This saddle is too narrow - right?

[Christmas Crumpet]

Haven't done up girth but took a few pics of saddle on ponies back. Have also taken a pic of underneath of her numnah which shows uneven pressure - black patches at the front where saddle is pinching. Thoughts please.

We are going to saddler next week and saddle should be going back to saddlers to get tree amended. I am not riding in it - we are bareback at the moment!! I know horse has been on holiday and is a bit pudgy but I am of the opinion that the tree of saddle is def. too narrow for her.

She was turning in body pic hence looking wonky but wanted to show her wither and shape which I think is at least a wide!!

 

[Shysmum]

nope, that does not fit at all. x

 

[Christmas Crumpet]

You agree its def. too narrow?!!!

 

[Clava]

Way too narrow.

 

[Christmas Crumpet]

Does anyone else have any thoughts? I am glad its not just me - it is def. too narrow. It was fitted by a saddler in Jan when horse was hunting fit but I was never quite convinced by its fit. There is no way that despite pony having holiday for 2.5 months, she would have changed shape that much. Obviously never fitted properly in the first place. Horse never really made a fuss although looking back there were signs. I am afraid I was slightly vacant at the time having just had a baby. I did have the physio out to give pony an MOT and she said there was nothing to note painwise which is good but she wasn't convinced by fit either. Horse had injured herself by then so no more riding.

It will be interesting to see what the saddler has to say for themselves...!! Ugh I hate saddles.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

A 2.5mths holiday could easily lead to a dramatic change in width of saddle needed. If it was fitted 6mths ago to a fit horse I don't really see how you have any come back against the saddler now. If you were unhappy in the beginning you should have complained then. Is it a saddle that can be adjusted?

 

[BigRed]

I bought a horse that was very unfit. her saddle was reflocked every quarter for the first year as she continually changed shape and became more muscular. You can't blame a saddler for the saddle fitting in winter/spring and not fitting in the summer.

 

[9tails]

I'd suggest that the tree is too flat, leading to it bridging. There seems to be no pressure between the pommel and cantle as shown on the numnah. If she was hunting fit and now isn't, she may have dropped a fair amount of topline.

 

[Wagtail]

The pommel is too high and from the marks on her saddle cloth, it looks as though the saddle bridges on her, but it is not really that narrow on her. It looks as though the panels sit nicely down from the withers and the saddle is not tipping back as a narrow one would do. However, I agree, that it is not the right fit for her. I know from looking at her that a pessoa blythe tate medium wide (fits like most wides) would fit her well as she has exactly the same shape back as my mare. I had awful trouble finding a saddle to fit her.

 

[Christmas Crumpet]

I'm not going to have a go at the saddler that it doesn't fit now!! I wanted to know what other people thought about the fit because I know in my heart of hearts that it wasn't brilliant at the beginning. I don't want to be fobbed off that it fits or will fit with a little bit of flocking!! Pony has never been very happy in it even when very fit - as I said before there were signs... slightly girthy, stretching down a lot on exercise, stumbling a little bit and a few white hairs. Yes I should have done something about it then but had just had a baby and was slightly preoccupied.

The only chance I've got with this saddle and getting it to fit is to send it back to manufacturer and get them to change the tree. I hope this is going to work otherwise its a new saddle we need!!

Thank you for advice.

 

[sbloom]

Thank you Wagtail for speaking sense. There are three issues here - what is the angle of the tree points relative to that of the ribcage where the saddle sits, how much clearance there is, and how high the pommel sits to the cantle. Only the first of those actually tells you whether the saddle is the right width, NOTHING else can tell you that.

The photos are not ideal as you really can't see where the points are sitting, but it may wel be exactly the right width, it might be slightly off, and it might actually be too wide!

The pommel is giving a lot of clearance, I think there is too much flocking in those front panels but as always it's slightly hard to tell from photos. That flocking is lifting the front of the saddle and causing possible bridging, I don't think it is the tree that is too flat. I often see saddles that have too much flock added at the top, to lift the front, but this only exaggerates the shape of the saddle - the points are still winging off, but that shape of panel and over flocking will mean that they lift off even more. That shape of panel doesn't help to get flocking at the points which is where it is needed - it will lift the front of the saddle if necessary but will reshape the front. Too much flocking too high up means it can become convex and sit into the sides of the wither - we want space here for muscles to expand, not hard flocking digging into it. What shape do you want your horse to be? (rhetorical question)

A too narrow saddle will not always sit cantle low, as I said at the top, ONLY looking at the points tells you about width. A too-shallow (too shallow for that horse on that saddle, there is no absolute) rear panel will cause a saddle to be pommel high-cantle low.

 

[Christmas Crumpet]

I did take a wither template with a coat hanger and it was wider than where the points of the tree are at the front of the saddle.

The saddler I use is well recommended and has done a good job in the past so am going back there. I will voice all my concerns and hopefully we can get it right. That is the main thing - getting the saddle right for the horse. I am obviously not a professional so do rely on someone else to get it right for me.

Having ridden the horse without the saddle has resulted in a more relaxed horse who doesn't stumble at odd times and doesn't feel the need to stretch right down tugging the reins out of my hands.

I was unsure what exactly was the problem with the saddle because of the pressure points at the front - whether it was too wide or too narrow or what. I assumed it was too narrow because of the clearance at the front and if you lift the back, it only moves slightly so I believed it wasn't too wide. So my end thinking was that the points of the tree don't correspond to the horse's shape and its the tree that needs looking at. The saddle is a MW and looking at her shape, I was pretty sure she'd be a bigger size.

 

[sbloom]

To test whether a saddle is too wide - girth the saddle up firmly with no pad, or press on the pommel. With the other hand try running your hand, with the length of your fingers under the front of the panel, from the gullet at the pommel, under the panel to beyond the points. Where is there more pressure? It can take a bit of thinking about if you're not doing it everyday as a fitter but if there is pressure at the top edge of the panel then the fit is too wide, the points might even feel slightly "baggy".

If too narrow then you will find you can easily slide your hand down until you get to the points - both these effects can be created by flocking as well - what I said before, too much flock high up can make a saddle fit too wide and yet high in the pommel. So you have to look at the point pockets (lift the flap, hard to photo!) and see how they align with the ribcage as well - if they wing away at the points then it is too wide, if they come in more vertical than the ribcage, then it is too narrow.

You may well be right that it is too narrow, the most important thing I am trying to say is that you musn't be misled by the amount of clearance, or the front to back balance, in ascertaining the width of a tree.

It's also surprisingly easy to trace a horse too wide - I find that maybe 50% of horses I see fit slightly narrower than their tracing. It's hard, with a tracing, to replicate the weight of a rider on a tree which is what we're fitting, not a curve that we slightly press down on.

Another clue that a tree is too wide is not lifting the back but instead that pressing on the front. A too wide saddle will lift at the back, but so will one that is too curvy, so it is only a clue and you must look at the points as described above.

I hope that helps.

 

[Christmas Crumpet]

Sbloom - thank you for all of that. This is why us mere mortals need professional help!!

Pony out in field at the moment but will print off your reply in the morning and have a look using your info as a guide.

Will continue riding bareback until we go to the saddlers.
We are on 8 weeks walking so its not that painful!!