Totilas' boy Tolegro

ycbm

ycbm

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https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=MoUsvbOKmWE

I was just trying to find out if Tolegro, Totilas' first born, was competing with any success and came across this. I was struck by some things. The hackney front leg movement, the short trot that is a long way from tracking up and seems to lack the ability to extend (I am comparing with Farouche at the same age) and what looks like an absolutely dire stilted walk.

Would you pay €950 to breed from him, and if so, what have I missed or got wrong?
 
AShetlandBitMeOnce

AShetlandBitMeOnce

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Such a freedom of movement as a foal, and a complete lack of freedom as a horse says to me that he was thrown in way too deep and more advanced movements were worked on heavily without having the basics of a lovely free, powerful paces in place first. Nothing about his ridden work now looks powerful, or easy, or anything other than awkward. Looks as though his oversized neck and over-'synched in' head is blocking him from actually going anywhere.

I will admit though, I feel silly saying this as he is being ridden by people with much more knowledge and riding ability than I will ever have, so perhaps I am totally wrong.
 
Palindrome

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I think he is showing some nice passagey trot and working in a quite advanced outline for a 5 years old. You can't get extension and collection at the same time and they have worked more on the collection here I think. I wouldn't breed to him but I'd be pleased if my horse was working like that (or even half as good).

ETA: rocking horse canter too. I am in the "like" camp.
 
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Red-1

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Rising three... so not yet three years old. Obviously already done a LOT of schooling, and prepped for big arena venue too....

I much prefer how he is moving in the rising three video. But, not that he is doing so much at rising three!
 
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Annagain

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It almost looks like his front end and back end are two different horses. I'm far from an expert but find myself thinking he needs to be going forward a lot more at five rather than working on the expression the front legs are giving.
 
ester

ester

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Red-1 said:
Rising three... so not yet three years old. Obviously already done a LOT of schooling, and prepped for big arena venue too....

I much prefer how he is moving in the rising three video. But, not that he is doing so much at rising three!
Click to expand...

2 years 11 months maybe he has given up by now.
 
Asha

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Illusion100

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A horse pushed too much too early for his the sake of his sires reputation.

This exaggerated front limb movement that does not correlate to correct hindlimb movement is really getting on my tits. It looks ridiculous. Ladies and Gents, give ignorance and flash priority and soon enough top dressage horses will be the new GSD.

Just in this horse the front is so uphill and the backend so downhill. At this rate he'll be wrecked in a few years, the poor beggar.
 
windand rain

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Example of too much too soon in my eyes. I guess had I bred him he might be just about to wear a saddle by now. Nice boy but not wow
 
ycbm

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I was open mouthed at Farouche at the same age. She was loose and fluid, extended and collected for Michael Eilberg and for a rider strange to her, and had presence to burn.

This guy doesn't even look correct to me. They try to lengthen the trot, but he can't/won't. And the front legs are a bit freaky. I'm just going to see if he has been competing and there is anything on YouTube.


Edit - can't find any evidence that he is competing at all.
 
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ycbm

ycbm

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ester said:
how old was he at licencing?
Click to expand...

Pretty sure he was three and there was a lot of unhappiness that he was licensed at all. A lot of people thought he wasn't correct, as far as I remember.
 
Bernster

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Illusion100 said:
A horse pushed too much too early for his the sake of his sires reputation.

This exaggerated front limb movement that does not correlate to correct hindlimb movement is really getting on my tits. It looks ridiculous. Ladies and Gents, give ignorance and flash priority and soon enough top dressage horses will be the new GSD.

Just in this horse the front is so uphill and the backend so downhill. At this rate he'll be wrecked in a few years, the poor beggar.
Click to expand...

I tend not to comment on these as I couldn't ride one side of that boy, but that really gets my goat as well, this focus on flashy front end with the back end trailing away behind. But it's so common that people must think it's correct or desirable? I don't get it.
 
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crabbymare

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ester said:
how old was he at licencing?
Click to expand...
licensing was at the end of 2013 so 2 1/2 but they are not under saddle as its in hand for conformation and movement then loose then lunged then they do the walk ring and are either licensed or not. the performance test is done at 3yrs old and ridability does come into it. while I would not use him on a mare of mine he did look better as a youngster and even though totilas has had his stud fee reduced this one could be a way for breeders wanting the genes to get them at a more sensible price
 
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Illusion100 said:
A horse pushed too much too early for his the sake of his sires reputation.

This exaggerated front limb movement that does not correlate to correct hindlimb movement is really getting on my tits. It looks ridiculous. Ladies and Gents, give ignorance and flash priority and soon enough top dressage horses will be the new GSD.

Just in this horse the front is so uphill and the backend so downhill. At this rate he'll be wrecked in a few years, the poor beggar.
Click to expand...

Took the words right out of my mouth.

His hind end is so weak is heart breaking to know he is being pushed to.l try and get the same back handed following as.hia sire.
 
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His back end isn't working correctly but don't think he is overly bad. He needs a more sympathetic rider now to get his back end moving properly. My horse moves better than that and he hasn't been schooled properly in 3 months. But i would worry if he wasn't tracking up correctly they don't seem bothered that tolegro isn't not even in walk.
 
npage123

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My favourite bit was the free walk on a long rein at the end of the test, not due to the quality of the free walk - was just relieved for Tolegro's sake to see him getting a bit of a break.
 
Goldenstar

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It's a pressure cooker environment , those small arenas with banks of seats round them.
He's very tense and it's spoiling his basic way of going .
Who knows what he turn into .
The rider looks to me to be riding very defensively .
 
ycbm

ycbm

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Goldenstar said:
It's a pressure cooker environment , those small arenas with banks of seats round them.
He's very tense and it's spoiling his basic way of going .
Who knows what he turn into .
The rider looks to me to be riding very defensively .
Click to expand...


He's been performing in those environments since he was less than three years old.

Compare him with his half brother Glock's Toto Jr under the pressure of an actual competition. Completely different movement, much nicer.
 
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