Unreasonable yard owner?

galacasinoking

galacasinoking

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Hi! I have been at this private yard since January. There are no other horses, so its not a livery yard, its just rented land/stables. The last few months I have come to realise that I dont have enough land/grass so need to move. I have found a place with alot more land which I am moving to ready for September. I told my current yard owner that I had looked at a place and was probably moving, earlier in the week and I told him yesterday that I am definitley moving. He was very funny with me. I have no contract and he didnt mention any specific amoints of 'notice' he wanted when I started there. Ive spoken to a few people who have all said if I have no contract then a weeks notice is fair. So I've given him that but he was very rude. He moaned that some of the fence rails had been pushed over (they are actualy rotten in the ground) and he said the reason my horses are leaning over the fence is because I feed them too much extra food so their greedy (my one horse is a 23yr old TB so needs extra food and there is no grass so I like to feed some hay!) I saw him this morning and he said I should of known there would not be enough space before I took the place on (I only had 2 when I went there, I now have 3) He said that he now has no grass for any new horses that come. Also he said he should have a months notice. I tried to explain that he can use that month to let the grass grow but he was just funny with me. He then said to me 'well I hope one day, you will wake up and realsie you dont have a life' I said 'I have got a life' and he replied 'no you havent, picking up **** all day is not a life' then he walked off
Am I in the wrong or is he being unreasonable? I feel like im getting 'slated' for keeping my horses in good condition. My rent has always been paid on time, I muck the fields out & I keep the yard immaculte (which he was always commenting on) so I have not given him any problems
 
some people are just difficult assh*les. I wouldn't give any of his comments a moments notice. You'l be shot of him soon and never have to deal with him again
 
No excuse for rudeness but I can see why he was stressed. From his point of view, he is losing the rent from his only livery with just a weeks notice. It doesn't give him much time to advertise/find someone else. Being near to the end of the grazing season after a rainless summer, there's little grass left for new horses coming before winter.
I think a months notice is fair in this case.
 
He's just p*ssed off that he is losing some income. That's all you were to him in reality, so I wouldn't feel too sorry for him. There could easily be someone who is happy to have less grazing because they've got a fattie, so the lack of grass arguement doesn't wash. He should be grateful you have kept the yard clean and tidy. I noticed today at mine how many empty drinks cans and bottles there are lying around by the stables and I'm poo-picking for all the horses out with mine because no-one else can be bothered = 7+ barrows per week (despite it supposedly being a rule).
 
Mardy bloke as usual!

I wouldn't want to keep my horses with someone with such an attitude.

He has no comeback on you for notice or infact anything, you do on him though as you have no contract, you are legally allowed to keep them there without paying.
( Should you wish!)
 
I think he is very unreasonable, but I suppose you will just have to put up with him until you move yards..

A weeks notice is fine! (I gave my old employer 3 days notice when I left my job!! - Nothing he could do as I had no contract!! :p)

As others have said - He will just be worrying about the income..

Don't worry about him! - I wouldn't!! :D
 
horserider said:
No excuse for rudeness but I can see why he was stressed. From his point of view, he is losing the rent from his only livery with just a weeks notice. It doesn't give him much time to advertise/find someone else. Being near to the end of the grazing season after a rainless summer, there's little grass left for new horses coming before winter.
I think a months notice is fair in this case.
Click to expand...

If the income / managment of grazing is important to him then he should have outlined this at the beginning e.g saying how much notice is needed etc - I don't think that sort of thing should have been left to the OP
 
It depends how you rent the field, if you pay monthly then regardless of contract or not you are obliged to give a months notice and/or money. If he chose to take you to small claims court this is what they would say. I looked into all of this when leaving my last livery yard.
 
thanks for all the comments!
forgot to say, last thing he said to me this morning was 'i just hope you wake up one day & realise you havent got a life' i replied saying 'i have got a life' and he said 'no you havent picking up **** all day is not a life'
charming!
again, i felt like i was being slated for wanting my horses to have the best life.
 
Personally I think that it is really bad manners to only give a week's notice - whether you have a contract or not. Thats probably why he is in a bad mood with you - he is probably seething at your lack of respect for him..

Imagine how you'd have felt if he had given you less than a month's notice to leave. You'd have been up in arms.

I would say that he has treated you with the same level of manners and respect that you have him, so you are quits.
 
As I understand it if you pay your livery weekly you give a weeks' notice, if you pay monthly you give a months' notice.

Never nice ending on a sour note, because you never know what is round the corner.
 
Don't worry about it, I have met some unreasonable yard owners in my time. My contract is payable monthly but notice period is two weeks so it all depends. If you had no contract, that's his fault for not stipulating how much notice you should give.
Yes he may be left with no rent but that's not the end of the world, compared to the other way round-if you had to find new places for 3 horses in a week, that would be nigh on impossible.
Not much grass would be ideal for my Cushings horse and I would jump at the chance to keep my horse on my own livery yard with no one else to bother me, so I don't think he will have any trouble re-letting the yard. Wish I was nearer the OP, I'd take it on.
 
Look forward to moving - I wouldn't worry, I have known ppl just do a moonlight flit so a weeks notice is better than no notice, I always go by the rule that a paying a week in advance then 1/2wks notice and if it's a month in advance I give a month
 
Just because people do moonlight flits doesn't make it right. I always was brought up to treat people the way that I would like to be treated.

Names get round anyway. We used to do DIY, and would hear from other yard owners to avoid X like the plague, and would pass on our bad experiences to them.
 
I'm afraid he is not being un reasonable. His rudeness is becasue you have made him angry about only giving a week's notice. Although the rudeness is not warrented his anger at a weeks notice is. It is incredibly rude contract or not, to not give a standard 1 months notice. If this was your yard I am sure it would also pee you off as how is he supposed to advertise and find someone to fill the space in a week. It would have been courteous of you to give a months notice but ask if he minded you leaving sooner.
If you pay your bill monthly it is standard practice to give a months notice.
A side from his insults I'm afraid you are in the wrong on the one months notice thing but what's done is done so i would just leave it be now.
 
I can see why he's a bit annoyed, a week's notice isn't much. On the other hand I reckon people will be queueing to take the yard over, there's plenty of folk desperate to get out of livery yards and go solo. I shouldn't think he'd even have to advertise, word gets out quick enough on the horsey grapevine. He won't lose out....but it's a lesson to him to get a contract in place next time.
 
Yards that I know of have only expected a week or a fortnight's notice at most even if the livery was payable monthly.
However that is a yard and as we all know yards are different because even if the yard owner is only going to lose the income from 1 or 2 horses ( unless people have more)then most will still have other liveries remaining ( unless a couple of friends leave at the same time of course).
On most yards some people know someone else who is looking to move on there or looking for a place for their horse(s).
Also a lot have advertisements either in the press, online or local tack/feed shops in that area, regardless of whether or not they actually have vacancies at that time. Some even use a waiting list system.
So to be fare to most yards owners a week or a fortnight's notice is not a major issue since they will no doubt still have a regular income from other sources and will soon fill that vacant stable or stables.

However in the case of the OP the owner of the land may not have an advert up for his place 24/7 and only advertises when someone leaves and he needs the income again.
Since the OP is the only person on this land then his income for that land is essentially in the hands of the OP.
While I agree that the man has been rude with his replies I think he was retaliating with words since that is all he was capable of.
To be fair I think most people look to move either just before autumn or in the spring, or at least that has been what I have found on most places.
I can understand the man's frustration at this situation though because he may have become reliant on that income.
You do find that you often end up spending the extra income you get and it is not until you lose it that you miss it, even if you coped with not having it beforehand.
I also think that in this situation as the OP was the only tenant that a month's notice would have been more acceptable than a week.
It has been a dry summer, for the first time ever in my life I have even had to feed mine hay in the field due to a shortage of grass and it not growing enough.
As the weather is seemingly getting a bit colder then unless we get an Indian summer then the grass situation will not really recover until next spring as the grass growing period starts to slow down over the next few months.
So in effect the man will now be tenantless, so no income in a week's time from his land. Also because the grass situation has been quite bad this summer then he may also find it hard to encourage someone onto the land now unless they do have fatties or else stable their horse(s) some of the time all year round.
I know that when I go to look at a place and in particular if going it alone then the grass and field situation is the most important thing because if you have **** fields then it is going to cost you one way or another. Either less turnout, due to fields becoming bare or if poorly drained. Or extra forage/feed due to a lack of grazing. For someone going it alone then the last thing they want to be thinking about straightaway is buying hay or haylage to be fed when they would not otherwise have the need to be feeding it before winter. I know it would certainly put me off.
So really yes OP you should have given him a month's notice especially as you had complete and utter exclusivity to his land, because it is most likely going to take him at least that now to find someone else to rent it.
I suggest he gets a contract in place in future though.
 
thanks for all your comments
reason i HAD to leave is because hes been nagging me alot saying that theres not enough grass for my 3 and that i need to sell one before the winter (which was not an option) i said to him that if i leave in a week then it will give him time for the grass to grow while hes looking for someone else, if i had stayed a month longer then he already had someone lined up to move in, he wud have no grass still anyway. also my one horse is a 23 year old tb and doesnt have many teeth so hes finding it hard to keep weight on as the grass it too short. i have been feeding hard feed and hay since july and its not even winter! i have to put my horses welfare first
also, he is definitly not 'relying' on the rent for income, as he is a business owner and owns about 4 businesses (that i know of) - not saying it makes it ok
 
I too would expect to give a months notice - just out of common curtousy (sp). I presume he is also a little peeved because you originally had two horses and by your own admission said there wasnt enough grazing for three so I would question your wisdom of having three horses grazing the fields, when you have an elderly TB who obviously needs good grazing. There is absolutly no need for his rudeness, but I do feel that it seems you have overgrazed the fields and are now leaving without much notice. Out of curiosity, do you pay grazing per horse or a set amount for the land? If per horse then the yard owner would at least have had additional income to offset the overgrazing, but if a set amount then i do think it is a bit of a cheek to overgraze his fields and then up and leave. Sorry - probably not the answer you were hoping for, but i do think we need to look at it from the yard owners perspective as well (No i am not a yard owner or livery manager - just a DIY livery)
 
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We don't have a notice period, and sometimes the way I discover someone is planning a move is when another YO rings me and asks what sort of livery they are!
There is a huge misconception that a week's notice is acceptable, I would ask if you arrived this morning and were given a week to move your horses would you feel that was fair? I bet you wouldn't !
I think any yard owner appreciates that people move for dozens of reasons, they may hate their other liveries, their YO, or just get fed up and feel like a change. All of which is fine, but it is only fair you give them enough warning to advertise the spaces so they don't lose income.
It does sound as if you have overhorsed his grazing which is why the horses are attempting to lean over and get more, not because as he says they are greedy!
Having had DIY liveries for well over 35 years you learn to accept you can't please all of the people all of the time, and accept people leaving with good humour.
I suspect he is feeling miffed at being left with zero grass, broken fences and a week's notice, none of which will attract the next person to rent. Maintanance is I'm afraid part of the job, horses chew wooden gates, they break fences and even damage metal gates beyond repair, and he should charge you enough to cover those costs, it's no good whingeing afterwards.
I'd love liveries who poo picked, luckily we move the horses round to avoid doing it, but I can see his side of the notice period, and yours for being upset at his uncalled for remarks.
I would just avoid him until you leave, and perhaps next time think about a little more warning of moving...
 
thanks for the comments!
the reason the rails are breaking so easily aswell is because they are all rotten in the ground (my bf checked them)
i did only have 2 horses when i went there, then i rescued this 23 year old tb, who was supposed to go in with the donkeys (he has 3 other fields) but he would not settle in there. however, when this tb was put in with mine, the grass was upto their knees, so i originally thought there would be plenty for them (my other horses are a cob & a mini shetland so they dont need alot) it hasnt realy been overgrazed as not long ago there was plenty of grass. reason i wanted to move was more because of lack of space for the winter as it will get very muddy with the 3.
i do understand what people are saying though about not giving him enough notice, but i do need to put my horses first and i genuinely thought i would be doing him a favour by giving him that month to let the grass grow, as winter is approaching, and if i stayed another month it would then be the end of september.
 
I'm not sure anyone is suggesting you stay another month with your horses, what they are suggesting is that you should have given him a months notice in money at least. I gave my last yard all money owed and a months money in notice, I then left in less than a day. This was acceptable.
 
Put your horses needs first, and don't worry too much.
Ella19's is a good suggestion - we;ve done that before and it always goes down well.
The horse world is very small, and gossip spreads like wildfire. Never leave bad feeling behind you, if it can be avoided.
 
horserider said:
No excuse for rudeness but I can see why he was stressed. From his point of view, he is losing the rent from his only livery with just a weeks notice. It doesn't give him much time to advertise/find someone else. Being near to the end of the grazing season after a rainless summer, there's little grass left for new horses coming before winter.
I think a months notice is fair in this case.
Click to expand...

Blimey where do you live if you've had no rain over the summer ? we've had plenty in wales lol
 
I thought the general rule was that if you pay weekly you give a weeks notice and a month if you pay monthly, I do think though that as you have been grazing an extra horse on there and there is no grass you should have given and paid for a months notice but still leave in a week to give the grass a chance to grow.
 
I think it is an unwritten rule that you give a month's notice unless you are leaving due to something the yard have done. Except when I left the worst yard in the world (in St Ann's Hill, Chertsey) I have always given a month's notice and tried to leave on good terms.
 
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