Tying up advice! Please help!

[Maz55]

I’m looking for some advice on possible tying up as this isn’t something I’ve experienced personally before. Last week my mare (who is in fairly light work although ridden 4-5 days a week usually) had three days off. I lunged her lightly Friday and then again on Saturday before having my usual lesson (which was all in walk so not particularly taxing on her). Saturday night I turned her out as usual with a light turnout not realising we were going to have heavy rain. Sunday morning the poor girl was shivering so I brought her in to warm up – rugged well and gave plenty of hay. She seemed fine. Sunday afternoon I went down and noticed she was quiet but just thought she was sleepy. I tacked her up and got on and immediately realised something was wrong – she was very stiff behind, taking short slow steps on her toes. I wondered if the cold might have got to her arthritis so asked for a few strides of trot - she was reluctant but did trot and didn't feel too bad but didn't seem to help so I got off. She looked particularly lame on her left hind. The yard manager saw her and thought she had popped her stifle. My immediate thought was that she had tied up. But her temperature was normal and she didn’t appear distressed, not sweating, and she was eating her hay normally. I struggled to get her to eat her tea but she’s often reluctant when there’s hay on offer and I had put some bute in it. Later that evening I checked on her and walked her up and she seemed a lot freer although still lame on the left hind.



I kept her in that night and the following day and then turned her out in the evening. She still looked a little lame on the left hind particularly turning, and the same on Tuesday. Wednesday morning the vet came and remarked how sound she looked – in fact he commented that trotting in a straight line she was better than he’d ever seen her (I’ve used the same vet ever since I’ve had her – I normally have every confidence in him). He felt her muscles and said everything appeared fine. He didn’t think she’d tied up – in view of the recent workload – so didn’t take any bloods. With hindsight I should probably have insisted. The assumption was she had probably done something silly in the stable and made herself sore, and a couple of days rest had been enough for her to get over it. She does have mild hock arthritis but it hasn’t really been a problem for her since injecting her hocks three years ago. Advice was to give her the rest of the week off but turnout out as usual and then lightly hack Saturday (tomorrow) and Sunday. He said to let him know Monday if I had any concerns.



After speaking to a friend whose friend’s horse tied up when it got cold and wet I’m starting to doubt the advice I’ve been given. Is it possible she could have tied up?



Incidentally I’ve been wracking my brains for other possible explanations and on investigation I have discovered that her balancer (which is supposed to be high spec) has much lower vitamin e levels than others and this likely means that she’s not getting enough as there’s very little grass in the field. I wonder if this might be a factor.



My immediate concern is if she did tie up, am I getting back on her too soon? Could I do more harm than good? Obviously I have no blood tests to check her levels with (kicking myself now).



Incidentally she has a small procedure Monday which requires a couple of weeks off work so won’t be doing anything after the weekend. Does anyone have any advice on bringing her back into work after that? Would you be extra cautious given this “episode” and what would you do? Thanks in advance!

 

[SEL]

It's a 10 day max turnaround with Animal Genetics for the hair test with type 1. If it's positive then I can help with return to work - i got sound advice with mine when she was diagnosed and use it whenever she has time off.

You can buy natural vitamin E from Forage Plus and Progressive Earth if you want to try supplementing.

It could easily be the cold & wet causing problems if your horse does have it (what breed?). I had a bad session with mine when her rug leaked last year. She bounces back pretty quickly if the right protocol is followed, although I now have a stash of muscle relaxants too.

 

[Maz55]

Thanks SEL yes I’ve ordered vitamin e from forage plus. On vets advice i am planning a very short quiet hack tomorrow to see how she is but if the pssm test is positive I shall certainly be in touch about returning to work fully after her two weeks off!

 

[paddy555]

as someone with a PSSM horse who tied up I would be very concerned. Even at this later stage I would get a blood test to get the CK and AST levels. In the meantime I would feed high vit e, rug with a heavy rug (far more than you think you need) and if possible I would exercise her by leading out in hand. (I walked mine working up to an hour in hand before getting back on after he tied up)
If you feed high dose vit e (say 8-10000iu per day) you may well see a very quick change in her, happier, more friendly, more comfortable. Mine changed within 2 days and by the end of a week on high dose E he was a different horse.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

When your horse goes in for it's op this week get them to take bloods anyway. It takes a long time (weeks) for the blood levels to return to normal so you will still find out if it was truly a tie up or not.

 

[Maz55]

Thanks all I very much appreciate the advice. I haven’t ridden, I’m going to insist on bloods tomorrow. I’ve also sent off hair samples for pssm test and ordered vitamin e!

 

[JulesRules]

Many years ago I had a horse on share. He was owned by the YO who had bought him as a favour to someone as he had been there a long time and he is a lovely horse (still going on in his 30s).

Anyway, for some reason the YO decided to loan him to someone (on the proviso I remained as his long term sharer). To cut a long story short she tried to turn a cob into a TB by feeding too little and working him too hard which resulted in an episode of tying up.

For months afterwards and well after the loaner causing the issue was well off the scene, he just wasn't right. He just wasn't his old self.

Anyway, I can't remember how it came about. I guess someone must have suggested it might help but I arranged for him to have a detoxifying bowen session. Now I'm normally a bit dubious about these things, but all I know is that afterwards, he was like a different horse. Totally back to his old self and full of beans. I couldn't believe it!

Anyway, a less scientific approach than others have suggested but it worked for us.

 

[Maz55]

Many years ago I had a horse on share. He was owned by the YO who had bought him as a favour to someone as he had been there a long time and he is a lovely horse (still going on in his 30s).

Anyway, for some reason the YO decided to loan him to someone (on the proviso I remained as his long term sharer). To cut a long story short she tried to turn a cob into a TB by feeding too little and working him too hard which resulted in an episode of tying up.

For months afterwards and well after the loaner causing the issue was well off the scene, he just wasn't right. He just wasn't his old self.

Anyway, I can't remember how it came about. I guess someone must have suggested it might help but I arranged for him to have a detoxifying bowen session. Now I'm normally a bit dubious about these things, but all I know is that afterwards, he was like a different horse. Totally back to his old self and full of beans. I couldn't believe it!

Anyway, a less scientific approach than others have suggested but it worked for us.

Thanks I shall certainly bear that in mind (although she appears fine now). I dont feed lots but doubt that is the cause as she has plenty of forage, balancer, linseed and purabeet still a fatty and although worked regularly is very rarely worked hard! She’s Connie x tb.

 

[SEL]

Connie x TB would not be especially high risk for type 1 PSSM. It isn't in TBs due to its draft horse origins. Saying that, I'd still do the hair test just because it's cheap and should be ruled out.

There are other forms of PSSM but unless you want to throw money at diagnostic tests then treating the horse as if it does have it first off can often lead to improvement. Natural source vitamin E, regular exercise, keep warm and possibly try Alcar as a supplement. Alcar didn't work for mine but has had really good effects with some tying up horses.

 

[paddy555]

Connie x TB would not be especially high risk for type 1 PSSM. It isn't in TBs due to its draft horse origins. Saying that, I'd still do the hair test just because it's cheap and should be ruled out.

There are other forms of PSSM but unless you want to throw money at diagnostic tests then treating the horse as if it does have it first off can often lead to improvement. Natural source vitamin E, regular exercise, keep warm and possibly try Alcar as a supplement. Alcar didn't work for mine but has had really good effects with some tying up horses.

I agree with para 2. At the end of the day you want a healthy rideable horse and that depends on management. PSSM (of whatever type) is a management disease. To live with it successfully you have to manage it and that management is different for different horses. I, personally, would cut out pura beet. I can't give you a reason but mine was better when S/B went. You can spend lots on tests but you still have to work out your own management regime. I would def. still test for CK and AST. The overwhelming consensus is on vit e and exercise. Rugging and warmth helps some, alcar helps some. For hard feed mine get alfalfa, micro linseed and copra plus supplement, vit e and salt. Not all do well on alfalfa but I am aiming for the more protein based feeds.
It would be interesting if you would update re the blood test idc.

 

[Maz55]

Received blood tests results today - CK slightly raised but AST normal. Vet said this is the wrong way round for tying up and couldn’t explain the results but said whilst raised the CK wasn’t high enough to warrant concern... I was convinced she’d tied up I’d have put money on it. I was also convinced there was something going on with her muscles for such an extreme reaction to what appeared to be the cold - or maybe not? Now what? Could there still be a muscle disorder or am I barking up the wrong tree? Still waiting for pssm1 results but presume that they’ll be negative in view of blood results?

 

[SEL]

It is unlikely but I have found with my PSSM mare that blood results don't always match up to what I'm seeing. She's looked awful and had only slightly elevated bloods and then had them taken on a precautionary basis for a vet lameness work up and they were sky high - she didn't even look stiff.

Vitamin E deficiencies can present like a myopathy and supplementing that will only harm your pocket. It has to be the natural vitamin E and its expensive.....

 

[Maz55]

Well let’s hope not pssm then although would be nice to know! Thanks yes have started giving natural vitamin e and also upped the linseed as a precaution- as you say the worst it will do will make me even poorer than I am already!