To breed or not to breed?

CorvusCorax

CorvusCorax

Deary me...
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Sorry if I'm repeating anything that's already been posted on and I will sack the thread if so, but I see a few other threads have wandered into this subject.

We haven't bred a litter since the mid 1980s.
We currently have a dog and bitch, siblings (see pic post below).
The male has a few issues which I want to see if he will grow out of and if he doesn't, I'd be inclined to neuter him.
The bitch was bought as "an investment for the future" and my mother's opinion is that it would be a shame not to breed her because of her lines (depending on hip score, obviously).
I know she is still waaaay young and the future is a long way off, but to be honest my heart isn't in breeding, the way things are at the minute.
I am not confident all puppies in an average-sized litter would find good homes for life.
GSDs are such 'particular' dogs and I would only home them to someone who really knew what they were doing.
I just don't think there is market or all the right homes these days.
Until things change, little miss won't be reproducing.



Right, over to you guys, what are your opinions?
 
Not, purely on the basis they are brother and sister, or do you mean to different dogs
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It doesn't really sound like you want to breed them so I, for the minute will go with no.
 
Oh God no, not to each other!

I don't want to breed right now, I've made my mind up, was just wondering what other people's opinions are, if you do breed, why, that kind of thing, do you think there's a saturation point with dogs etc, looking for a wide variety of views on the subject!

Sorry, it appears I penned a vague ramble
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*giggle* I was very confused. My excuse is I'm blonde
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I will be breeding my younger dog soon (she's only a year so won't be til she's at least 2) she's a working bred lab and I will be breeding her to another working lab. I also have homes lined up already
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Like you, we haven't bred in a few years but hoping to get a really nice litter out of this wee one.
 
Well as I have said in previous posts,I haven't bred a litter since 2000. Okay the bitch I had planned to breed from had bad hips (a sickener in itself as both her parents had single figure scores), but I have not rushed out to get another bitch purely because it was getting harder to find the "right" sort of home for pups. And that was usually with a waiting list for a good number of the litter. Nowadays more and more people are working full time, and I was not happy to have a puppy left all day. It has always been necessary to screen out the idiots when selling GSDs, but I seemed to be getting more and more people who didn't understand the breed. This problem wasn't helped by the fact that imo, some of the current lines definitely are harder work than years ago. All my stock are German lines so am definitely not against them but some are very hyper. As you say, you have plenty of time to make a decision with your bitch, with Bodo, unless he is stunning, he probably won't get much studwork as he hasn't been imported
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Not really any answers there sorry, just opinions, but do know exactly how you feel. Although I really miss having puppies around I do not miss worrying about them finding the right homes.
 
You see, I was going to write something like 'are there more numpties around these days, or is it just me?'.
Someone was cooing over Bodo and said she was looking for a nice dog to breed to her longcoat bitch, I felt like taking him away and hiding him in the shed.....I don't think he'll make a stud, to be honest, unless anybody wants a big grey horse lookalike
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Agree about some of the German lines, I have come across a few real 'headers' lately, you would really need to think very hard about matching dogs to bitches these days.
 
It is probably because I come from a showing background, but I wouldnt breed a litter unless there was a reason to do so? For example you are hoping to breed your next champion, or a good working dog for yourself, or even to ensure that you can keep a pup which would be the offspring of a much loved dog. Although perhaps the latter applies to you?

I personally would not breed from a bitch just because she is there and it would be nice/cute to have some puppies - I must emphasise that I am NOT suggesting that is how you are thinking about it BTW - but sadly people do think like that.
 
Also from show background....just wanted to get a debate going....that's the point, I don't see the point of us breeding in the current climate and wanted some other views!
 
Agree with acolyte....I really do not see the need unless you yourself are looking to show...I don't think having a well breed dog should constitute breeding.
Answer to your numpty question...yes IMO the numpty's outway the sensible people...and then there is always how many are going to be breed just from the off spring of your dogs....if you look at it that way it is a heck of a lot more than a litter.
MY OPINION WILL ALWAYS BE...DO NOT BREED IF NOT NECESSARY, esp not just or financial gain(not that Im saying u are)...the rescue and kennels are overflowing.....and they are not all badly breed dogs, we get some stunning looking dogs with some impressive pedigrees
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, when people are having problems and are desperate to get shot of a dog, no matter how much or how well breed, if not returned to breeder thay all end up in the same place.
 
We've had a "numpty" breeder in today - he deliberately bred from his 10 year old Dalmation bitch. When one of my colleagues suggested this was a bit old for a first litter he seemed genuinely surprised. He also couldn't afford the examination so God knows how he would be able to afford a C/section if the need arises.
 
How old?
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Poor bitch, and of course the resulting puppies, if they make it, won't be KC registered even if the dam is, because the KC won't accept registrations from bitches over 8 . You vets must be left speechless at idiots like this. I suppose its too much to hope that she won't take.
 
You're not kidding - we seem to have had a week of them this week - including a Border terrier for a pregnancy scan - this was her second litter and she's only 15mths old so she must of had her first litter from her first season! I don't think they'll be able to register this litter now either.
We also had a white Boxer who was nearly 9yrs old in at the weekend that had been deliberately mated by their other dog in the hope of more white and potentially deaf boxers - she wasn't pregnant but had developed a pyometra following the mating. Their objections to an emergency hysterectomy weren't just based on the fact that they didn't want to pay but also that they wanted to try breeding from her again - at 9!!! Fortunately they did change their minds and had the dog sorted out in the end - though I suspect she no longer holds so much appeal to them as a pet now she can no longer bear pups.
Fortunately we do have some really genuine and knowledgable breeders too to counterbalance the numpties!
 
Words fail me. And thats just at one practice. I think Borders are the latest "trend", there seem to be loads of litters in our local paper every night.
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Can I take exception to you calling these numpties "breeders", they are not they are just idiots who shouldn't be allowed dogs!
 
Actually I agree with you - its totally unacceptable to lump them in the same category as the good breeders. I've only worked at this practice for 9 mths and I've never encountered so many indescriminate "breeders" in one place before.
 
F*****g....bunch of pitifull...shameless sh1t heads
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it really p1sses me off no end when they are so pathetic and black as to whinge about the costs when a cesarean is needed
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, and breeding at that age...clearly they would sell their own granny to make a quick buck.

I think we will be refering to u tomorrow, little dog found r.t.a, scanned it and it's reged to your vets...atleast I think anyhow.
 
Yeah I think we need your mum to round them all up and sort tham all out!
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All those people came in in the space of a few days and that is fairly typical at WL. I was really shocked when I started working there how bad it was.
I'm not working today - its Nikki so she'll hopefully sort the little dog out.
 
[ QUOTE ]
Words fail me. And thats just at one practice. I think Borders are the latest "trend", there seem to be loads of litters in our local paper every night.
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Can I take exception to you calling these numpties "breeders", they are not they are just idiots who shouldn't be allowed dogs!

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Around these parts, we call them "backyard breeders" and I do think there's a huge distinction from someone who dedicates years to a particular breed, and someone who bungs two average dogs together to make a quick buck.
 
Hello! I'm sitting here in Sweden, next to three sleeping Finnish Lapphundpuppies (2 weeks old). Got my first dog when I was 16, I've had five bitches this far (2 Norwegian Buhunds, 1 Collie Smooth, 1 DobermannX, 1 FL) and now 34 years old I have my first litter.
Two of the previous ladys was SUCH(the swedish kennelclub champion titel), their hips x-rayed, eyes checkt, temperament evaluated, but there was always something that weren't good enough.

The puppies next to me has a father that is SUCH, got an A on hip x-ray (the best level in sweden, B is also good, C can be used but not with another C), his eyes is tested and gen-tested (free + non-carrier). An exampel of his good temperament is that he doesn't harass a bitch in heat, he just checks that shes not in the really interesting stage of the heat and even when she really was, and it turned out that she wanted some proper courting
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, he obliged for more than four hours!
And with people living closer and closer together, having a male dog that you can take to the park without needing to be to worried about bitches in heat, but still really knows what to do (it's not the first litter he's sired), is something desirable I think.

Jonna has been at shows and I admit, she's not a star, but she's closer the star-top of the scale than the crap-end, hips A, eyes tested (free) and her temperament, well to put it short she's my reward after 18 years of dogowning
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, including for exampel around 13 years with a Collie that had periodical leakageproblems.
Or the longer explanation: She doesn't hunt, even when the wild bird is less than a meter away. She stops barking when I want it. Dogs scared of other dogs likes her. My vets loves her, they say she's a real PR-dog for her breed, they've had clients of her breed before, but since I got her, they say that whenever someone want them to recommend a breed, she's now the first one they can think of. She's obedient when I want it...

And yes, I do think she's cute, but that has nothing to do with me breeding her, she's cute because I love her, I bred her because if all dogs had her temperament I think that there would never be any new news about dog killing another dog.

So here I am, with 2 bitches and 1 male and I will keep one of the bitches, but if I don't like the buyer to be I will keep them all, and little Boris will simply have a meeting whit my vet as soon as I spot something extra dangeling back there.
If I do sell two of them, I have, for exampel, prepared a page with what different dogthings cost, such as vacc, puppyclass, dogdaycare, insurance, annual helthcheck, anti tick stuff, chewing things, food...
And to really try and sort out the good from the rest, I'm at my summerplace so I plan to show them our burial ground.

Sadly I don't have a digitalcamera, so I can not let you see them, but trust me, right now they look like a mostly black furry cross between a rat with to short tail and minihippopotamus.

Sorry for the long text and greetings from the w(b)est coast of Sweden.
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Just an update to say we've had the 10 yr old Dalmation in for a C/section today to remove a load of dead pups.
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It started whelping on Saturday and the owners decided to leave it to Monday morning to bring it in.
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Needless to say we are speying it as I type so hopefully this never happens again. Oh and no money to pay for it.
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I was going to say I hope the poor bitch pulls through okay. But then again I wonder if she would be better off if she didn't.
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Out of interest, surely this amaounts to ill treatment or neglect under the new Animal Welfare laws. As vets are you able to report it or is that frowned on by the profession?
 
I think its a bit of a grey area really because they did bring the dog for an examination Friday - at this point the cervix wasn't dilated and wasn't in labour but she had a low temperature which made my colleague think she would whelp in the next 24h. They weren't in contact at all Saturday which made everyone think she'd probably whelped ok overnight. On the Sunday we only have a surgery until 10.30am and then the phones go over to the emergency clinic - whether they spoke to them I don't know because they usually fax us details of any clients they have spoken to or seen overnight. I suspect they probably didn't. I suppose the main thing is they did bring her first thing this morning and even though it was obviously 24-48h too late they did present her for treatment.
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