Those with Maiden Mares Have you?/Did you?

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Worried1

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Diva is a maiden and aside from a little pony 20 years ago, my breeding module at uni (where I sat up for about 6 weeks and never managed to see a single foaling!) I have no experience at all.

I had planned to have Diva her at home, we have had a CCTV system installed for the yard as part of the alarm package so can spy on her no problem.

But I am starting to think she might be better going to a professional stud to foal down who have a much better idea of what they are doing.

I am worried about reading too much and getting myself in a muddle. So has any breeding virgins managed successfully with a maiden mare? Am I just living up to my username????? Can you recommend a 'bible' for me to buy which is practical?

Or should I send her away to foal down?

Or give me a slap!

;)
 
Hiya, i was in the same dilema last year with my maiden mare, i worried myself sick read horror stories etc. We didnt have a "stud farm" nearby but my old livery yard bred a few foals so was thinking should i take her there where they have more experince. In the end i took the advice of my vet & others who said my mare would be much happier staying in the field she was used to & its safer & healther for them to foal down outside (which was my prefrence) So i kept her with her herd until the last few months then put her in her own 1 acre paddock beside the others and waited.... i had wnated to be there but she surprised me at 332 days & i arrived in the morning to find a beautiful filly foal & mum happily wandering around the field!

My vet reassured me that it is a very very rare occassion that mares need help & all too often owners jump in too soon to assist getting foal out when the mare could manage herself if she was left well alone. But the horror stories we hear i suppose make us worry & we all want the best for our mares & their foals, but in my opinion think foaling outside is best!!
 
My mare foaled at the livery yard that she is on. I was very lucky.

I did late night checks for about a week but I was very lucky that she started to drip milk on the day that she foaled and I just knew she would foal that night. The YO kept telling me that she would not foal before her due date and was a complete pain in the arse saying that I didnt trust her to check on my mare. Its a good job I know my mare and didnt listen as she foaled a week early.

I left the yard at around 7pm, went home and had food before going back up. Me and a friend sat around in the dark as the YO wouldnt let us put lights on and kept checking on Gin. I left her in the stable, walked across the dark yard and heard a loud noise coming from the stable. It had just gone midnight when she went into labour and Dixie was out within 10 minutes. If it was up to Gin then I wouldnt have been there as she waited for me to leave but I caught her out.

I think so long as you have someone on hand to help and your vet on speed dial just incase (and know that your vet will answer the phone) then I would give it a go. It was an amazing experience for me.
 
Think we are going to keep ours at home and will call the vet if needed. Thats the plan for now anyway! It's going to be lots of long nights!!!

We have had lots of calves before, but never a foal.
 
As said it is very rare for anything to go wrong when foaling down however sometimes little things like the foal is presenting almost correctly but needs a little pull in the right direction, or if your mare is getting tired and you need to give her a hand, so you need to be aware of this and be prepared to help her. IF foaling goes wrong, it can go wrong very quickly so you need to know what you are doing or have a vet that you can phone at any time of the day or night who can walk you through it because often the vet will not be able to get there in time if there's a serious malpresentation and it will be up to you to sort it out yourself. If you search "malpresentations" on google you will find some very helpful information complete with diagrams and photos. Swat up on these immediately prior to foaling so that they are sharp in your mind and you can go onto autopilot should anything go wrong. I've been foaling down mares for a long time but at the beginning of every foaling season I still swat up on them (bit like going on an aeroplane and checking out the emergency exits :))

If you feel confident then keep mama at home, if not then send her to stud a month or so before her estimated due date.
 
I was a foaling 'virgin' and my maiden mare foaled down in her field at home. I was there for the birth - magical:) I had my vet's number on standby and as it happened, needed to call him out to help establish feeding.
 
pinkypug1 said:
My vet reassured me that it is a very very rare occassion that mares need help & all too often owners jump in too soon to assist getting foal out when the mare could manage herself if she was left well alone. But the horror stories we hear i suppose make us worry & we all want the best for our mares & their foals, but in my opinion think foaling outside is best!!
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True - to a point! But it's pretty irresponsible advice for a vet to give if that was the whole story! Yes - probably only 1 in 20 mares - at worst - needs assistance as a life-saving measure - which is fine if you have 20 mares and are prepared to sacrifice one foal for your convenience!!

But statistics don't work like that! If you have one much-loved mare, expecting a foal that you have invested heavily in - be assured that SHE will be that 1 in 20!!
 
JanetGeorge said:
....... If you have one much-loved mare, expecting a foal that you have invested heavily in - be assured that SHE will be that 1 in 20!!
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I suppose that it's Sod's Law, but you're right!!

If we accept that horses are generally the most inept creatures, when it comes to their own welfare, it never fails to surprise me just how able most mares are, at the point of parturition.

Now with sheep, it's a different matter. With the possible exception of Lleyns, most pedigree or pure bred sheep, will have a need for 60-70% of them requiring assistance. Even with commercial (cross bred) ewes, there will be a need to assist with 20-30%.

I always assist at foaling, but if I left them alone, most would manage.

Strange creatures horses, aren't they? :D

Alec.
 
As already said above all mares are different, but i do agree with JanetGeorge that it would be sod's law it is always that owner who only has the one mare and has heavily invested in the foal.
My mares are not maidens and have had many foals but i am always there to help/assist if needed as at any point things can go horribly wrong. We don't like to think it will be our mare but we have to be realistic that breeding is a risk we take both for our mares and our foals.
Your vet being on the phone of course is a help but if the foal is malpresented would be unlikely to be able to tell you what to do over the phone and by the time they get to you it could be too late.
If you are genuinley worried and lack experience then maybe sending her to a local stud would be the best thing for both parties. They may call you when she is foaling so you can see it, but at least you know she would be in safe hands if anything did go wrong
 
All our mares foaled in the field without any problems. Much better for the mare as so much more room. But ofcourse it depends when they are due to foal i.e. the weather. Totally natural enivronment for them.
 
I dont want to scare You but Don't think it won't happen to you I very much wanted to keep Mildred at home however I have no experience of foaling
I paid out and sent her to stud this was the right thing for me as Mildred was so relaxed I knew she would be fine
I looked at hiring equipment but it was expensive and they didn't always work/set off false alarms
Mildred foaled a week early at 5am at the stud Mabel was born and Mildred never got up she just went back to sleep forever I thank the stars she was at the stud they felt with it milked my poor mare and began to bottle feed my foal
It never.crossed my mind I could loose Mildred I always did have in the back of my mind I could loose the foal
The stud saved my foal without a shadow of a doubt I would have been traumatised I would not have got the colostrum and I didn't have powdered milk and at 5 am I may not have arrived till 9 I think Mabel would have been very weak or dead
I don't want to scare you but obviously I would advise you invest in someone with years of experience if will your mare won't be stressed let her go it could be the best few hundred quid you ever spend it was for me!
I am devastated about Mildred I had her 11 years and I still get very upset but I have Mabel and I am so thankfull of that
I can't proof read this as I'm on my phone but I just want to say again I don't want to date you I hope you don't mind me telling my story I personally never wanted to hear any horror stories when Mildred was pregnant so hope you don't mind
I'm sure you'll be fine but I posted his exact question a few months ago and people told me to send her away the only reason I personally wanted her home was selfishly because I wanted so much to be there but I decided I had I had to sacrifice that for the safety of my foal
But whatever you decide be happy with your choice it's up to you and I wish you all the luck in the world! Xxx
 
I'm so sorry you lost Mildred, Carmenlucy123, how very sad for you but thanks for giving me your experience.

Thanks everyone, I am still undecided but given it's an early foal outside foaling is definitely not an option.

I have a little while yet before I decide but I will keep you posted.
 
All mine have foaled at home in the paddock or field shelter, one mare would stress herself stupid confined to a stable or in a strange place so I experimented and stuck with the system because it worked well for me. They have me around if they need me, I find that they have much more space in a small paddock than in a stable and are able to sort out any small problems and are very much more relaxed, however I accept that should something go wrong it will be me that has to assist.

Some breeds/types are more prone to birthing problems as well so you have to bear that in mind and some mares show no visible signs, although I find maidens are a bit more obvious, you could always call the vet over when you see those signs and pay the bill!!!. I monitor the milk using Ph and Calcium strips so I know roughly when they are about to foal, then I warn the vet just in case I will need help, but they are 15-20 mins away.

If you look on the mini sites in the USA, because they are prone to problems their advice is good on how to correct a variety of problems. I have crib sheets that I can refer to quickly if things go wrong and equipment to deal with mal presentations.
There are a number of things you can do to establish if you can cope:
Read the internet stuff, look on you tube as well an ask yourself if you could do that if you had to?
Find an experienced local person who could come over and help you
Go to a local TB stud early season to gain some experience
Find someone with sheep or goats and go and assist, you will get some idea from this!
 
hi we put in foal our much loved 15 yr old maiden mare , we planned all along to foal her at home but we dont have a great deal of experience so finally decided to send her to a stud an hour away to foal , best money we ever spent she was a month late foaling which would have meant a great many sleepless nights for us , at the stud she had a huge padded box , cctv and a foaling moniter , and most importantly a very experienced stud owner at hand who sent me a text pic at 5am of a large chestnut bum and a pair of feet lol
ten mins later another pic of foal lying next to mum by which time we were in car and on our way by the time we arrived he was up and suckling
we now have a strapping 2 1/2 year old and no regrets at not being present at his birth (but it cost over a thousand lol!)
 
JanetGeorge said:
True - to a point! But it's pretty irresponsible advice for a vet to give if that was the whole story! Yes - probably only 1 in 20 mares - at worst - needs assistance as a life-saving measure - which is fine if you have 20 mares and are prepared to sacrifice one foal for your convenience!!

But statistics don't work like that! If you have one much-loved mare, expecting a foal that you have invested heavily in - be assured that SHE will be that 1 in 20!!
Click to expand...

I agree with JanetGeorge, although I would say the stats are slightly higher than that. We had 9 mares foal this year and two needed assistance. One was a wriggle to get the shoulders out and the other was a red bag, with a subsequent dummie foal which is very lucky to be alive. The foal needed 24/7 supervision and bottle feeding for the first 3 days, until it was strong and aware enough to latch on.
 
I've only ever bred one foal and that was from a maiden mare. It never crossed my mind NOT to send her back to the stud to foal. For a start they know what they are looking at/for and have the facilities to sit up all night "foal-watching". I am not a total novice where breeding is concerened as I have bred quite a few puppies and kittens but horses are a whole different "kettle of fish". They normally foal quickly once they get going and there is no vet within at least half an hour of me which would be too late in the event of a problem. As the stud owner said when I asked him "at what point do I call a vet?" . . "when it's too late". I have no facilities for foaling apart from a field with no lighting and I wasn't going to risk my already considerable financial investment for the sake of a couple of hundred quid foaling fee. In the event, the mare foaled 12 days after her due date and was a "little tight" so they had to pull the foal out. It was also the spring of 2007 which was the year we didn't have a summer and both the mare and foal came in at night for over a month. I wouldn't have been happy to have been forced to leave them out in a wet, windy field (and on the late May Bank Holiday even SLEET) . Although the foaling fee and subsequent livery cost me, it was money well spent for peace of mind.
 
I planned to send my maiden mare back to the stud, but both the stud owners and my own vet, said there was no reason not to foal her at home. As it turned out I had her and another maiden to foal and they both did at 1am on 5th May this year.
My husband and I both had other farm animal experience ie lambings and calvings so that was a help. But foalings are different, a lot quicker.
Anyway, we managed and it was fine, no problems with the deliveries at all. The first 24 hours were a bit more stressful as one foal was v wobbly and wouldn't get up or suck very well, but we persevered with him and he got there.
 
whisper was my first horse- i got her as a 2 year old, broke her myself and she is my baby.

i put her in foal for the first time aged 16 and she carried no problem. had the foal all be herself in the field. i sat up every night for a week, camped out! i eventualy thought, this is silly, i need to go home and do some washing etc, and dont you know it my mum phoned at 5 am!

i missed the birth but was there well in time to see willow stand for the first time.

i was a first time breeder from a first time mare (one who is precious to me) and everything was fine. the foal was a bit down on her hinds, but within a couple of weeks was vastly improved, and you'd never know now.)

i know bad things can happen- maybe i was just lucky, but i would do it again, and wouldnt feel the need to send her back to stud to foal.
 
Hi

Hope this is of help as name suggest we became a first time mum this year. It was a traumatic pregnancy to say the least the mare broke her elbow on the same day she was covered (by jumping a hedge into a ditch) this resulted in 9 months box rest. She also got cast once and fell over straight on her side about 2 weeks before foaling (with me underneath).
As for the foaling I was very lucky she moved to the livery yard as soon as she could travel where I kept the horse I was riding and competing where we had CCTV and also somewhere to sleep. The yard owner has also bred horses for years and knows what she was doing.
I had 4 weeks sleeping (well not sleeping) on the yard as she was showing small signs for weeks. I stayed up all night with her until I put her out in the morning about 6am then went to bed for a few hours sleep before going to work as we have a girl who works on the yard and could keep an eye on her.
So firstly think about the work situation and also who could keep an eye on her during the day.
I felt fully prepared if not very sleepy for the birth.
She eventually went into labour - typically exactly on her due date running masses of milk and displaying every sign possible that day so 4 weeks of lack of sleep would have been saved however I know that I would do the same again.
I had read every article possible however when the foal presented I still wasnt sure and had to call the vet as the front feet came out at an odd angle - luckily straightened themselves however I had the vet on speed dial to call if needed - carried on too long.
Foalie arrived about 2 minutes before the vet - perfect
Vet stayed around as the mare wasn't too keen on the foal suckling and needed holding to be a big brave girl.
Mare then retained the placenta so had to call vet again @ 8 in the morning to ask to come and give injection to help her push it out.
Again placenta/afterbirth dropped the minute vet pulled into the yard - she was then able to check to ensure nothing was retained.
And gave her some antibiotics and leave me with some.
That all sounds a complete nightmare and am planning to put her back in foal again next year.
However I wouldnt have missed it for the world.
Main thing I would make sure is that your vet lives very close in case of emergency, vet is repro specialist, you have someone very experienced on hand and be prepared for the lack of sleep - you will not sleep as can guarantee the 30 min nap you take will be when foalie arrives.
Some studs do run birthing and youngstock courses I think Tremlows (sp) runs one which a friend went on.
Good luck!!!
 
KarynK said:
Find someone with sheep....... and go and assist, you will get some idea from this!
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An excellent suggestion. The principles are much the same, though with ewes you have more time.

Find someone (as local as you can), and ask if you can firstly watch, and then assist. You'll learn a great deal. With a commercial flock, lambing indoors, and with 500+ ewes, in the midst of it, you'll probably be at the business end of 20-30 ewes per night!

When my daughter was born, I was ready for anything!! ;)

Alec.
 
Out of interest how simular is it to sheep/cows?
Seen and lambed quite a few lambs often with instruction on the mobile! And watched cows calvenormally and assisted with calving aid (would not like to see this on a horse!)
 
Alec Swan said:
Now with sheep, it's a different matter. With the possible exception of Lleyns, most pedigree or pure bred sheep, will have a need for 60-70% of them requiring assistance. Even with commercial (cross bred) ewes, there will be a need to assist with 20-30%.
Click to expand...

I used to breed Lleyns - and you're right! They were VERY easy lambing - and great mothers. I had Charlollais too - and they were great - as were the Charollais x Lleyn ewes!

Sheep are easier than mares if you have a bad one though - as it's far easier to get INTO a ewe to sort out a mispresentation. And you can restrain and handle them far easier than a mare sho is panicking! Cows, of course, are easier still in that they are much harder to damage than a mare!
 
Our next door neighbours are sheep farmers but think they lambed late last year but I'll ask the big commercial farm at Detling to go and observe, they have sheep and cows.

Thank you, not quite sure how we ended up on farming but all very useful.

However, if I wasn't crapping myself before I am now ;)
 
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