Unsettled, nervous horse, abused in a past home - Advice needed!

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beth21

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Hi,

Apologies for the extremely long message but best to give as much information as possible to gain the best advice!

I recently took on a new pony who was outgrown and subsequently abused. He was then taken on by the people I bought him from. The wife worked with him and got him to a stage where he could be handled, feet picked up, legs touched, ears touched etc. Their daughter was riding him but hit 18 and lost interest... The perils of boys and booze!

Her mum then became ill and has been bed bound for some time, which left the dad and son to look after him as best they could (little/no horse experience). This really just involved feeding twice a day but very little handling (I'd say this probably went on for a good few months, since earlier this year anyway). He was living in a field with two others who were then sold, leaving him on his own with little human and no horse socialisation.

When he arrived, he seemed fine if a little anxious which is to be expected. He let me groom him, pick up his feet, rug him up. The only thing he didn't seem to like was the headcollar, kept running to the back of the stable for a while. I got it on him okay after about 5 minutes and rewarded him.

I am keeping him stabled at night and out during the day due to the time of the year, he was living out at his previous owners. If I have to, I will allow him to live out but first want to see if he will settle. Fortunately, during the 24 hours I had to keep him in he was fine but since he has been allowed out (with one other older, calm horse for now) he is extremely anxious and stressed in his stable when I bring him in and when I got to take him out. Won't let me get the head collar on, sweating, barging etc. He drags me to the field although he's mangeable, hasn't bolted or anything. He is very hard to handle and although I wanted to remain confident, it is very difficult. He wasn't deliberately trying to hurt me, he was just very frightened. I keep having to walk away for a while and then try again. Today he went as far as to rear and try and get his legs over the stable door which is obviously concerning as I don't want him to hurt himself!

He has been the last to go out both days, which I think isn't helping as I think he has been craving the company of other horses for a long time and now suffers from separation anxiety. I am planning on turning him out first with one other horse so he is never the last and I'm also planning on keeping his feed high fibre and low sugar for the time being, his previous owners had him on conditioning mix which stumped me as he holds his condition well and is a nervy/excitable pony, I took him straight off that!

I admit that I'm now slightly suspicious of his latest owners and what they told me they'd done with him but then again, he cost a pittance and was in desperate need of a new home. I wasn't looking for an easy, ready to ride schoolmaster. I wanted to either rescue, take on a young horse or a project horse which is what I've got but he is proving more difficult than I expected! I'm not in any rush to jump on him, I am happy to put in the ground work and build his trust as I understand this is vital! I know it could take some time and he's also probably feeling unsettled but his behaviour is a threat to both me and him so any advice would be much appreciated!

He's a 9 year old 13.2hh Welsh Sec D X if this helps. I am experienced with all sorts of horses, I worked as a racehorse groom from when I left school at 16 and only changed careers this year (I'm 20 now). I just really want to get this right, he deserves a second chance in life, he's so sweet and happy when he's chilled and I really think if I can get through to him, he'll be a fab little pony! I'm in no rush, this is going to take time but really could just do with some advice :) I want to make him better, not worse. I took him on knowing he wouldn't be easy, I'm not that surprised he's acting like this, he's just a bit worse than I thought. I just think taking advice from others would be a good option. I didn't ride him when I bought him, although I saw him tacked up which he seemed okay with. I must stress I bought him as a project, so no grief for this please.

At the end of the day, if it doesn't work out as I planned (that he makes a nice little riding pony eventually (he has been ridden this year and show jumped in his past) he has a loving home he will never leave and can live out with his friends as a companion but I'm not ready to give up!

Thanks for reading and for any advice given x
 
I'd just keep doing what you're doing. But I would agree with not making him wait to be turned out. Turn him our first, or at the same time as another horse.

As the time goes on he'll settle. For what it's worth, he doesn't sound frightened, just rude.

EDT:
Today he went as far as to rear and try and get his legs over the stable door which is obviously concerning as I don't want him to hurt himself!
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Sorry, had missed that. Yes, agree about putting a grill up too.
 
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I'd get a grill on the front of the door asap!

Anything that rears with intention to go over whether out of fear or bolshiness would have one on with me until settled. Far easier than having to remove a door from under a horse.

Agree with AM on the rest.
Though only turn out with another if you have two people. Don't make more work by trying to lead him out with another and it going wrong.
 
Hi,

Thanks for the quick reply. I'll keep working with him, fingers crossed he'll come around in time, it's a good job I'm patient!

I think he's quite anxious from being treated badly, but I also think having been left to his own devices in a field for so long, you're probably right, he's being rude and is in desperate need of a solid routine and a firm (but kind) hand.
 
Ah, very like one I have. Mine is so stressy that when the foal pulled his headcollar so it was over one ear it took me nearly an hour to get near enough to him to sort it out. That was in a 12 x 12 stable and there is a user on here who will confirm that if he knows he's done something wrong you can't catch him for up to three days in a 12 x 12 stable! I've only had the old so and so for 10 years now and he has been so gently treated!

FWIW I spent a long time just reading to mine in a corner of the stable, or my daughter did, so that he just associated our quiet voices with peace and calmness.

We did everything at a sort of half speed around him, deliberately talking all the time, just rubbish but very low and calm.

We showed him everything - tack, grooming kit etc - and allowed / encouraged him him to touch it with his nose before carrying on with grooming or tacking up.

He wasn't allowed to barge and I'm quite an effective anchor on the end of a rope but normally he was moved everywhere with a slack leadrope and a hand on his withers, any tension on the leadrope and he'd begin to stress and panic.

I'd be inclined to put yours out first or as one of the first pair.

I found with ours that a routine was fine but as soon as any little thing changed he would panic. We now don't have a routine. Things happen in the same order but they are not rigid and not done at the same time. He accepts this better.

Ours was a an extremely rewarding pony (and still is when he's not having one of his little episodes like the headcollar) and I hope you get as much pleasure fun and love from yours as we did (do) from ours.
 
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Woo I'm new to this whole forum thing, it's great! You're all so quick :D

Thanks Pandora that's a good suggestion, I'll have a word with the yard owner tonight as it really concerned me.

One of the other liveries made the suggestion that he had his stable door at night open for a few nights so he can walk in and out (it's a small yard that can be enclosed by gates).

Any thoughts? I wasn't sure.
 
Agree with AM too, however it sounds like he's anxious when separated from his fieldmates in the stable, so a stable mirror may help...

Best of luck OP
 
Hi Hic,

Tell me about it! His box is a 12x12 and he loves rushing to the back of it, although never in a nasty 'I'm going to lash out at you way'.

I'll try that, I went over to him in the field this morning and the little monkey came straight over all butter wouldn't melt and stood whilst I gave him a fuss! I am really going to be treating him like a youngster, back to basics with everything I think!
 
beth21 said:
Woo I'm new to this whole forum thing, it's great! You're all so quick :D

Thanks Pandora that's a good suggestion, I'll have a word with the yard owner tonight as it really concerned me.

One of the other liveries made the suggestion that he had his stable door at night open for a few nights so he can walk in and out (it's a small yard that can be enclosed by gates).

Any thoughts? I wasn't sure.
Click to expand...

Not a chance in hell with the ice atm - though may be different at yours. I'd also be wary doing this and him winding others in their stables up or winding up in the yard by himself, I find a stable safer or out in the field.

Personally I'd keep him in the stable with a grill on - but have others in view (opposite stables/next door with window)
 
I have bought two horses who had been kept alone both where extremely difficult at first .
One jumped out its stable window because it thought I was removing an other horse ( he was mistaken ) the other was awful with the others desparate for their company but attacked kick and bit them when in with them ( he was a night mare for a long time ) .
Both became in time " normal " I assume although they appear to be coping alone they really hate it.
I put in strict routines I might in your shoes have a chat to the vet you might benefit from something to take the edge of him for a few days until he settles.
Keep the diet as you have it. A couple of weeks should make a big difference .
 
beth21 said:
One of the other liveries made the suggestion that he had his stable door at night open for a few nights so he can walk in and out (it's a small yard that can be enclosed by gates).

Any thoughts? I wasn't sure.
Click to expand...

No, I wouldn't do this either.

Presumably he has company, so I can't see any reason for doing this.
 
PandorasJar said:
Not a chance in hell with the ice atm - though may be different at yours. I'd also be wary doing this and him winding others in their stables up or winding up in the yard by himself, I find a stable safer or out in the field.

Personally I'd keep him in the stable with a grill on - but have others in view (opposite stables/next door with window)
Click to expand...

Okay thanks, I was a bit unsure as I really want to get him into a solid routine straight away. I want to be kind to him, but I don't want to panda to him. Also you're right about the ice! He's not in the best stable at the moment, he's on the end not facing anyone. Soon though, two are moving off and he can move which will be much better for him.

If he gets really bad, he can live out but it's not ideal as it's literally just turnout, no grazing (they get hay every day) and very exposed where we are. At least he's a hardy enough breed if it comes to this!
 
I had the same with the chesnut in my photos, if you look close you will see a white line round his neck where he had been tether tight with a rope, he would let me put a head collor on nor would he stay in a stable, however working with 2-3 hours aday with putting it on taking it off for a week he's a lot better he's scared of everything he's starting to get over that a bit with bombproofing him, I had him back driving he's fine on the road well till somebody banged there horn behind me and he bolted at flatout gallop along a road and put me in hospital for 3 weeks with fractured skull,

my advice is work with everyday but take things a lot slower he needs to build his trust with you,
 
Goldenstar said:
I have bought two horses who had been kept alone both where extremely difficult at first .
One jumped out its stable window because it thought I was removing an other horse ( he was mistaken ) the other was awful with the others desparate for their company but attacked kick and bit them when in with them ( he was a night mare for a long time ) .
Both became in time " normal " I assume although they appear to be coping alone they really hate it.
I put in strict routines I might in your shoes have a chat to the vet you might benefit from something to take the edge of him for a few days until he settles.
Keep the diet as you have it. A couple of weeks should make a big difference .
Click to expand...

At least I'm not the only one hey! In fact reading on here, there's enough people suffering similar problems although I wasn't sure if the fact he suffered some sort of abuse might make it harder to get through to him.

I might just do that, or maybe try him on NAF magic and see if that helps.
 
First, thanks to everyone for the advice! Massively helpful and filling me with hope. I will not give up on this little man, he deserves a happy home but that doesn't mean it's easy! Have had little periods of massive self doubt as I really just want whats best for him and even when you're reasonably experienced, every day is a huge learning curve.

I forgot to also mention that one of the reasons I'm probably a little more anxious is that one of the liveries (with the best of intentions, given some good advice) keeps telling me he's JUST like her old pony that was abused who she ended up retiring young as he was just too unpredictable. I know all horses are all different as much as she does, it just makes me doubt myself a bit but with all the advice on here I'm definitley feeling much more positive!
 
Valerian is worth a try.
But honestly I would go for something from the vet for a few days both of these horses where calm and settled when viewed both just a little rude with their owner but nothing alarming both where freaked from the moment they spotted that there where other horses .
 
My two pennyworth :), I think you're fine and in tune with how to manage him but simply a bit fazed by his behaviour.
I'd just add to what been said so far, change the way you see him. Don't think of him as abused or neglected, just look at him as he is today, not yesterday, otherwise you could try to excuse or compensate for what happened in the past.
Most helpful things are routine, consistency and boundaries. This will enable him to feel secure and understand how things work without worry. The more anxious he becomes, the quieter and firmer you must be along with fairness.
Don't be dejected when he doesn't grasp the basics, just slowly chip away and eventually you'll realise how far you've come.
I'm glad he has a good home, the dear boy.
 
Thanks Golden, I'll have a word with my vet and see what he says. Yeah Harvey was the same, pretty happy when I went to see him although obviously a pony just to ruling the roost.

He's just so anxious to be in the company of the other horses now but we'll work on that. Going to get him in tonight and lead him around the yard since it's well lit, maybe shut him in his stable and feed him and then lead him back out, reward him if he's good and see how that goes.

That's great advise thanks horserider, I'll try and think of him as a blank canvas from now on and slowly put my mark on him :) Thanks, it's nice to know fellow horse lovers have faith in me and think he's in a good home. I like to think so! For a start, his bedroom is bigger and tidier than mine and his wardrobe is certainly better than mine :D
 
You sound like you have your head well and truly screwed on so continue doing what you're doing and I think in a few months you'll have a nice little pony there. I strongly second the comment about not viewing him as a previously abused horse. So many people make this mistake and it really hinders a horse from moving forward in a positive manner. Keep plugging away and remain patient but firm. Don't let the horse away with too many things because this really does not help him, or you. Good luck :)
 
I'd say you are going about it the right way, time and patience, but what I did with my headshy foal was to leave the headcollar on and then put another over for a few weeks, that way he learnt that trying to get away or backing off didn't work, I use to take the second head collar off in the field and then catch him in the afternoon to bring him in and a few bags of carrots helped as well:D:DBut he's perfect now and no problems putting on headcollar or having his ears touched, but he still has to have his 2 carrots when I put the headcollar on, 1 before I do and the 2nd after and there is no cheating him,he lets you know:D:D:D:D
 
Thanks Echo and Spring,

Really nice to have positive feedback :) I am now trying to see treat him as a youngster rather than a previously abused horse. Taking baby steps, lots of positive reinforcement!

I might just try that Echo, although last night he was brilliant and let me put it on no problem!

Just a quick update, last night I brought him in and before I put him in his stable, as the yard has been gritted I shut the gate and let him wander and he was so happy and curious, kept coming back over to me for a fuss every now and again and ended up walking himself in and out of his stable a few times :)

He then had a groom and his tea in his stable and was shut in for the night and was a little anxious but much happier. This morning I let him have his breakfast with his stable door open and the yard gate closed and he was perfectly happy to stay inside his stable and eat and then went out with no bother. Very happy!
 
beth21 said:
Thanks Echo and Spring,

Really nice to have positive feedback :) I am now trying to see treat him as a youngster rather than a previously abused horse. Taking baby steps, lots of positive reinforcement!

I might just try that Echo, although last night he was brilliant and let me put it on no problem!

Just a quick update, last night I brought him in and before I put him in his stable, as the yard has been gritted I shut the gate and let him wander and he was so happy and curious, kept coming back over to me for a fuss every now and again and ended up walking himself in and out of his stable a few times :)

He then had a groom and his tea in his stable and was shut in for the night and was a little anxious but much happier. This morning I let him have his breakfast with his stable door open and the yard gate closed and he was perfectly happy to stay inside his stable and eat and then went out with no bother. Very happy!
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Lucky horse to have found someone patient and understanding :)

Great advice above - I would just add, there is never any harm at all in a situation like this in treating the horse as though they've never been trained to do anything - don't make assumptions that they know what you want. If you've actually trained them, you know they definitely understand. That way, you don't end up calling the horse rude, when in fact they don't understand :)

Decide what you need to train, and work your way through them until you're sure that every time you ask, the horse responds. To start with, I like to train "follow me", "stop", "stand and don't move", "move backwards", "move shoulders sideways away from me" and "move hips sideways away from me".
 
The Welsh D mare in the stable next to mine was very much like this, and had also come from an abusive background. In her case she had been owned by travellers who locked her in a windowless shed for long periods so you can imagine being in a stable was her idea of hell. She reared at the door as well, although luckily just for effect. Open the door and she was happy! Unfortunately the Welsh are intelligent and sensitive so getting rid of fears can be a very long process. My own mare (Welsh D x) took many months to allow me to stroke her left ear and it was only in her late 20s that I could put a fly bonnet with ears on her. She had also been owned by a gypsy family and I suspect they had put an ear twitch on her. She also had a lot of whip marks on her left flank but I don't know who gave her those.

Good luck, your pony will reward your patience and kindness in time I'm sure.
 
Thanks guys :)

I'm confident that in time he'll be absolutley fine, every day he seems to improve. I dread to think what would have happened had he fallen into the wrong hands.

I really am going to use all of the advice everyone has kindly given me on here and the plan is to definitely treat him like a baby. You've all been really kind, so glad I posted, every comment is massively appreciated. Even just from posting yesterday, I considered everything that had been said on here and straight away last night, I had a much more positive experience with him. Whilst he was loose on the yard, if he came over and I made a fuss and then walked away, he'd follow which I thought was very promising!

Going to have a little play in the arena on Friday since I'm off work, just let him have a little wander round on a lunge line (not going to actually lunge him though, at this point I want him to learn to come to me). May let him have a wander loose if he's comfortable but we'll see! I want to form a bond with him through kindness and make it really fun, maybe play a few games since he seems so intelligent. If he's having fun so am I!
 
Thats good to hear Beth21. Feeling positive is the one thing that gets you through the bumpy parts of the journey.

He can't believe in you unless you believe in him, but it sounds like you do.

Good luck and enjoy the ride. (Metaphorically speaking.):D
 
I think youre doing a fine job! I agree, i think this basically stems from being isolated and fear of being left. Some horses adapt well to being on their own but then panic in future when their 'friends' leave. Also, a welsh d is very bright and can err on the side of barginess.

I woukd first of all keep a headcollar on him. This will make him easier to grab in the stable. It should only take a few days for him to come to you.

Secondly, you have two choices, either get someone to turn him out so he's not left in on his own or battle on and qmake him wait. Put a grill up so he can't come up over. He will improve with time and firm handling.

He will improve as the weeks go on :)
 
Nothing to add that will help Beth21, just wanted to say for me this is thread of the week. Thoughtful query from a new poster that is well explained. Plenty of sensible an helpful replies which the OP has responded to. And no over critical negative responses. Thank you all!
 
cold_feet said:
Nothing to add that will help Beth21, just wanted to say for me this is thread of the week. Thoughtful query from a new poster that is well explained. Plenty of sensible an helpful replies which the OP has responded to. And no over critical negative responses. Thank you all!
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Thanks very much, that's lovely to hear :) I will definitely be using this forum in the future if I have any queries.

Thanks to all for the advice, will make sure I put it all to good use. Definitely may try keeping his headcollar on for a few days and see if this helps.
 
He sounds so much like my welsh D. Clicker training worked AMAZINGLY. and lots of time and patience, whihc you're already doing of course. But I totally recommend clickers for nervous horses and especially sec Ds because they are so greedy, it totally transformed my horse. In fact, now if i see him have a problem with something (e.g., he freezes in fear about some things, so for example if he is having a 'scared of my rug' day) all i have to do is to go back to the first command he ever learnt - to kiss (I know, I know, I was just a dumb youngster and didn't know any better), but it TOTALLY unfreezes him and he gets confident again. He knows about ten words now; kiss, head down (for headcollar, he used to be scared of it and put his head up; I'm tall but my friend who used to help me with him was only short so needed help with this!), touch the ball, back, move over, stop, shake hands (not recommended!), walk, trot etc.
 
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