Unresponsive horse please help!

[lozers]

I've recently started riding someone else's horse to help them out. The thing is she isnt a very confident rider so hasnt done alot with the horse. I've managed to calm her down on the roads and hacking out alone but her schooling is getting worse. originally the problem was keeping the canter but now shes refusing to even go into it no matter how much i kick or use my whip all she does is buck. I dont want to use spurs, can anyone suggest anything that may help please as im fed up of fighting her all the time!

 

[the watcher]

Maybe she is hurting? have you done the usual back/teeth/tack checks?

 

[lozers]

yup had the vet out and everything, i went down the other day and it was great she was really forward going and i got impulsion whilst jumping but a few days later she was refusing point blank again

 

[GTs]

Why don't people realize going stronger is the number one reason for FUHs. Going softer will get you so much better results, and allow the horse to progress so much further.

 

[the watcher]

Impossible to say then, don't know how you ride, don't know what the horse has done. Try having somebody on the ground with you to pick up on what is happening..if you are asking for forward and horse is going up check you are not restraining with your hand (you might need to ride REALLY loose) or that your weight is not going forward.
will the horse canter on a lunge, out on a hack?

 

[Madam_max]

Whats FUHs?

 

[Parkranger]

You've had the vet out but what about saddler, physio and dentist?

I'll get shot down but I don't believe that alot of vets have the expertise of alot of physios and dentists (yes, I know that dentists are still not certificated by law!) one of my vets had to get a book out to age Ty by his teeth - WTF!

 

[Parkranger]

F**ked up Horses!

 

[Madam_max]

Oh

 

[lozers]

she does canter on lunge occasionally on a large circle but she does cut in and try to kick you. on a hack shes great picks up when you ask and will do a flying change. i can ride with a really long rein she shoots her head up when shes scared and then i have no control. her owner has given up on schooling her now so i feel its upto me to keep it up

 

[Parkranger]

Could be a balance thing - until recently my boy used to throw his head in the air in the school in canter - he felt so unbalanced. Exactly the same on a hack he was fine....not so many corners though!

Also, having a long rein and having little contact are different things - you can still have control without hanging inthe mouth (but you probably know that!)

 

[lozers]

we bought a new saddle not long ago when she first started played up which was fit proffesionally not seen the dentist but our vet is top notch and my yard owner really knows her stuff but she just suggested spurs but im not allowing tht!

 

[Parkranger]

I'd still get an equine dentist out.....I can't go into details but even vets make mistakes!

Unfortunately so many saddle fitters also f**k up.....maybe get a second opinion?

If it's only in canter then I'd bet that it's a balance thing......

 

[lozers]

how do help to improve their balance? it could possibly be that when she does eventually pick up canter she favors one leg

 

[Parkranger]

It's definately balance then!

My boy always favours one leg out in canter when hacking so he's a git on one rein in the school. You'll need to do lots of circle (small and large) in trot and really get the bending working first - leave canter for a while. Then when you do start working on canter work, make sure you're in a balanced slow trot before you even think about asking for a canter.

TBH, if you're not 100% sure I'd get lessons (like I am) cause you could do more harm than good ifyou don't knwo what you're doing......

 

[lozers]

i had a similar problem with my last horse but she was newly broken so she picked up things easy where as this horse is now 9 as has been getting away with being naughty and not picking up right since she was broke, as they say its hard to teach an old dog new tricks. Any ways thanks everyone for your help!

 

[Parkranger]

My boy is 8 but he's really keen to learn so I suppose I'm lucky........good luck x

 

[the watcher]

[ QUOTE ]
how do help to improve their balance? it could possibly be that when she does eventually pick up canter she favors one leg

[/ QUOTE ]

In that case it might def be a job for the back man, could be tight in the pelvis..have you tried running a finger down her back (do you know how?), to see if there is a specific point that she dips?..

As an exercise when picking out back feet you could also try taking the hind legs out to the side slightly to stretch the joint out..I am talking about a little way out here, not a massive stretch.

For the time being I would concentrate in working in straight lines until you have it sorted out

 

[ecrozier]

Might be being a bit opinionated here but if you are so worried about using spurs, why would you say 'no matter how much [you] kick or use the whip"
Don't get me wrong, I am definately NOT suggesting you use spurs, infact quite the opposite, I would say that maybe lay off the whip for the time being as well. Not only might that be contributing to the bucking (know mine will buck if you hit him hard - he's used to a 'tickle' if he's ignoring the leg but wouldn't appreciate being hit at all). Also if she has problems with balance, trying to 'chase' her into canter def won't help, if anything will make it worse as she will rush and find it even harder to balance.
I would suggest doing loads of trot work, circles, bending etc. And probably get an instructor to help you with the canter if you haven't already!

PS Not saying I'm against whips or spurs, in their place, used by people who know what they are doing, by the way!

 

[GTs]

Personally my biggest worry would be the owner - if someone was having battles like that with my horse, there would be no way in hell they would be allowed to continue riding. Not only for the horse's sake, but for liability too.

 

[SirenaXVI]

Totally agree with you GTs, there is no way on God's earth I would allow anyone to ride my horse in that way. Meethinks perhaps this horse would be better being reschooled by a more expeienced rider

 

[lozers]

its definately not her back 3 of us have checked her over including a top notch vet. and it isnt that she cant do it because every now and then shes perfect for the day shes fine on hacks. Plus i think i came off a bit strong earlier im normally very soft with her i really dnt like using whips and i normally nudge rather than kick but she doesnt always respond to that. She needs to learn manners. ive suggested the owner look for another horse but shes had her for 6 yrs and its not something she wants to do. i was thinking about suggesting changing her feed try give her a bit more energy but then i dont want this to fuel her viciousness (she kicks and bites too)

 

[lilym]

have her back, teeth and saddle been checked in case it is a physical problem??

 

[lozers]

yes they have all been checked and shes fine

 

[SirenaXVI]

What is her feeding regime?

 

[GTs]

I am concerned about your suggestion of feed, bucking required a lot more effort than cantering -

It is funny how many people insist that the 'horse need manners' - I think horse manners are directly protional to their owner's skill.

 

[SirenaXVI]

Meeeeeooooooow GTs

 

[lozers]

at the moment shes on one feed in the morning of sugar beet, herbal chop and cod liver oil, she lives out all day. im not sure what her owne gives her when shes down usually just carrots and apples

 

[lilym]

sorry didn't read other replies.....oops!
will she school on a hack, sometimes they get very sour of a school environment. have you tried a variation of work, i.e poles? what is her walk and trot work like?

 

[lozers]

takes a while to work her into the bridle but other than that shes good in walk and trot, i was working on her transitions today and she did really well. I havent really done a lot of schooling on a hack as she was very panicky when on her own so ive been focusing on that and getting her used to heavy traffic