Towing legislation change? Slightly ranty mood!

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muffinino

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Please someone help; I've just thrown a massive, crying, shouting, swearing wobbly as I've read that the towing legislation has changed and those drivers who passed after 1997 can no longer tow unless they are accompanied by someone who has passed the B+E test and held it for over 3 years, rather than being accompanied by someone who has passed before 1997. This came into play after April 6 but I can't recall seeing anything in the news about it - I'm surprised it hasn't been a newsflash on HHO - or seen it mentioned by anyone on here - again, very surprising. I bought a trailer with the hope of getting some driving done going to shows, rides etc with a friend and her mam, who has a pre-1997 licence, so I'd get to practice driving and have some fun at the same time, plus it would help bring on my friend's horse.

Please don't say just take the test - I thought that getting a trailer + towing vehicle to gain practical experience in towing and parking before eventually taking the test would be a logical idea; apparently not. I thought that way I'd get more out of it in being able to go places, not just drive around in lessons and a test before having to start my savings from scratch and save up for a trailer. I was hoping that getting a bit of experience under my belt over the summer before having some lessons with a view to taking the test later in the year/early next year, but it looks as though that may be shot to pieces now :(

I may get away with driving on my own and will be contacting the manufacturers to get the MAM of my trailer tomorrow - as the car weighs 1915kg, I'm hoping that the trailer MAM will be less or that I will be able to get a downgrade if I only take my horse (who weighs a max of 450kg), therefore will be able to drive on my own. If I can't do that, I am proper gutted as I cacn't afford to do the training and test for quite a while, meaning my trailer will just sit on the yard, mocking me :(
 
I think this is only the case for lorries as had towing lesson only 1 month ago and instructor told me I was fine to still tow with my Mum or OH, neither of which has done any towing test
 
This was mentioned on the towing for numpties thread, I don't know for sure but it seems this only applies to those driving vehicles over the 7.5 tonne mark NOT car plus trailer outfits.....
 
dominobrown said:
I HATE the DVLA, they evil!
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Bloomin' confusing is what they are! I have a feeling this new legislation is probably something to do with EU regulations :p

I've looked on the Direct.gov site and can only find this:
http://www.direct.gov.uk/en/Motoring/DriverLicensing/CaravansTrailersCommercialVehicles/DG_4022564
which doesn't seem to mention who can sit with you. I will ring them in the morning and see if I can get sense out of someone, or maybe email to get it in writing. A friend up the yard had his van checked at a police checkpoint last week and there were DVLA reps there, but when he asked about the regulations about towing, weights, restrictions etc for me, they couldn't give him a clear answer! The copper actually said to tell me to just carry on and nobody would know because they don't check very often! All very well until I have a bump and my insurance is void! :o
 
it's still ok at the moment.

Someone posted a link on a thread below which had a statement from the BHS saying at the moment it doesn' include cars and trailers B+E. But they are looking into adding it in the future.
 
''I think this is only the case for lorries as had towing lesson only 1 month ago and instructor told me I was fine to still tow with my Mum or OH, neither of which has done any towing test''

competitiondiva said:
This was mentioned on the towing for numpties thread, I don't know for sure but it seems this only applies to those driving vehicles over the 7.5 tonne mark NOT car plus trailer outfits.....
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Sorry, don't know how to do double quotes in a thread yet :p


Both interesting answers, thank you. The problem is that there doesn't seem to be any clear guidance. I know because a friend text me to say she'd read it in Welsh Rider and seemed sure it was horse trailers. I found this website which also thinks its trailers:
http://www.towinghorsetrailers.co.uk/licensing_laws.htm
but cannot find anything on any official site? :/ Muchos confused!
 
galaxy23 said:
it's still ok at the moment.

Someone posted a link on a thread below which had a statement from the BHS saying at the moment it doesn' include cars and trailers B+E. But they are looking into adding it in the future.
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Thanks for that - is it the towing for numpties thread? I'll have a gander at the BHS site, too. Poor OH just had a very stroppy, 3year old-esque tantrum inflicted upon him, with tears, foot stamping and all!

*******os! Why oh why do they insist on making life difficult for us horsey people? They ban hunting, introduce useless passports, levy a horse tax, put stupid tax on decent 4x4s and now this?! We're not all rich toffs, you know! ;)

Oh well, at least I have fiund out a bit more about the towing legislation and may be a step nearer to understanding whether or not I can tow on my own (when I am brave enough!) :)
 
Im currently doing my trailer training and that is just the case for wagons. I think there was a write up in H&H not long ago and it said in it that it doesnt apply to cars and trailers and my towing instructor agreed. X
 
Charlotte125 said:
Im currently doing my trailer training and that is just the case for wagons. I think there was a write up in H&H not long ago and it said in it that it doesnt apply to cars and trailers and my towing instructor agreed. X
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Phew, that's a relief! I have just thrown a world class hissy fit for nothing! Actually, scrap that, there's always room for a hissy fit ;)
 
copied from other thread

The followine statement from the BHS:

BHS warns drivers of new legislations
New driving licensing legislation revoking ‘grandfather rights’, to accompany learner drivers in small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations will have a profound impact on the equestrian industry according to The British Horse Society.
From 6 April 2010 drivers who passed their car driving test before January 1997 will no longer be able to act as ‘supervising’ drivers to those learning to drive small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations (but not car/horse trailer combinations i.e. Category B+E). Crucially for the equestrian industry this will include 7.5 tonne horse boxes.
In a response to questioning by The British Horse Society, the Driving Standards Agency stated: “Drivers who passed their car driving test before January 1997 were granted implied entitlement, sometimes known as ‘grandfather rights’, to drive small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations. These are classed as categories C1, C1+E, D1 and D1+E and subject to certain restrictions.
“It should be noted that it was never the intention to allow learner drivers to drive a vehicle on public roads unless being supervised by a qualified driver who had passed a test for that category of vehicle.
 
galaxy23 said:
copied from other thread

The followine statement from the BHS:

BHS warns drivers of new legislations
New driving licensing legislation revoking ‘grandfather rights’, to accompany learner drivers in small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations will have a profound impact on the equestrian industry according to The British Horse Society.
From 6 April 2010 drivers who passed their car driving test before January 1997 will no longer be able to act as ‘supervising’ drivers to those learning to drive small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations (but not car/horse trailer combinations i.e. Category B+E). Crucially for the equestrian industry this will include 7.5 tonne horse boxes.
In a response to questioning by The British Horse Society, the Driving Standards Agency stated: “Drivers who passed their car driving test before January 1997 were granted implied entitlement, sometimes known as ‘grandfather rights’, to drive small lorries, buses and vehicle plus trailer combinations. These are classed as categories C1, C1+E, D1 and D1+E and subject to certain restrictions.
“It should be noted that it was never the intention to allow learner drivers to drive a vehicle on public roads unless being supervised by a qualified driver who had passed a test for that category of vehicle.
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Surely if we passed our test before 97 we did pass the test to drive a 7.5 ton The licence category was the same as a car at that time so I passed for that category so I should be able to supervise a learner in a 7.5 ton ????
 
No need for the hissy fit as the legislation DOES NOT apply to vehicles in category B+E (a vehicle with a maximum authorised mass (MAM) not exceeding 3.5 tonnes (3500Kg) towing a trailer with a MAM exceeding 750Kg). Although a good 'hissy' always works wonders.

The legislation, The catchily titled Stautory Instrument 2010/1203, The Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) (Amendment) Regulations 2010 can be found at:

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2010/pdf/uksi_20101203_en.pdf

The legislation came into force on 1st May this year and applies to drivers that supervise learner drivers of vehicles in categories; C1, C1+E, D1 and D1+E, basically vehicles between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes and larger mini-buses.

What it basically does is stop folk that passed their car test (category B) before 01/01/1997 from supervising learners, unless they have passed the appropriate test themselves. The Regulation requires that if you pass your C1 test now, you cannot supervise learners until you've held the licence for three years, which is no different from supervising learners in any other category of vehicle.

Agree that it would have been helpful if the legislation had been better publicised and explained. Seem to remember something in HHO around early / mid April.
 
GeeBee45 said:
No need for the hissy fit as the legislation DOES NOT apply to vehicles in category B+E (a vehicle with a maximum authorised mass (MAM) not exceeding 3.5 tonnes (3500Kg) towing a trailer with a MAM exceeding 750Kg). Although a good 'hissy' always works wonders.

The legislation, The catchily titled Stautory Instrument 2010/1203, The Motor Vehicles (Driving Licences) (Amendment) Regulations 2010 can be found at:

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/si/si2010/pdf/uksi_20101203_en.pdf

The legislation came into force on 1st May this year and applies to drivers that supervise learner drivers of vehicles in categories; C1, C1+E, D1 and D1+E, basically vehicles between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes and larger mini-buses.

What it basically does is stop folk that passed their car test (category B) before 01/01/1997 from supervising learners, unless they have passed the appropriate test themselves. The Regulation requires that if you pass your C1 test now, you cannot supervise learners until you've held the licence for three years, which is no different from supervising learners in any other category of vehicle.

Agree that it would have been helpful if the legislation had been better publicised and explained. Seem to remember something in HHO around early / mid April.
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So you would have to have passed your trailer test if you want to supervise a learner with a car and trailer that is greater than 3500kg total then ??????
 
perfect11s said:
So you would have to have passed your trailer test if you want to supervise a learner with a car and trailer that is greater than 3500kg total then ??????
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No, pre 97 licence holders can still supervise someone in a car with a MAM of up to 3.5 tonnes, PLUS a trailer over 750Kg.
 
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