though. It's a nice feeling to be able to somewhat relax, however I do still check Cloud on a very regular basis.

She is unshod also and we live in hilly terrain and no she's never felt even a slightly bit "footy". She is totally sound and completely back to how she always was, in ever respect. So I really think she did get off lightly, certainly in the long run.

Best wishes to you - onwards and upwards eh?
 
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