To think this rider was partly at fault?

Five&Two

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Thankyou, Hack4fun.

Why do some people want to apportion blame? Well, I do no doubt, sometimes, and I think we like to think that if X is at fault, then it won't happen to us because we aren't like X.

I think it's one of those rotton things, that near-miss. The lighting was awful for the truck driver who came along and the last thing he would expect to see is a horse on the road. Said horse and rider did very well though.

Let's just be glad that all parties learned a little from it and no one was hurt.

You are a joke! 'the ligthing was awful' The bin man had no trouble seeing them! The truck driver was a grade A knob, he deserves the book thrown at him!!
 

scruffyponies

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Someone overtook me recently (I was driving a carriage), despite the fact that there was an ambulance heading towards them the other way with it's lights flashing and siren on. The ambulance had to do an emergency stop.

Was the ambulance wasn't wearing enough hi viz... or just maybe, some drivers just self-important twats
 

Annagain

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100% the blue lorry's fault. It looks to me like the blue lorry was going too fast to stop behind the bin lorry and rather than making the choice to overtake had to take evasive action without looking properly. He's lucky it was a horse in some ways. If there had been a car coming it wouldn't have been able to jump out of the way.

Before anyone mentions it I know the bin lorry wouldn't have slowed down for a car coming towards it but it could have slowed down for a horse in front of it and a car could have been coming the other way.
 

Megan V1

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Driver's fault without a doubt as he sailed past without thinking why the lorry in front had slowed down, happens all the time. I slowed for a cyclist on bends recently because I couldn't see around him and didn't want to drive to close to him so another car overtook me obviously couldn't see if traffic was coming the other way and pulled back in so sharply he almost hit the cyclist. Then sped off without a backwards glance only for me to be right behind him at the next set of lights so it didn't get him very far.
 

Tiddlypom

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It was the flat bed truck driver’s fault, he wasn’t paying attention, but I see similar happening all the time whatever mode of transport I’m using. Drivers are just too distracted these days.

I could see the rider’s red jacket clearly, but it wouldn’t show up well for the red/green colourblind affected amongst us (8% of males, 0.5% females). Proper hi viz would have stood out more to grab an inattentive driver’s attention. I’m not sure how low the sun is, but I won’t ride out in low dazzling sun even when I’m hi vizzed up as always (see my avatar).
 

Leandy

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Drivers' fault completely. He was going way too fast for the road conditions. The Highway Code requires you to be able to stop in the distance ahead you can see to be clear. He should have slowed right down when he saw the stopped truck ahead and considered why it had stopped and then he would have seen the horse. I do really dislike the victim blaming which says that if someone is hit it is partly their fault for not wearing hi viz. Hi viz is a great idea to increase visibility of course, however it is a driver's obligation to be able to stop in the distance he can see to be clear and to drive to the road conditions. Frankly, if a driver cannot see over half a ton of horse and rider at sufficient distance to stop or slow down, even without hi viz, he is either too blind to be driving or he is driving way too fast for the conditions. It isn't just horses which could be around the next corner, it is cyclists, broken down cars, pedestrians, escaped sheep, a rock on the road, a sink hole, a fire engine coming the other way, anything! An increasing number of people drive as though they are the only ones on the road and seem not to expect to come across any kind of hazard at all, it is utterly irresponsible. Grrr!!!
 

MrsNorris

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Driver error IMO, he was not paying attention for whatever reason, we encounter it all the time around here. Last week, myself and friend hacking along a fairly narrow road, good weather, lots of hi viz on us both. Car passed my friend ok and then just drove straight at me! I was at most 2 yards behind. Driver hit my leg with her wing mirror, it made an awful bang when it hinged in, but my horse was a star and behaved perfectly.
I still can’t get my head around the fact that she obviously saw my friend, but not me. I can only guess that something distracted her, probably her phone, and she just wasn’t looking.
 

Leandy

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Driver error IMO, he was not paying attention for whatever reason, we encounter it all the time around here. Last week, myself and friend hacking along a fairly narrow road, good weather, lots of hi viz on us both. Car passed my friend ok and then just drove straight at me! I was at most 2 yards behind. Driver hit my leg with her wing mirror, it made an awful bang when it hinged in, but my horse was a star and behaved perfectly.
I still can’t get my head around the fact that she obviously saw my friend, but not me. I can only guess that something distracted her, probably her phone, and she just wasn’t looking.
Indeed. And did she then stop? Because the other problem is not stopping. Accidents and mistakes happen, but it is an offence to leave the scene of an accident . Drivers need to stop and check all is ok before leaving. And of course if not, it is just common courtesy and consideration for others to assist as necessary.
 

Leandy

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And just to add to the list of stupid incidents. I have been overtaken a number of times in my horsebox when slowing down and indicating to turn right. Who in their right mind overtakes a vehicle whilst it is indicating to turn right??
 

shortstuff99

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And just to add to the list of stupid incidents. I have been overtaken a number of times in my horsebox when slowing down and indicating to turn right. Who in their right mind overtakes a vehicle whilst it is indicating to turn right??
Yes I have had that, even when I've been in a car! It's crazy!
 

shortstuff99

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I've never worn hi-viz while crossing the road in broad daylight as a pedestrian and I would still hope that a van wouldn't try and overtake another on the wrong side of the road and knock me down.
This happened where I lived, a car had stopped to let a pedestrian cross the road (he was bout 14 years old) and a car overtook them and killed the pedestrian. I would always recommend only crossing at pedestrian crossings now, and to never just blindly overtake!
 

criso

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This happened where I lived, a car had stopped to let a pedestrian cross the road (he was bout 14 years old) and a car overtook them and killed the pedestrian. I would always recommend only crossing at pedestrian crossings now, and to never just blindly overtake!
I've had it happen on pedestrian crossings too. If there is more than one lane, I always pause and peer round the side of the first vehicle to make sure something isn't coming up fast on the inside. Also bicycles do this all the time and if it's a taller vehicle you don't see the bike.
 
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Sorry but that's not enough hi viz imho. I agree with others who have said that the driver of the blue truck was not paying attention. But I didn't see the rider thank the driver of the white lorry that had stopped or signalled to the oncoming driver to stop although I do admit there may not have been enough time. And I've only watched the video with naff streaming that we have at work so that didn't help and I may have missed something.

Photos attached of what I wear and as you can see I have two fast or slow flashing lights on the back of the exercise sheet, also on the off side inside of the exercise sheet by the fillet string, a flashing leg band attached to the front of the breast plate and sometimes a still light on the front of the offside foreleg.

I am visible all round with the edition of my hat band (for tall hedges) and my high viz 'polite notice' gillet on.

There is no way I would not be visible to cars from any angle. I also agree that orange hi viz is better than yellow. Even looking out onto a rain soaked darkened skies site from the site office window at work I can see that orange screams at me whilst yellow only grabs my attention after I have seen the orange.
 

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milliepops

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I don't think you can say there is no way you would be invisible.
Driving into the sun makes it very very hard to spot things sometimes. Driving with the sun from the side can give a flickering strobe effect which is also difficult to see well.
This doesn't excuse bad driving, but it does mean that we can't just set off with our hi vis on and feel invincible.

As others have said it's not a legal requirement either, (i'd like to see it apply to cyclists tbh if it went that way for horses - zooming down lanes dressed in black isn't a great life choice) and I don't think it should be anyway, because you never know when you may be caught out - I've caught loose horses on roads before and not had hi vis to lead them home in, and would not want to be fined or whatever for doing a good deed!
 

JFTDWS

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No matter how much hi vis anyone wears, if the driver isn't looking, they won't see you. People get distracted and accidents happen - it's no use blaming the victim, drivers need to be more aware that even in their little cocoon, they are hurtling around at speeds capable of killing themselves and other people. And that's before you allow for variations in the visibility of hi vis items depending on light conditions and how much writing etc is plastered over it...

As for a horse being the "last thing" the truck driver would've expected to see - that's a bizarre comment. If it was Henry VIII riding an elephant down the road, you might have a point, but horses are a fairly common sight on the roads, covered in the HWC and in driving tests. Drivers should expect to see them, though in this case, an animal with a mind of its own was a great help - another car or a bike wouldn't have been able to get out of the way so easily.
 

ycbm

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There is no way I would not be visible to cars from any angle.

There are times when you wouldn't be seen even in that, HB. Come to my house on a sunny winter's day and drive up my hill facing into the sun. When it happens, I can't see my own car bonnet, never mind a horse if it had flashing lights all over it. I don't ride at the time of day it happens on those days, it's lethal.
 
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There are times when you wouldn't be seen even in that, HB. Come to my house on a sunny winter's day and drive up my hill facing into the sun. When it happens, I can't see my own car bonnet, never mind a horse if it had flashing lights all over it. I don't ride at the time of day it happens on those days, it's lethal.
I agree with normal hi viz, but I think that flashing lights would be seen. Studies have shown cyclists with lights on their bikes in the daytime have dropped accident figures by 19%. And cars with lights permanently on these days those accident figures have dropped too. Although researching this today I've found that it is safer if I don't have my lights flashing as it is harder for the human eye to work out a distance if they see a flashing light rather than a static one and you can look like you are further away than you are.

I have been hit by a car years ago whilst riding up a hill with sun at the top. The whole left side of us where in darkness, only I didn't know that at the time. It was only when I drove in my car in a similiar light that I realised that the driver just hadn't seen me. The fact that he didn't even brake when he hit us, or slow down after or stop was surprising though.
 
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Yup, someone went from stationary to attempting to run me over on the bike this week, hi vis and lights on as raining.
There are always exceptions, and yes as JFTD says if people aren't looking then of course they won't see you no matter what you do. But fortunately this scenario is quite rare, most weather conditions mean that you are visible if you wear hi viz rather than if you do not.

But I'd rather doll myself up to the extreme and have that extra 3 seconds of thinking/braking time then not bother. At at the end of the day if I were involved in an accident at least I could feel that i had done everything within my power to mitigate the risk of not being seen.
 

ester

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I guess you don't cycle much, in that respect it happens every single ride because drivers aren't looking, not an exception. It has nothing to do with how 'visible' you have made yourself and I can guarantee you that cycling, or riding (not doing so recently) I am well dolled up, flashing breastplates and tail lights and all. The point JFTD was making and I was commenting on was about drivers not what the other road user is doing.
 
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I guess you don't cycle much, in that respect it happens every single ride because drivers aren't looking, not an exception. It has nothing to do with how 'visible' you have made yourself and I can guarantee you that cycling, or riding (not doing so recently) I am well dolled up, flashing breastplates and tail lights and all. The point JFTD was making and I was commenting on was about drivers not what the other road user is doing.
Well I am surprised as I honestly thought flashing lights or static lights made me more visible although i shall continue to use them.

No I don't cycle - I feel extremely vulnerable on the occasions when I did and gave up quickly. I would rather ride down the main road bareback than cycle down a country lane! I hated it tbh. Drivers come extremely close to you or drive up your backside.

I did have a stage when I first wore my Polite Notice tabard where I found that there were a couple of young lads in the area who thought it would be fun to intimidate me by revving up behind my horse, I thought as they were that stupid that they had probably mistaken my Polite for Police.
 
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You are surprised because you are struggling withe concept that some drivers just don't look, they are in their own little bubble.
No I didn't say that Ester. I just assume I have done the best I can. It annoys me when others ride with no hi viz on at all. I think they are really silly but sometimes you can't educate people.

I am going to buy a hat cam after xmas. I'm currently looking for a 'hack cam' that goes with my exercise sheet. Going to wait until the New Year sales I think.
 
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