Unqualified 'Instructors'

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Shilasdair

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How do you all feel about unqualified 'instructors'?
What qualifications would you look for? Would you ask to check/see if your Instructor was registered with a regulatory body?
Do you ever ask if they are insured or are you 'not bothered' if they're not?
Just curious
S
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My instructor isn't qualified - at least I don't think she is. But she is very good and has years of competion experience

Re insurance - I wouldn't sue if I had an accident - broke my arm in one of her lessons once
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the best instructor I ever had was unqualified - yet he had competed for britain showjumping and evented at Badminton. I prefer a rider who 'can' to a rider who has a certificate. My worst instructor was an AI who had no idea
 
I would use any instructor, qualified or unqualified if they were a good rider and had a lot of experience, some 'good' qualified people don't have the experience behind them to help you out with all your probs!
 
Do you read 'qualifications' to mean BHS exams? Or ABRS exams? Or Parelli?
Or appropriate experience?
But do you know/care if they are insured...what if you have a fall and need medical care?
S
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PS I'm just interested!
 
In my book experience counts far more than qualifications. I would however ask if they had insurance and I think most sensible instructors would as its their business and they would need to cover themselves if they were injured as well as if anything else happened.
 
I teach quite a bit and i am not qualified. Well, i have my pony club B and H tests and my stage I and II. I have been riding and competing for nearly 30 years and i am told i am a good instructor. Put it this way, they all keep coming back! and they all get good results when competing!
I have had lessons with alsorts of people and i wouldnt have a clue whether some of them were qualified or not. I have also had a lesson with a top event rider and learnt absolutely nothing cos she couldnt put it across very well, even though she is a fabulous rider and competes at the olympics!
Someone i know took her AI and she had absolutely no natural teaching ability at all yet she still passed.
To me it means nothing if someone has a piece of paper saying they can teach, you either have the talent or you dont.
Its not something you can learn from a book!
 
There are great teachers who can't demonstrate the skills and skilled riders who can't describe the theory. Then there's the trainer who can describe what they would do to make the horse go better but not what the less eperienced rider could do to improve. You pays yer money I reckon. Most recently my trainer is a 4* event rider who I get on with and who isn't qualified but, I prefer that to an AI who can't jump a course over 3'! (I say that as an AI who struggles over a course over 3' as am wimp!)
 
Someone could have all the qualifications in the world and still not be able to teach well

All my instructors are qualified but that's purely because I ride at a BHS where to train yard.

I wouldn't turn down Lucinda Green, just because she's not got offical certificates as such
 
It's far more important to me that the person teaching me has the relevant competition experience and then ability to put their point across, than it it is to have a piece of paper.

My coach when i was a teenager had no qualifications at all...i *think* although i'm not sure...that he does now hold some sort of BHS qualification. However, he has won the Hickstead Derby, the Puissance at HOYS, represented GBR on Nations Cup teams and more recently was national coach to one of the lesser SJ'ing teams in Athens. He also has an amazing ability to communicate with his pupils.

As for the insurance aspect of things....what exactly is the issue. If i fall off and damage myself in a lesson, it's my bleedin' stupidity. I'm not going to blame the instructor, and i certainly wouldn't claim against them.....it's not an issue for me if they are insured or not
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I would always choose my instructor from recommendations and word of mouth. As to whether they are qualified or insured is does not come into it. Why would I need to know if they are insured? Basically if I'm not confident to something I would say and I certainly wouldn't be looking to sue if something went wrong.
 
All these unqualified Instructors are going to get a nasty shock come 2012 when it becomes mandatory to hold the UK Coaching Certificate. It is proposed that, as with unqualified farriers, it becomes a criminal offence to teach riding without being qualified and registered.

There are a lot of safety issues, including child protection, that are not addressed without being properly trained and qualified and insured. To teach in regular schools and collages you have to be qualified as a teacher. As one of the top 10 most dangerous sports with a poor safety record Horse Riding is definitely in the firing line for this treatment.
 
All well and good....but anyone with a driving license can sit alongside a learner driver and *teach* them to drive a car....which is more dangerous do you reckon
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Im afraid for me, most "qualifications" arent worth the paper they're printed on
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Particularly when it comes to the BHS ones

You find amazing riders in the most unusual places and being a good teacher is a gift. There are so many good riders who are useless at explaining things to their students (some of these are qualified and approved by various societies but it doesnt make them good).

You can also find that some fantastic teachers havent had an amazing competition career either because they aren't personally competitive or because they prefer the training side of things (both of horse and rider)

So no, I personally dont give a damn whether or not someone is "qualified". If i like the way someone rides, the methods they use and they can help me to understand things, then if theyre willing, I'd take the opportunity to learn from them.

Ive trained with a few classical people who've been awe inspiring to watch and helped me so, so much but have zero interest in being credited trainers with any society and have probably never been members of the BHS in their lives, let alone considered taking exams with them
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Well - unless you pay someone in full view, no one can prove that that trainer is 'teaching'. Could just be 'helping'! (Pay them later!!)

Would rather be taught by someone unqualified who has been there, done it, and rides better than I do, than someone who tells me to 'ride with my heels down, toes up and canter to the end of the ride'!
 


I would be careful when finding someone though to ensure they really know what they are on with. Qualified people are in my opinion trained to keep you and your horse safe and are covered by insurance, this does matter a lot. They are also upto date on all aspects of horse and rider, dont forget they have spent many years, time, money and hard work to become an instructor.

I would not be afraid to use somebody that is unqualified, as many of the top riders are not, I would just bear the points I have made in mind.
 
Thanks for all your replies to this - very interesting.
In my experience (and God knows I've needed a lot of lessons!) the best instructors are the ones with the BHS qualifications AND the experience AND the competition success...they seem to go together.
I am surprised at how few people understand what insurance could be used for....and the problems for both instructor and pupil after an accident if none is held.
I'm also surprised that no-one has mentioned CRB checks....which, if I had children, I'd want.
Thanks to Tiga7592 - I did wade through it.
S
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If the 'instructor' helped me improve and got along with my horse i don't think i'd care.
If i hurt myself i wouldn't blame them (unless they had obviously been careless and asked something ridiculous of my horse - but then i would give myself enough credit to know when to say 'are you bl**dy kidding me?!). Falling off and injuries are all part of the risks we take when we ride horses, they are unpredictable, flight creatures.

Please don't shoot me down if i'm wrong but i'm fairly sure Carl Hester has no 'qualifications' as such yet he is an awesome rider and is able to charge a fortune for lessons and clinics, just like lucinda green (i think she was the one mentioned earlier!)
 
[ QUOTE ]
All these unqualified Instructors are going to get a nasty shock come 2012 when it becomes mandatory to hold the UK Coaching Certificate. It is proposed that, as with unqualified farriers, it becomes a criminal offence to teach riding without being qualified and registered.

There are a lot of safety issues, including child protection, that are not addressed without being properly trained and qualified and insured. To teach in regular schools and collages you have to be qualified as a teacher. As one of the top 10 most dangerous sports with a poor safety record Horse Riding is definitely in the firing line for this treatment.

[/ QUOTE ]

...and you can guess who is already making moves on being the representative organisation...BHS membership anybody?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Thanks for all your replies to this - very interesting.
In my experience (and God knows I've needed a lot of lessons!) the best instructors are the ones with the BHS qualifications AND the experience AND the competition success...they seem to go together.
I am surprised at how few people understand what insurance could be used for....and the problems for both instructor and pupil after an accident if none is held.
I'm also surprised that no-one has mentioned CRB checks....which, if I had children, I'd want.
Thanks to Tiga7592 - I did wade through it.
S
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Can you elaborate on the insurance issue?

Thanks
 
I think if I was a non horsey parent looking to find an instrutor for my novice child I would be keen to find a qualified BHS instructor.

As an adult I can honestly say qualifications have never crossed my mind and I actually doubt any of the best instuctors round here are qualified
 
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Can you elaborate on the insurance issue?

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It's all very well saying that you wouldn't claim if you were injured...and if it was a minor injury you would have a choice. BUT, if you were injured badly so that you were in a wheelchair or worse and couldn't work or support yourself or your family or needed nursing care for the rest of your life?

If you are a parent of children or have other dependants your loved ones would wish to claim for your loss, especially if there had been gross negligence. These things happen, and they happen MORE with unqualified Instructors and ex-competitors who haven't been formally taught to teach.

The psychology of teaching a skill needs to be learnt, not just the skill itself, if you are to pass it on to another person who may have very different body type and learning strategies to your own.

Regardless of what Instructor you go to I would strongly advise you make sure that they have insurance cover for their teaching.
 
Hi again
A few points in response;
1. You have a lesson from an uninsured instructor, over jumps, it goes badly wrong, you have a fall and end up in a wheelchair, unable to work. Your children need cared for, the mortgage needs paid...after the accident, you realise the jump distances were wrong for your particular horse. You would have to sue your instructor for costs, and for the money to survive.
2. If you are teaching without insurance (brave you!) and this happens, the court awards damages to the rider of say, £250k (a conservative estimate) then you'd have to sell your house, cars, horses, everything to pay up. I wouldn't risk it!
3. Child protection - it's not unknown for paedophiles to gravitate to jobs where they are left in positions of authority, alone with children, esp where physical contact could happen. A CRB check stops a child rapist teaching your daughter/son.
4. I have done a bit of teaching in my time (I'm old) and have recently seen my ex students who don't know ass from elbow teaching others with great authority over wrong distances, with no real understanding, with the cry 'I don't have BHS qualifications I'm a DRESSAGE/EVENT/SHOWJUMP rider!' (delete as appropriate). These 'instructors' are keen to tell you how BHS exams don't mean a thing if you're a competitor...but I can let you into a secret....they failed Stage 2 four times because they were so damn bad!
5. Would you not want your instructor to have first aid quals....in a high risk sport?
Sorry to be cynical but I've seen some god awful riders setting themselves up as gurus so wanted to know how they 'got away' with it...
S :-)
 
I do have to chuckle at your pint 4 above.....in my experience it is the BHS 'qualified' instructors who generally build the distances completely wrong, and the 'unqualified' riders with competition experience that get them right
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As for your points regarding insurance, i agree from the perspective of the instructor, they would be well advised to have cover, but as far as i am concerned as a student, my personaly life insurance will cover all the eventualities you list above
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Got to say I agree with Rambo 100%
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You're making a very broad generalisation to suggest that those who dont have or aren't interested in having BHS qualifications dont purely because they cant :P

There are a lot of people who dont agree with the BHS on a number of levels.. on the way they teach, on the way they respond to certain issues...

The reality of it is that plenty of people holding their BHS teaching qualifications are poor. The BHS is a mockery of a system compared with, for example, the German reiterschule exams or the Danish qualifications.

Ive done my BHS exams. Ive seen the standard of some AIs that have applied for jobs on my last yard. They are very little guarentee of a good teacher.

Point 5 - You dont need your AI to have taken first aid courses. We routinely went on them as grooms and AIs together.
 
first aid course is given to any body wishing to take them in any field of work or voluntary member of a group , society or club--

i teach and i do not hold any bhs exams i have expreince in many fields in the equine industry and i have insurance -

what makes a good instructor other than expeince in ther chosen disapline carl hester lucinda etc they have been there done it and worn the t shirt they know the pit falls the effort the trials the hardship the tears the joys the downfalls the sucess and unsucess becuase they have actually done it
of course they knowledge is worth heaps and of course there is or others that one day will take there place to be what they once were or are --
then you have the bhs - very good instruction equine yards fair better than perhaps a one to one --
meaning they have more to offer in there services
or perhaps an AI with pure text book knowledge - who knows
nothing other that what helped her to past the test

then you get what i call slly women in hairnet jobs that know p

but in all it to encourage the rider and the horse to move forward in there chosen disapline - who they have is a matter of choice --- price -- and ability -- caperbailites
and a good instructor can ride anything -- as they should be able to do what they preach--
 
I am BHS qulaified and will soon be on the register when I have done my first aid course, yet most people will use me because I have 18 years experience and have competed and trained horses at low level affiliated showjumping and dressage. However the qualification does prove that I have at least done some professional training and passed exams at some point and was a good base for all later learning. I do think the AI on it's own is fairly meaningless.

Also my instructor is not BHS qualified but is a recognised BD trainer, so is 'qualified' in that sense and it also means she will have insurance, although it wouldn't bother me
 
Thank God for non-BHS-qualified instructors is all I need to say!!!

Oh, and of course the ones who are qualified but have subsequently seen the light!
 
Thanks for your responses, but you miss my point. I am not particularly interested in BHS quals either but I believe an instructor needs;
1. To know what they're doing - and you all have to agree there are some really dangerous ones around - if you are a student, you are relying on their expertise perhaps erroneously.
2. To have insurance to protect themselves and the rider, in case, God forbid, something goes wrong.
3. To be responsible enough to have first aid training in a high risk industry.
4. To be safe around children (I don't know any other way other than CRB checks to find out this one?).
I am sure you'll all agree with this?
S
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