Tryptophan?

[dwi]

How good is it as a calmer? Talked to the nice Equine America people at Chatsworth today to ask their advice on an instant calmer. Lil doesn't respond to magnesium calmers and so far hasn't responded to valerian although I'll keep her on it for a bit longer to see if it makes a difference.

I really need something strong to take the edge of her at shows as otherwise she just rears and bronks. I'm confident she'll settle once she's been out alot more but I need to not get killed in the meantime.

The nice lady on the stand recommended the SuperKalm paste but I wondered what people thought of it as its not cheap!

Thanks

 

[Sparkles]

Not used it myself tbh sorry!

Have you tried Oxyshot at all? A few people disgard it say itdoesn't really work, but we had a load last summer we tried on a few of our 'quirky' horses and it did really settle them and chill them out a lot more than others had so might be worth a shot?

 

[dwi]

Thanks, Oxyshot is on my mental list of things to try but a bit of me says it won't be strong enough for her. She's not just a bit stressy, she's full on insane. She finds other horses far too exciting and explodes when somebody else rides near her.

 

[Sparkles]

Yeah I did have that in mind....but then that said, it took the edge off an old one we had who was just completely bonkers and a flat out bolter, and that was just at home lol.

We found we gave him that first thing which took the 'edge/extra' off him to start with, and then we also added nupafeed to him after and then one more oxyshot and he got him right down to almost what we could call 'normal'.For him at least! lol.

Sorry I can't remember your posts off the top of my head,but could she have a hormone inbalance or anything? A mare of my mates is very much the same and even worse at shows, not been out since she went up and over last time with her but have since had it checkedand it just hormonal with her. So maybe regumate might be an option or similar?

 

[dwi]

If it was a hormone imbalance would it only show up when she's in season or would it account for her being crazy the whole time?

 

[KitKat_89]

Now you've got me genuinely confused! Tryptophan is an amino acid, how is it supposed to work as a calmer?

ETA: That isnt meant to sound harsh or anything (not sure how it reads) I would just like to know

 

[Sparkles]

Mate's mare wasn't just when she was in season, she was calmer over the winter months but is a hormonal diva from spring-autumn full-time pretty much. She's going in foal tbf to try and settle it, and then will be regumated after should she still need it.

 

[criso]

I know when I was using Maxacalm when bringing Frankie back into work after box rest, L-Tryptophan was one of the ingredients (along with magnesium and some other stuff).
I think it is supposed to help with Seratonin levels.
It seemed to help but I couldn't say which ingredient worked.

 

[dwi]

Now you've got me genuinely confused! Tryptophan is an amino acid, how is it supposed to work as a calmer?

ETA: That isnt meant to sound harsh or anything (not sure how it reads) I would just like to know

Absolutely no idea!

This is what's in it though:

http://www.equine-america.co.uk/docs/650A-UK 021308 Super Kalm Paste.pdf

That was kind of why I'm asking. The woman on the stall assured me it was really strong and good for horses that hadn't responded to magnesium calmers but I'm interested to know if its true or just a sales pitch.

 

[KitKat_89]

"Preparations that contain tryptophan are marketed world wide as calmative agents to treat excitable horses. Tryptophan is the amino acid precursor for serotonin, a neurotransmitter implicated in sedation, inhibition of aggression, fear and stress, in various animal species and humans. Experiments have shown that tryptophan supplementation decreases aggression in humans, dogs, pigs, poultry, and fish, and that it may reduce fearfulness and stress in calves, vixens and poultry. However, behavioural characteristics more closely linked to excitement, such as hyperactivity in dogs, are not modified by tryptophan supplementation. Research using a variety of animals other than horses, has shown that the behavioural response to tryptophan supplementation varies with age, breed and gender, and can be modified by diet, exercise, social status, and level of arousal. Significantly, the response is species-dependent, and there are no scientific publications that confirm the efficacy of tryptophan as a calmative in excitable horses. The few studies where tryptophan has been administered to horses suggest that low doses (relative to those contained in commercial preparations) cause mild excitement, whereas high doses reduce endurance capacity, and cause acute haemolytic anaemia if given orally, due to a toxic hindgut metabolite"

Well, that was easy, I should have googled it first! From a Vet journal article, 2005
Obviously this is only one report. Criso you were right about the serotonin!

Hope that helps?

 

[dwi]

"The few studies where tryptophan has been administered to horses suggest that low doses (relative to those contained in commercial preparations) cause mild excitement, whereas high doses reduce endurance capacity, and cause acute haemolytic anaemia if given orally, due to a toxic hindgut metabolite"

Well that doesn't sound good? I don't want her to be mildly excited or anaemic!

 

[KitKat_89]

lol, no that wouldnt be good! but the dose is quite low it probably wouldnt cause the anemia. If you do a search on google scholar a few good articles come up. You should be able to access the abstracts if not the whole thing.

Mostly the opinion seems to be inconclusive over using tryptophan. I would guess it wouldnt help much unless your hores is deficient already because of its diet

 

[dwi]

lol, no that wouldnt be good! but the dose is quite low it probably wouldnt cause the anemia. If you do a search on google scholar a few good articles come up. You should be able to access the abstracts if not the whole thing.

Mostly the opinion seems to be inconclusive over using tryptophan. I would guess it wouldnt help much unless your hores is deficient already because of its diet

Thanks, have googled it. The only evidence seems to be that it causes your horse to become mildly excited and reduces their stamina.

Definitely don't want that! Glad I didn't go for an impulse buy today then.

 

[cellie]

http://www.horseadvice.com/horse/messages/5/334661.html
You might be interested in this link.I have just taken delivery of so kalm powder after having same problems as you.I know its not seasonal with my mare as she has had marble inserted recently , although it has made big improvement spring grasss and general anxiety makes her a nightmare at times.Handling loading farrier etc she is exceptional but once she goes into adrenaline mode she is completely different horse.
Tonight we had new horse on yard and she bronced all round schooling ring took me 20 mins before she settled to do 15mins of good work.
The link gives different perspective on how tryptophan works.I start using powder tommorow so if you want updates keep in contact.I am also going to change her feed from alpha with oil to high fibre and reduce feeding levels .I think they are all generally feeling to good.

 

[chestnut cob]

Equine America calmers are fantastic! I used the SoKalm (I think?) instant calmer paste years ago on my Welsh cob and it sent him to sleep. It had more effect on him than the ACP I used to clip!

 

[Northhorse]

We use Magic and it works - even on the humans!!

 

[martlin]

I use that one L-tryptophan based calmer and find it very effective
http://www.equistro.co.uk/ProductPage/Equiliser.html