Under feeding.

[Groom Mum]

I spoke to a nutritionist at Dodson and horell today. When I told them I was concerned about my two year old dropping a bit too much weight. They asked how much hay I was feeding. It was WAY too small. I give him about 2kg in the morning and same at night. The grass is rubbish right now. His field partner is dominant and I think he's getting the bulk of the hay. So they advised me to give him some male and foal feed with alfalfa A he has to have 500g twice a day I'm shocked I've been under feeding him and upset. Hopefully he will be ok. He's not emaciated but he's a baby and still growing.

 

[AdorableAlice]

At this time of year youngstock need adlib forage, hay or haylage.

 

[Groom Mum]

I'm horrified I didn't realise this but I've never owned a youngster before

 

[Magnetic Sparrow]

When they are growing they will drop weight incredibly quickly and even ad-lib forage won't keep weight on. I'm always wary of feeding concentrates, though, except in very modest quantities. I'd rather have a youngster a bit skinny rather than overweight.

It sounds like you very sensibly asked for advice from the experts and you are going to take it. Don't beat yourself up.

 

[EQUIDAE]

I feed my youngsters 2.5% of their weight. I wouldn't feed high energy concentrates as you can grow them too quickly and get joint problems. Have a look for a stud balancer that you can feed in smaller quantities and just add it to a handful of chaff - that way he is getting all his vitamins and minerals. Forage is the key

ETA - if your other horse is dominant you could put 3 piles of hay. I tend to tie nets up on the fence so that it doesn't all get trampled.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Have I remembered correctly that you have acquired these youngsters from a rescue? It sounds like you need some hands on help and advice on how to care for them tbh, as giving adequate forage to youngsters or indeed any horse is pretty basic.

Additionally, what is the worming status of these youngsters? What worm counts have they had, and what worming products have been administered?

 

[Groom Mum]

They are both right up to date with worming and vaccinations. I get help from the rescue centre. I know it may seem basic to know the hay quantity but this winter has not been a normal winter. I am up to my knees in slushy mud. The gras has been trampled into the mud. There's hardly any. I haven't owned a baby before and it's my first time going it alone on my own land. I'm not going to beat myself up, it's just it shocked me that he would need so much hay. That like over three haynets a day. !! I am lucky in that I have plenty of support from the centre. It's just I didn't think he was losing more than he should be. He's not even too bad but he looks more worry by the day and I was worried. I'm glad I asked for advice though. Now I can make sure he's getting his vitamins.

 

[EQUIDAE]

You were asking at the end of Dec about him losing weight and were told to up his forage then. I'm sorry but it doesn't strike me that you are taking this seriously - you have rescue horses, they should not be starving - how is that better than what they came from? I may be unpopular but it sounds like you need some tough love. Feeding is absolute basic and you must read up on it. You also need to let the charity know they are underweight - you are over a month further down the line now. Rescues will not have the same resilience as 'normal' horses so you really need to act. If you are down to no grass and just mud you need to be feeding a lot more - I feed my 14 - 14h3 horses around 12kg of hay each minimum per day. That's about 4 normal sized haynets a day or two of the bigger ones.

You may also consider trying to rent further land if the land is trashed and you cannot stable. If there is just mud a lot of the hay you put out will be trampled and wasted.

Eta - it's good that you are asking for advice but you did that a month ago and didn't follow it. Please act this time

 

[Groom Mum]

Excuse me. But you didn't tell me to give him 10kg a day you said up it which I did and how dare you say I'm not taking this seriously. You have absolutely no right to say that to me. Do you have rescue horses? I'm betting you don't. I won't ask for advice here again

 

[EQUIDAE]

Excuse me. But you didn't tell me to give him 10kg a day you said up it which I did and how dare you say I'm not taking this seriously. You have absolutely no right to say that to me. Do you have rescue horses? I'm betting you don't. I won't ask for advice here again

I have two myself and I do backing for a registered charity. I have a lot of involvement with rescue horses. There are plenty of references available online for the correct amount of forage to feed - you have a responsibility to the horses to feed them correctly. I am not going to sugar coat this - you need to do right by those rescues and you need to let the rescue know that their weight has dropped and ask for their help. It sounds like you are hugely under experienced and need help - it's not good asking for answers on the internet if you aren't going to follow up on it. You need practical help from the charity.

Eta - is 10kg the correct amount? To put weight on you will need to be feeding 2.5% of their body weight.

Please get over your annoyance at my post - I am speaking the truth. These are rescue horses and need experienced care. It is fine to be inexperienced, what isn't fine is to ask for advice and then not follow it.

 

[9tails]

How much do you expect horses to eat? Because 2kg of hay is minuscule. Two horses who are getting no grass will likely eat a small bale between them. Small bales weigh about 20-25kg.

 

[Orca]

OP, as EQUIDAE says, you should be feeding 2.5% of your horses bodyweight (or even ad lib, where weight control isn't a concern and for youngsters). If you have no grass and have been feeding 4kg of hay, then you have only been feeding enough for a 160kg poor doer to keep weight through winter. This is around the size of a small miniature Shetland.

I have no idea what size your youngster is? Regardless, if you have no grass, you have to compensate forage. This winter has been no different to any other, really. This year, the wet finished your grass but in other years, it will be the cold and frosts that do it. Either way, winter forage compensation is completely normal in most areas.

I'm glad you received advice today and good luck in restoring the youngster to good health. I agree with others, that you probably should seek the support of the rescue. They will want to help.

 

[Groom Mum]

Had the welfare/rescue inspector out today. I called them about my concerns. He came took one look at my baby and laughed at me and told me I spoiled him. He measured him and said he's no where near thin. I just thought he looked thin. But he said some drop more weight than others and because they came to me fat I've noticed it more on him. I gave them 3 full to bulging haynets today each weighing 3kg I was prepared to give them same for tonight but they hadn't eaten all of today's quota. So I put one more full net up. Gave them their second feed and they seemed happy. So now I can sleep tonight knowing I haven't starved them.

 

[Sugar_and_Spice]

Your horses have been checked by the charity and are fine so that's great. I'm telling you this in case its relevant in future. It seems that most haynets these days are the small holed kind, designed to slow down the eating for fatties. So if you ever need a horse to put on weight its better to have the large holed haynets so they can scoff as much as possible.

I don't envy you the mud. My field looks like a swamp after constant rain but luckily it drains well and will be fine in a day or two. Not long until spring :smile3:

 

[Groom Mum]

Thank you. I have one small holed net and three large holed too. I'm moving them into my other field on Saturday. There is an abundance of grass in there. It's time to rest this field now. It's quite trashed. Many thanks for the positive comments.

 

[EQUIDAE]

Thats great news that they Think all is good

How many acres do you have? A good way of managing the land is to keep rotating every few weeks so the grass can recover a little bit. Unless of course you don't have enoug land per horse and then you just have to sacrifice a small area.

 

[npage123]

Only referring to vit/min supplements now, our Yard Owner's stallion and youngsters (and all the other horses on it) are marvelously blooming and thriving on Stamm30

http://www.saracenhorsefeeds.com/products/balancers/stamm-30-stud-performance-balancer

Not sure if you need anything other than ad lib forage, but I thought I'd mention the Stamm30 in case you're considering balancers/supplements - the horses on our yard are all looking fantastic due to it.

 

[Groom Mum]

My two year old is having a mare and foal mix with some alfalfa A. My eight year old is having chaff few pony nuts and a scoop of multivitamin feed. I think I'm well covered now. Hopefully I will go into spring with two little thrivers !! I love them both so much.

 

[Leo Walker]

Had the welfare/rescue inspector out today. I called them about my concerns. He came took one look at my baby and laughed at me and told me I spoiled him. He measured him and said he's no where near thin. I just thought he looked thin. But he said some drop more weight than others and because they came to me fat I've noticed it more on him. I gave them 3 full to bulging haynets today each weighing 3kg I was prepared to give them same for tonight but they hadn't eaten all of today's quota. So I put one more full net up. Gave them their second feed and they seemed happy. So now I can sleep tonight knowing I haven't starved them.

youngsters can look poor even when they arent. They tend to show ribs easier than a mature horse, but if you condition score the whole horse it gives you a better idea

Just be careful with the mare and foal mix. Its not really suitable for most youngsters, despite what it says on the tin! You would be better off with more forage, like your doing, then something like Suregrow which is much less likely to cause huge growth spurts

 

[EQUIDAE]

My two year old is having a mare and foal mix with some alfalfa A. My eight year old is having chaff few pony nuts and a scoop of multivitamin feed. I think I'm well covered now. Hopefully I will go into spring with two little thrivers !! I love them both so much.

Just double check you are feeding young stock mix that is suitable age 1-3, and not foal mix that you should stop feeding at 12m. They have differing ratios of vitamins and minerals in x

 

[Magnetic Sparrow]

Equidae, if you read the original post, the OP said she was feeding what was recommended by the D&H equine nutritionist. You do come over as somewhat overbearing on this thread. Can I point out that if people come on here looking for advice and reassurance, if other posters jump all over them they won't ask again and won't get the benefit of advice from more experienced people like yourself?

 

[EQUIDAE]

Equidae, if you read the original post, the OP said she was feeding what was recommended by the D&H equine nutritionist. You do come over as somewhat overbearing on this thread. Can I point out that if people come on here looking for advice and reassurance, if other posters jump all over them they won't ask again and won't get the benefit of advice from more experienced people like yourself?

The OP asked questions in December but people weren't specific enough she said. Just trying to clarify as she said mare and foal mix, which isn't suitable for a 2yo, but youngstock mix is.

 

[Groom Mum]

It's what I wanted to say magnetic sparrow. I wasn't going to come back after some of last nights feedback I found it insulting and demeaning. It can make people lose confidence in their capabilities. I love coming here and asking advice because there are many people a lot more experienced than me. But it's not nice when certain people overbear to the point of bullying. Subject of my feed I'm feeding mare and foal so guess it's for older ponies too. Seeing as it says mare on it.

 

[EQUIDAE]

It's what I wanted to say magnetic sparrow. I wasn't going to come back after some of last nights feedback I found it insulting and demeaning. It can make people lose confidence in their capabilities. I love coming here and asking advice because there are many people a lot more experienced than me. But it's not nice when certain people overbear to the point of bullying. Subject of my feed I'm feeding mare and foal so guess it's for older ponies too. Seeing as it says mare on it.

It's for pregnant and lactating mares.

I'll leave you to it. Obviously my experience isn't the sort of experience you want so I won't waste my time any further. Good luck

 

[honetpot]

It's for pregnant and lactating mares.

I'll leave you to it. Obviously my experience isn't the sort of experience you want so I won't waste my time any further. Good luck

I have to agree with you.

 

[Leo Walker]

I really hope this isnt overbearing etc But nutritionists work for the feed companies and are paid to sell more feed. If you look at the recommended amounts on ANY feed bag is way more than any horse should get. I dont know about D&H, but the Spillers feed help line is staffed by office staff. You ring and they open a program and click on options depending what you say :/

There is a very real risk in feeding a 2yr old mare and foal mix. The mare bit of it is for mares that are in the last stages of pregnancy or lactating. It really isnt the best feed for a youngster as it can cause huge, quick growth spurts which can cause OCD etc. Have a look at the Suregrow I recommended, but even better would be the ad lib hay your feeding and something like AlfaA with a good, no iron balancer added.

But dont take my word for it Go and do your own research

 

[9tails]

How big are these ponies?

Equidae is correct that mare and foal feed probably isn't the correct feed for a 2 year old, as she says it's for pregnant and lactating mares that are feeding their foals. Have a look at Suregrow, a balancer designed for growing youngsters.

 

[Groom Mum]

There is a very real risk in feeding a 2yr old mare and foal mix. The mare bit of it is for mares that are in the last stages of pregnancy or lactating. It really isnt the best feed for a youngster as it can cause huge, quick growth spurts which can cause OCD etc. Have a look at the Suregrow I recommended, but even better would be the ad lib hay your feeding and something like AlfaA with a good, no iron balancer added.

Thank you for that. That's a bit worrying. I will go look at something else tomorrow. It's actually worrying that it could be detrimental to his health. He's getting lots of hay now. I will find something more suitable.
Eguidae. It's not that I'm not listening to your advice I'm sure you are far more experienced than me. It's just the way you come across, it is passive aggressive. I'm a psychologist so on that subject I do know what I'm talking about. Thanks anyway.

 

[9tails]

3kg of hay would last my 16.1 about an hour. Seriously. I don't know how big your youngster is but I suspect he must be a mini or your hay isn't good quality and therefore unpalatable.

 

[Groom Mum]

I can't seem to find this sure grow. Anyone know where I can find it ? Thanks.