Thermal Imaging - any recommendations?

wench

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Didn't think vets tend to use thermal imaging?

Theres a few about, one in Lincoln, one near stafford and one based near nottingham
 

wench

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Bet it's cheaper to get someone else apart from a vet to do it :) I had the whole of my horse done for £85
 

philamena

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Yeh probably - as with most things eh?!
Though having said that, my vet charges about £65 for the body, back and neck so you'd only need to add leg views on, so hopefully not horrifically more expensive. (I was quite surprised to be honest...)
 

dressage_diva

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Sync Thermology:

www.syncthermology.co.uk

Only UK company who use medical grade thermal imaging equipment and who have specialist trained vets who analyse and diagnose from the thermal images. They work in conjunction with your vets and it is covered by many insurance companies if your vets refer you.
 

smac

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i discussed this subject with my vet last week as I was interested for one of mine. Vet has used it in run up to the Sydney Olympics. She said that for a true picture the horse had to be in a temperature controlled room for 24hrs, if you travelled the horse it was nul and void, bandages rugs etc would all make the reading null and void.

She said it was useful for saddle fittings, and good if bruised sole with an over sensitve reaction- to pin point exact location to dig. But that too many factors have to be right. She said often good for producing a picture but not for definate readings? and better off going down bone scan/mri route

How do the freelance people that come out do all set up etc to ensure try readings?
 

philamena

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The OP is looking for something to indicate possible areas on the body for further investigation on an already long road under treatment... So exactly the kind of thing it can be useful for, rather than being a sole diagnostic :)
 

smac

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Sorry, i wasnt atacking or anything, I am just interested as Im keen to have one of my horses looked at- and vet response was not too inspiring. so I was just wondering, how they deal with the factors? If you box the horse do you have to wait a few hours?! Do you leave the horse? what happens when they come to you?
 

Pidgeon

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Clare from the Inner Picture very good Mrs M. She comes to you and need horse to be naked for a while before and no grooming etc. Had good results with ours.
 

philamena

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Hi smac, if you want to try it I really would. My vets use it, and they know well that some vets look down their noses at it... But they, I and several people I know have had really useful results out of it. I think it depends what you are hoping for from it. It's about highlighting areas that are hurt or attempting to heal, rather than telling you exactly what the injury or problem is
 

MrsMozart

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Thank you folks :)

Aye, we just want to use it as an indicator of any other areas that
might be causing the problem. That website explains very well what one needs to do :)

I rang the vet today but just got a sort of 'hold on' message combined with a fax machine noise, so will try again tomorrow. Not been well today, added to the emerald stress about GM and other things and all is a bit pah. She's lost a shoe (the off-fore) - I need to know if I should try and get my farrier to replace it or wait 'till we get back to Oakham, which should be 10th Jan.

GM is lame in a straight line now - noticeable in walk (2/10) and definite in trot (7/10). I'm hoping it's because of the lost shoe. It's three weeks today since the Tildren.

We've a bark all-weather area now, so should be able to get a video and decent pictures. It's been delayed as we've been shifting a huge muck heap, clearing crap (thanks previous people!), and spreading bark, so the horses have somewhere to go (fields flooded). D1 says she can get vids onto YouTube.
 

philamena

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Sorry on phone and posted too soon! We've used it to highlight general areas of back and neck that are the source of general back pain etc (more successfully than chiro or physio, who found the areas suffering as a consequence but not the root problem) and this broader brush stuff is probably easier. I can see if you wanted very precise pics pinpointing precise small problems in a leg for example you'd want to be careful about aclimatising, but for highlighting areas to look at further, and with experienced analysis, it's definitely useful. But the kind of image you get when thete's an acute problem is quite easily.distinguishable from a horse that's generally hotter or colder than usual because of ambient temp: it's about hot or cold spots which are often v defined. I would agree that trying to make it the solution to very detailed diagnosis imagining completely neutral conditions is probably stretching it a bit, and perhaps this is what some vets are expecting when they're dismissive of it. It won't diagnose like other "scans" do, but once you know and accept what.it's usefues! uses!ddiagnose like diagnose
 

Tonks

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Think it's a useful tool when used in combination with OTHER diagnosic tools.

The conditions have to be exactly controlled and even then, a thermographic image can produce 'positive negatives' and 'negative positives'.

Not only this, but you are in the hands of the interpreter who is only as good as his interpretation/diagnostic skills.

If used alone, I don't think you should rely on it as giving a definitive diagnosis. But, as previous poster stated, it could be a starting point.

Nonetheless, best of luck and we try anything to get to the bottom of these things.
 
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philamena

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Sorry on phone and posted too soon! We've used it to highlight general areas of back and neck that are the source of general back pain etc (more successfully than chiro or physio, who found the areas suffering as a consequence but not the root problem) and this broader brush stuff is probably easier. I can see if you wanted very precise pics pinpointing precise small problems in a leg for example you'd want to be careful about aclimatising, but for highlighting areas to look at further, and with experienced analysis, it's definitely useful. But the kind of image you get when thete's an acute problem is quite easily.distinguishable from a horse that's generally hotter or colder than usual because of ambient temp: it's about hot or cold spots which are often v defined. I would agree that trying to make it the solution to very detailed diagnosis imagining completely neutral conditions is probably stretching it a bit, and perhaps this is what some vets are expecting when they're dismissive of it. It won't diagnose like other "scans" do, but once you know and accept what.it's usefues! uses!ddiagnose like diagnose
 

kezimac

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Have used inner picture but the images aren't great when you compare to a medical grade picture - I had equiscan - their image is then sent to a vet to translate - basically I had two scans done in 2011 by inner picture she uses a camera designed for building sites - and although a spot on my horses back And said not the worst she had seen and not to worry - fast forward 3 month had a scan by equiscan and they basically said investigate for kissing spines and the images were very clear - took her to specialist and had 9 impinging processes.
 

Tiffany

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Have used inner picture but the images aren't great when you compare to a medical grade picture - I had equiscan - their image is then sent to a vet to translate - basically I had two scans done in 2011 by inner picture she uses a camera designed for building sites - and although a spot on my horses back And said not the worst she had seen and not to worry - fast forward 3 month had a scan by equiscan and they basically said investigate for kissing spines and the images were very clear - took her to specialist and had 9 impinging processes.

I don't think anyone can please everyone and it is down to interpretation at the end of the day, all I can say is Clare's images were clear enough for the vet to investigate further and find the route of the problem. I've also used her since to check if more changes are taking place.

Pleased you found out what the problem was with your horse.
 

Pidgeon

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Well Clares images were clear enough to show a very small white hot spot on Pidges hock when he wasn't quite right. I'd already spoken to vets and when I told them this they booked him in, xrayed and injected again as it was another spavin. These are useful tools when used in conjunction with your vets. Clare does not diagnose she is not a vet, its used to show where there is excessive heat or lack of and then its the vets who investigate further and treat. Mrs M search this on here as sure I posted some scan pics ages ago. Leave the diagnosis to the vets IMO but use this to help pinpoint where there is a problem associated with heat or lack of heat.
 

CrazyMare

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I used Claire at The Inner Picture too, gave us a good idea about what was going on after 8 nerve blocks hadn't shown any improvement!
 

Pidgeon

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Example of one of the scans
TH770161-1.jpg
 

dressage_diva

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Have used inner picture but the images aren't great when you compare to a medical grade picture - I had equiscan - their image is then sent to a vet to translate - basically I had two scans done in 2011 by inner picture she uses a camera designed for building sites - and although a spot on my horses back And said not the worst she had seen and not to worry - fast forward 3 month had a scan by equiscan and they basically said investigate for kissing spines and the images were very clear - took her to specialist and had 9 impinging processes.

FTR Equiscan have now been rebranded as SyncThermology (ST) - www.syncthermology.co.uk

As Kezimac says, ST uses medical grade equipment (same as used in NHS and by private healthcare professionals, like BUPA) and they have trained vets who analyse the images. Interpreting thermal images is not as easy as just identifying hot spots. Also bear in mind that as thermal imaging is a diagnostic tool, it should only be interpreted by a trained veterinary professional (it is illegal for anyone who is not a vet to diagnose an injury/illness in any animal).

If anyone is interested in learning more about thermal imaging and reads Your Horse magazine, there will be an article about it in the next issue (possibly coming out today?).
 
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