Tricky saddle fit help please!

[budatiger]

Horse in question. 15.2hh Welsh d x tb. Physically looks more Welsh. He has huge set far back shoulders, a broad curved short back but quite high withers.
New Wintecs are too flat and bridge badly. Old Wintec curved tree suit better, but if wide enough (extra wide gullet) sits too low on the wither. Thorowgood/K&M are too flat. Ideal H&C presses down on wither. Tekna shape the best so far, but in order to be wide enough the front panel starts too far down the wither/shoulder.
Any ideas what would suit? He's a loan horse so reluctant to spend mega bucks, but his saddle he came with is uncomfortable for him. Currently 2 month wait for local two saddlery! Neither have much used stock so pondering on using a saddle trial service as riding very limited currently.

Thank you.

 

[SEL]

I've got a pony sized saddle company one on my draft - but we still need a prolite pad underneath.

He's designed to pull logs out of woods, not to be ridden, which means a very short back (16 inch saddle!) and enormous shoulders. He's also got quite high withers and because he's pretty much retired there is muscle wastage behind them which is why the pad helps. I don't know enough to say whether they'd work for your horse, but I understand the frustration as I have 2 horse which are difficult to fit. I have a lot of reject saddles in the attic which I need to ebay!

http://www.thesaddlecompany.co.uk/our-products-mainmenu/pony-saddles/product/105-16-5-pony-gp

 

[Meredith]

I am no saddle expert but my big shouldered horse was fitted with a half panel saddle. Could you find one to try?

 

[Chumsmum]

Have a look at Farrington saddles, they seem to suit native crosses with similar build to yours?

 

[sychnant]

I have a Section C who sounds very similar, and have found the older style Jeffries saddles to be a good fit. He had a newer one in XW which fitted when he was particularly big, but now he's working he is back in a W.

 

[YorksG]

My older appy is very short backed, and I have long legs, so I have had to manage on a 16 1\2 inch saddle, for years. I have now got a solution saddle, which has solved all our fitting issues (shape change due to age etc). They are expensive new, but I think you can get hold of them second hand.

 

[sbloom]

The high withers and laid back shoulder simply mean that it's more visibly obvious that the saddle needs to be back off the shoulder. The Wintec is bridging mainly because of the panel, not the tree, I'd wager.

I had to edit the post to get it to work and now can't see your post to answer in more detail, will start another reply.

 

[sbloom]

Horse in question. 15.2hh Welsh d x tb. Physically looks more Welsh. He has huge set far back shoulders, a broad curved short back but quite high withers.
New Wintecs are too flat and bridge badly. Old Wintec curved tree suit better, but if wide enough (extra wide gullet) sits too low on the wither. Thorowgood/K&M are too flat. Ideal H&C presses down on wither. Tekna shape the best so far, but in order to be wide enough the front panel starts too far down the wither/shoulder.
Any ideas what would suit? He's a loan horse so reluctant to spend mega bucks, but his saddle he came with is uncomfortable for him. Currently 2 month wait for local two saddlery! Neither have much used stock so pondering on using a saddle trial service as riding very limited currently.

Thank you.

What seat size do you need, and how much space has he got? With his breeding he will probably need a flatter tree than you realise, flat in the rails (the lowest part of the tree/seat), the further back you can get the saddle the lower a pommel you can get away with, and the smaller the seat the further back you can get the saddle, though panel design has a BIG influence. You may be best with a very short "upswept" panel design to help with that.

A flatter tree/seat and well placed block on a slightly more forward flap will give you more seat space and leg space in that order, if you are able to go down in size.

 

[Bericote]

Being slightly 'out of the box' a good friend of mine rides/competes her native in a thorn saddle pad /equipad. It takes a little getting used to but it is surprisingly comfy and easy to adjust to.. Maybe see if you could trial one or find a cheaper second hand one.

 

[tda]

I'd try farrington, or a basic Ideal GP or WH

Fairly widely available second hand

 

[Palindrome]

Thorowgood does a high wither version, otherwise there is Albion SLK that is for high wither but perhaps out of your price range (although there is second hand).

 

[rara007]

Have you tried an ideal?

 

[foxy1]

Which Thorowgood /K&M have you tried? From your description I'd give the 'compact' range a try

 

[sbloom]

The TG/K&M Compact is very curvy, and actually the seat rides really small so you lose half the benefit. Witness the high wither version simply has a deeper panel and exactly the same seat/tree. I think too many horses are fitted with curvy rails/trees.

 

[budatiger]

Thank you for all the responses.

So far, we have tried the K&M cob, Ideal H&C, original Wintec pro dressage, latest Wintec GP, and a GP from somewhere in between. A K&M cob, a Kes dressage, a Tekna GP, a Sankey VSD and an unknown Farrington. Best were the Farrington and Tekna. All kindly lent by friends etc. I'm hoping to trial a Farrington Burford VSD.

SBloom, he's short coupled so don't think he can take any more than a conventional 17". If he was mine, I'd probably get a bespoke with upswept panel etc. but he's not. I'm 5'7 and long between hip and knee, which adds to the problem. I do prefer to ride long though and do not plan to jump.

I'm hoping to trial a few saddles as all the saddle fitters I I have approached (of which there are very few) have such long waits until they can see us and in the meantime I can't really ride.

 

[foxy1]

K&M cob has a flat tree, if you try the compact version the tree is more curved which you say you are after.

 

[sbloom]

He may only take a 17" but footprint length varies hugely, seat space for the rider varies hugely, and you haven't said how much room you need, if you only need 16" then that's problem solved. Sometimes riders (and occasionally some fitters) think larger saddles are better in order to spread weight more, but this can cause other bigger problems.

I will say again I think it's a mistake to go for a curved tree (and the K&M cob isn't THAT flat, but the panels are flat and long, both are an issue here), you need the panel to be short at the back not the tree to be curved. You do not need to go bespoke for this shape of panel, you might even find something used. An upswept panel can save up to 1", often with these shapes it's a good idea to fit forwards of the back rib with an even shorter footprint, this keeps the saddle on the flatter part of the back. Obviously you can't simply move a larger saddle forwards, it must be back off the shoulder. If you're running into sizing issues for you then a flatter seat, more forwards flap and higher set block all give more room in different ways, a curvy tree and small flap will make things worse in that regard.