Ulcers have come back.. stumped

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Eventing97

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Hello

One of my horses had ulcers during spring last year (start of May/spring time). Treated with injections for 6 weeks and scoped clear (grade 2 squamous).

Started showing signs again last month. I did a lameness work up, was off behind. X Rayed & blocked both hinds, all feet x rayed, clear bar tiny change in hock - medicated with steroids both hocks - horse had 2 weeks off. Got back on for the first time after medicating and all ulcer symptoms were back, scoped asap after noticing and have the start of squamous ulcers and also glandular ulcers, vet said i've caught them early. Treating again with injections.

Really stumped getting to the cause of the ulcers returning. It happened in the 3 week period of been ridden as normal then having a lameness workup & hocks injected, to then getting back on and showing signs.

Does any one have advice where to go? My vets have no concerns for anything else going on with him.. he shows no obvious or subtle signs of anything else, and correct management, its a nightmare, i just want a happy horse!

Horses routine/feed:
  • Out in field 24/7 all year round, ab-lib hay, rested rotated fields with nice thick grass Has company 24/7.
  • Chaff and balancer he is fed is ulcer safe with no soya, sugar and starch below 6%. Has acid ease, equinectar in feed (ulcers have returned being on this so should I take that as these supplements don't work for him and try something else?).
  • Has chaff, hay net before riding. He is never without food, Normal poo's not runny etc
  • Worked 4 days a week, so willing to ride, the signs I knew they were back was because he started spooking at things in the arena and he would be a bit girthy. He doesn't buck, rear, nap
  • he's in great condition, lovely shiny coat. Same home with me since 3yo from breeder, horse is 7, hasn't done much at all, being slowly produced
  • Regularly has saddle, physio, teeth up to date etc
He's always gone a bit funny during april-may each year but I just thought spring grass freshness and didn't thick of uclers. If the grass was causing it, it doesn't make sense that they've returned in January? My fields are good quality, not overgrazed as on rotation and rested for half the year, topped multiple times during summer, have loads of land and only 1 horse, 2 ponies. I do strip grazing during summer as he is a very good doer but he still has hay all year round..

thank you
 
How frustrating 🥹 is he still sound?

Assume those supplements are doing nothing and ditch them. Or get something that is clinically proven, Science Supplements GastroKind is one of few with actual clinical research and you can use it alongside ulcer treatment…and then after treatment also. It has more chance of preventing them than anything else on the market (if you look at the actual science).

Is there any change to his routine or new horses arrived or others left? Has anything changed on the yard? Definitely worth checking saddle again as may have changed shape etc x
 
Bobthecob15 said:
How frustrating 🥹 is he still sound?

Assume those supplements are doing nothing and ditch them. Or get something that is clinically proven, Science Supplements GastroKind is one of few with actual clinical research and you can use it alongside ulcer treatment…and then after treatment also. It has more chance of preventing them than anything else on the market (if you look at the actual science).

Is there any change to his routine or new horses arrived or others left? Has anything changed on the yard? Definitely worth checking saddle again as may have changed shape etc x
Click to expand...
Yes he looks sound and great to my eyes, nothing obvious and he was only slightly short behind before, Thanks will look at gastrokind - I thought acid ease was. No change in routine, no change of ponies, all been on the yard for 3 years, nothing comes or goes, very quiet and chilled. Had saddle fitter out the day before the scope (last monday) and saddle was fine to rule that out 😞 x
 
Peglo said:
Could they have returned because of the changes in his hocks causing pain? Hopefully now they’ve been medicated they won’t return.
Click to expand...
I thought this but would that make sense that they've come 2 weeks after medicating and he wasn't showing signs the week before the lameness work up? The ulcers havn't been there long this time and vet said I've caught them early so I'm not sure if they would of already been there before the lameness work up
 
Eventing97 said:
Hello

One of my horses had ulcers during spring last year (start of May/spring time). Treated with injections for 6 weeks and scoped clear (grade 2 squamous).

Started showing signs again last month. I did a lameness work up, was off behind. X Rayed & blocked both hinds, all feet x rayed, clear bar tiny change in hock - medicated with steroids both hocks - horse had 2 weeks off. Got back on for the first time after medicating and all ulcer symptoms were back, scoped asap after noticing and have the start of squamous ulcers and also glandular ulcers, vet said i've caught them early. Treating again with injections.

Really stumped getting to the cause of the ulcers returning. It happened in the 3 week period of been ridden as normal then having a lameness workup & hocks injected, to then getting back on and showing signs.

Does any one have advice where to go? My vets have no concerns for anything else going on with him.. he shows no obvious or subtle signs of anything else, and correct management, its a nightmare, i just want a happy horse!

Horses routine/feed:
  • Out in field 24/7 all year round, ab-lib hay, rested rotated fields with nice thick grass Has company 24/7.
  • Chaff and balancer he is fed is ulcer safe with no soya, sugar and starch below 6%. Has acid ease, equinectar in feed (ulcers have returned being on this so should I take that as these supplements don't work for him and try something else?).
  • Has chaff, hay net before riding. He is never without food, Normal poo's not runny etc
  • Worked 4 days a week, so willing to ride, the signs I knew they were back was because he started spooking at things in the arena and he would be a bit girthy. He doesn't buck, rear, nap
  • he's in great condition, lovely shiny coat. Same home with me since 3yo from breeder, horse is 7, hasn't done much at all, being slowly produced
  • Regularly has saddle, physio, teeth up to date etc
He's always gone a bit funny during april-may each year but I just thought spring grass freshness and didn't thick of uclers. If the grass was causing it, it doesn't make sense that they've returned in January? My fields are good quality, not overgrazed as on rotation and rested for half the year, topped multiple times during summer, have loads of land and only 1 horse, 2 ponies. I do strip grazing during summer as he is a very good doer but he still has hay all year round..

thank you
Click to expand...
Do you know if the hay or grass is fertilised at all?
My 22 year old warmblood was never diagnosed with ulcers but I suspected hind gut and treated for it, but the one thing that made a difference was changing to an organic diet.
Not saying this is your case but just a thought
 
Eventing97 said:
I thought this but would that make sense that they've come 2 weeks after medicating and he wasn't showing signs the week before the lameness work up? The ulcers havn't been there long this time and vet said I've caught them early so I'm not sure if they would of already been there before the lameness work up
Click to expand...

I’m unsure but maybe since the ulcers are new they were only starting to develop when you got the hock treatment and now his hocks are more comfortable his ulcer symptoms are showing?
 
Spirit7 said:
Do you know if the hay or grass is fertilised at all?
My 22 year old warmblood was never diagnosed with ulcers but I suspected hind gut and treated for it, but the one thing that made a difference was changing to an organic diet.
Not saying this is your case but just a thought
Click to expand...
Our grass isn't fertilised but I'm unsure about the hay, it's a meadow/timothy soft mix from the local farmer.. interesting thank you, what did you treat the hint gut with please
 
Peglo said:
I’m unsure but maybe since the ulcers are new they were only starting to develop when you got the hock treatment and now his hocks are more comfortable his ulcer symptoms are showing?
Click to expand...
interesting thank you that could make sense, I guess I won't know for sure until the currently ulcers are cleared now and if they come back afterwards again
 
Eventing97 said:
I thought this but would that make sense that they've come 2 weeks after medicating and he wasn't showing signs the week before the lameness work up? The ulcers havn't been there long this time and vet said I've caught them early so I'm not sure if they would of already been there before the lameness work up
Click to expand...
He may not have SHOWN lameness or pain, but he may well have FELT it, which would cause stress and lead to the development of ulcers. Horses mask and compensate before things become apparent to us humans.
 
I have no experience with the injectable form of omeprazole. Assuming its the same as oral have the vets mentioned sucralfate?
When mine had ulcers the first time u just had omeprazole syringes, the ulcers returned, restarted the syringes with Sucralfate in her feed twice a day and they cleared up alot better. She also had slight changes to one hock that needed injecting, which we assumed was the cause
 
Eventing97 said:
Our grass isn't fertilised but I'm unsure about the hay, it's a meadow/timothy soft mix from the local farmer.. interesting thank you, what did you treat the hint gut with pleasure
Click to expand...
A course of Equisure. This was back in 2014. I’d check you’re chaff etc too as my horse was barefoot so showed up as footy (slightly short all round so not obviously lame) and much more spooky then normal, also wasn’t keen on his sides of tummy being brushed, he also used to get slight leg swelling overnight, I was told it was windgalls. It wasn’t.
Hope you get to the bottom of it.
 
Spirit7 said:
A course of Equisure. This was back in 2014. I’d check you’re chaff etc too as my horse was barefoot so showed up as footy (slightly short all round so not obviously lame) and much more spooky then normal, also wasn’t keen on his sides of tummy being brushed, he also used to get slight leg swelling overnight, I was told it was windgalls. It wasn’t.
Hope you get to the bottom of it.
Click to expand...
That's really interesting as horse was footy on stones (barefoot), had feet x rayed and nothing going on.. back legs also fill if he has a night in.. would this be from the grass/hay? It was around august last year I ran out of the previous years hay and went onto that years stuff but all from the same farmer. Thanks
 
Zoeypxo said:
I have no experience with the injectable form of omeprazole. Assuming its the same as oral have the vets mentioned sucralfate?
When mine had ulcers the first time u just had omeprazole syringes, the ulcers returned, restarted the syringes with Sucralfate in her feed twice a day and they cleared up alot better. She also had slight changes to one hock that needed injecting, which we assumed was the cause
Click to expand...
Yes I think it's the same as the oral maybe slightly stronger, it's 1 injection a week for 4-6weeks. He did have a tub of sucralfate back in the spring but they havn't mentioned it this time round, the ulcers aren't as bad as they were previously though I'ce got onto it early as knew the signs straight away from last time, maybe it's his hocks then and it's just the timing of everything, fingers crossed
 
Eventing97 said:
That's really interesting as horse was footy on stones (barefoot), had feet x rayed and nothing going on.. back legs also fill if he has a night in.. would this be from the grass/hay? It was around august last year I ran out of the previous years hay and went onto that years stuff but all from the same farmer. Thanks
Click to expand...
Check if and what hay is fertilised with, I moved to a yard and he was ok then hay changed and same issues, I called the farmer (yard owner was fine about it) and it was! Grass and rest of diet was fine and yard owner sourced unfertilised hay again and all ok. I’ve got mine at home now all fine regarding this issue. I feed Agrobs now and progressive earth balancers- my 4 year old has same diet and is also unshod and very shiny too!
 
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