Treeless saddles

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Mitchyden

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I'm having saddle hassle at the moment so I would like some advice on treeless saddles.
I backed Lana six years ago in a Torsion saddle but didn't find it particularly stable with a young Arab so when she'd finished changing shape, I bought her a FnE saddle.
She's just come back to work after two years off (for no reason other than I had a loss of interest in riding her), she's had the saddle checked and it's fine. It's quite a heavy saddle and I've noticed that she is getting little lumps along her spine after I've ridden which isn't right.
Today I decided to try her Torsion again and after riding the lumps weren't there. My problem is though that it doesn't sit right anymore, it's a bit up at the front which pushes me to the back of the saddle. Forgive me for being stupid but I thought with treeless saddles that one size fits all?! I did some research on google and I keep reading about changing the pommel size. How do you do this as it's enclosed?
 
Um, Nope, one size doesn't actually fit all, you need to exercise as much care (nay more so) with fitting a treeless saddle than you do with a treed one.

The problem is that all too often there is insufficient padding and protection around the area where the stirrup bars sit; whereas with treed saddles the tree will support and protect. So this is one thing you need to watch.

The other thing is that I was told when I first started off with treeless, by a very knowledgeable friend who rides with both treed AND treeless and is an Endurance rider, is that you should pay MORE not less attention to the pad underneath, than you would necessarily the saddle on top, as it is the pad which will provide the support and protection for the saddle.

The best - and only - thing you can do, IME, is to try some treeless saddles and see how you feel. There is a website called "Better Saddles" which will give you names of companies who make treeless saddles and you can try them for a week, it cost me £50 when I did this, and it is vital to be able to try before you commit yourself to buying. You could also ask around on FB pages say, and see if there's anyone in your area who'd let you borrow their saddle to see how you feel in it, and also how your horse goes. You need to go for at least a 2 hr ride on more than one occasion, and if schooling is your thing, you also need to do flatwork in it as well.

If buying, buy a well known make NOT a cheap import from India - lots of these on FB going cheap as chips but frankly I'd only use them as Guy Fawkes Day Bonfire fodder. You could...... just an idea, buy something on e-bay to try it, if its a well known make you could always sell it on again if it didn't suit. I've done this.

Re. the pommel changing, the well known makes like Barefoot have a zip across the top where you can take out the pommel insert that's there, and insert another size. They tend to come in a "Medium" size but also sizes are available, not cheap, but look on e-bay before you buy or even put up a FB post on horsey groups as someone might have one.

The Trekker saddles apparently have a much easier method of changing the width; they look awful with that daft donkey-saddle ring up in front, BUT it does have a useful purpose in that there is a turning device/key thing, which you then, I am given to understand, rotate and it very easily adjusts the width. I've never ridden in one of these, but a friend who's very knowledgeable about treeless saddles says they're worth having for this reason alone.

I've tried the following:

Heather Moffat, Vogue & Phoenix. It was my first treeless experience, and I found them, at that stage in my treeless riding, very uncomfortable, crocked me up for days after!!

HM FlexEE (pre gulleted version): as much good as a chocolate teapot, could never adjust the dang thing properly and it was a total PITA. E-bayed it in the end.

Barefoots: Lexington (ridiculously high cantle, would only suit a high-withered dressage horse); London (size 1 too small for me but fine for horse, size 2 too big); Cherokee, again size 1 too small for me but fine for the horse). So I've given up on Barefoots as their sizing is crazy, either way too small or way too big.

Libra: had one for a while, an old-fashioned leather version, would've been fine to chuck on a pony or for breaking, but didn't offer enough support.

Freeform: felt OK, very soft, BUT didn't offer enough support to my lower back after about an hour's riding, plus after a hot sweaty ride noticed marks on the horse where the stirrup bar indents sat........ not happy with that.

Current saddle is the new "Tor" GP saddle from Treefree. Lovely! It sits well and has a much narrower twist than most other treeless saddles and I can ride it in for over 2 hours without getting any discomfort. But wasn't cheap, however IMO worth it in order to be comfortable! I have also got one of their original "Exmoor" saddles; on the newer versions they've put out you can have the stirrup bars in the "forward" position which then means that your hips aren't turned out so much - I use this original "Exmoor" saddle on my loan pony (Exmoor!!) and it suits her well, but I do find that my hips tend to complain after about an hour as my legs are being put into an uncomfortable position; for this reason I'm looking out on e-bay and other second-hand places for one of these saddles with the stirrup bars in the "forward" position. I can heartily recommend the Treefree people, Johan and Andrea are craftsmen, based at Buckfastleigh in Devon, and their saddles are beautifully made, also their after-sales and support is fantastic. I bought my GP Tor after trialling it for a week, they offer a trial service. Highly recommend.

Hope you find something suitable OP. Finding a suitable treeless saddle is an equal nightmare to getting something treed to suit!!!
 
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it is unfortunately trial and error to find what suits you, and as MJR2BT says you do need the right padding underneath.

I love the barefoot saddles - I have the London, and love the HM Flexee finesse, but my horse hated the solution saddle - it gave him a bad back.
 
Thanks for your replies especially the super long one - it made very interesting reading. It looks like I'll be spending some money trying out different saddles!!
I think I'll just get a bareback pad and learn to ride in that, I'm sure it would be easier than trying to find a decent saddle!
 
My Torsion has a pommel zip and I removed the insert as it fixes the width which is no use. I re-stuffed with wool and it works well. Occasionally I add stuffing as it compacts. Removing the insert is controversial but it works for me.

The Libras are nice little saddles and better than a bareback pad. Inexpensive and comfy. As with all treeless get a proper pad; I like Suberpads and I also have a Haf and an Equitex. You absolutely must use a decent one though.
 
Sounds like the FnE isn't adjusted correctly... possibly too much curve in the panels.. I would suggest you get it fitted again.. as it sounds like her back shape / profile has changed..

they are heavy saddles but very well engineered.. but fitting them is an art form.

I not a fan of entirely treeless saddles I think some structure with a degree of flexibility is the best route...

And the underlying principle is that there is no saddle of any type that will fit all horses.
 
I only had it fitted a couple of months ago and Les hasn't had to adjust it at all in the last five years. I didn't know you could have too much curve in the panels - is it something I can adjust as I've adjusted saddles before and been told I've done it correctly?
 
Mitchyden said:
I only had it fitted a couple of months ago and Les hasn't had to adjust it at all in the last five years. I didn't know you could have too much curve in the panels - is it something I can adjust as I've adjusted saddles before and been told I've done it correctly?
Click to expand...

yes it something you can do yourself... the instructions are on the FnE website.. http://www.fnesaddles.com/fnefitting.shtml you could also call Les who might be able to advise having fitted it previously.
 
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