Update: she couldn't be in foal could she?

Queenbee

Queenbee

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Hi all,

well, I have abstained from posting on here regarding ebony for a while because I didn't want to get my hopes up, but we have worked out that it will be about 315 days since she went in with ben after he had been gelded, you may remember in my previous post I was querying whether or not she could be in foal: Here is a link to the first lot of pics from about a month ago:
http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/forums/showthread.php?t=475152

A couple of weeks ago:
ebony007.jpg


ebony006.jpg


ebony009.jpg


Here are the latest pictures taken today:

ebony011.jpg

ebony012.jpg

ebony014.jpg

ebony013.jpg

ebony010.jpg


We have had nothing confirmed, I spoke to the vet and she seems healthy and fit and is being treated as if she is in foal, full worming schedule and supplements etc, I disinfected the stable yesterday and put down a new bed, she has a foaling kit all ready she has been moved to a quieter larger stable, to acclimatise prior to d day, at the moment she is coming in for 2-3 hours in the afternoon. Oh and she will only eat 1 and a bit scoops of her chaff. Finally you can't see her tummy from the front now, but when she turns (which she is finding a bit awkward) her ribs are poking out at the back.

Pretty sure that I have felt a few kicks and everyone is sure she is in foal (although I still keep telling myself it couldn't possibly happen to me (i am never that lucky!) What do you think?
 
hmm certainly looks like shes bagging up... ooh how exciting :). has she been covered properly or was she just running with a stallion at one point (sorry Ive not followed the threads)

Good luck, I expect pictures if a foalie does arrive... eeek bet your soo excited :) x
 
I'd pay £30 and get bloods done. I would not be able to stand the not knowing. If she's not then you have a hec of a belly to get off her so I hope she is but if she isn't and you are feeding her up you could end up with other problems. Also you may well be on foal watch and sleepless nights for a long time if she isn't!

My mare was pregnant unexpectedly and I felt movement but now filly is 18 months I still see the mares belly move but I know it's just wind so it can easily be mistaken.

Good Luck and hope everything turns out well whichever way it goes.
 
She is a maiden, so we are assuming that this is why she isn't soooo very huge, she has only run with ben (the coloured horse in my sig) 2 1/2 weeks after he was gelded (I was advised by vet that 2 weeks was safe!) He is currently standing at 15.2 and is a nice warmblood type with a bit more bone than her. Her temperament has changed dramatically! Since he is the only horse that could have done the business we are working from the date of the weekend that she went in with him, she was huge earlier in the year but, is now flatter on her sides and the weight has dropped lower, I know we still have a way to go with that though!

Here are some pictures of ben:
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And here are some less ugly pictures of ebony:
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if she is it should be interesting!
 
I would also pay for bloods or examination to rule out if she is in foal or not , but also to check for twins etc
 
Beatrice5 said:
I'd pay £30 and get bloods done. I would not be able to stand the not knowing. If she's not then you have a hec of a belly to get off her so I hope she is but if she isn't and you are feeding her up you could end up with other problems. Also you may well be on foal watch and sleepless nights for a long time if she isn't!

My mare was pregnant unexpectedly and I felt movement but now filly is 18 months I still see the mares belly move but I know it's just wind so it can easily be mistaken.

Good Luck and hope everything turns out well whichever way it goes.
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At about 315 days, it is my understanding that a blood test will not provide an answer, I could have an internal done, but she can be tense and I don't want anymore stress than is needed, I felt what felt like 3 punches the other day, that is when I started to 'believe' My farrier who has known her for 10 years, says she is showing no sign of a pulse, and to be honest when you look at the tell tale signs she does not look 'flubber' heavy it is far more focused around the abdomen. I have been fairly nervous at times, but I am now pretty unphased, she is being checked and monitored and she will be coming in closer to the time. She is calm, healthy and doing well. She is also only being fed alfa oil and a broodmare supplement and she has a max of 2 scoops (which she now won't eat fully, so is going down to one generous one) so overfeeding is not happening. Ischa, at this point, twins would have to be born, there is nothing that could be done to prevent that, I have 2 dairy farmers on hand (one who lives onsite) who are able to help me with delivery should the vet be delayed and a vet on 'standby' I have use of a caravan and am purchasing a cctv this week so she can just 'get on with it' with the least amount of intervention, unless it is needed.

I may be wrong about the bloods though (am happy to stand corrected) :)
 
She wasn't always 315 days though was she, u suspected pregnancy earlier as per previous thread.
I really do not understand you not getting a blood test to know one way or another. You felt it appropriate to move her to a bigger box, sort a foaling kit, but not ask the vet to test for pregnancy?

Perhaps my sense of common sense is far to sensible ;)

I do hope all goes well if she is in foal.
 
Have to say, to me personally, she doesn't look in foal (could be completely wrong though!). I went through a similar problem last winter when my mare looked ready to drop - the vets were convinced she was and even felt 'something' when she was palpated. However, the bloods came back negative.

I would HIGHLY advise getting bloods taken and tested....otherwise you could be feeding her supplements/feed she doesn't need and waiting for something which won't come :o
 
my old mare was showing most of the signs of pregnancy - weight gain around the abdomen, what felt like kicking from her abdomen and she was even producing milk.
Everyone on the yard was convinced she was in foal as she had been with a stallion some months earlier so i got the vet out who took bloods.

The results were a complete negative for pregnancy - vet actually said her hormone levels were lower than a normal non-pregnant mare so she was in effect 200% not pregnant! lol :D
 
I would of thought she would of bagged up if she is that far gone, our maiden mare was much more fuller in her udder than that earlier in the pregnancy than yours currently is. However mares are all different I suppose. And I am another who would have an internal, because this far gone the vet would confirm very quickly wether she is in foal or not.
 
no i understand what you are saying, and as I said, I kept talking myself out of the fact that she was but the thing is I have owned her for 10 years and she is very different to anything I have ever known:

No season this year that anyone has seen, not even flirting with new geldings (she is a general no exception tart!)

Very calm and good to catch, relaxed in stable... totally out of character for summer time.

That is not bagging up, I agree, but she is distended, which happens prior to bagging up, plus she has a lot of veins, again unusual for her.

Her weight has gone from the sides to 'down below'

I felt 3 sharp punch like movements last week

she is swiping regularly at her abdomen, no flies around and all other horses are calm

she was on 3/4 acre track system most of the summer with ben, a growing youngster and in work, she would not carry that weight on that system normally

she has recently become narky with ben and her neighbour, even if they are not doing anything... this is not normal

If she carries too much weight due to grass, her pulse is noticeable, it has not been noticeable this year.

She is carrying more general weight than she did earlier but that is because I have opened up her paddock this last fortnight because if she is pregnant she needs the food, however you can still feel the ribs and they poke out at the back like gills when she turns, as if something is forcing them.

I may be seeing things or fabricating them in my head but, I have a gut feeling here that keeps saying she is. I expect time will tell and that there is not long to wait now for a definitive answer.
 
I don't think she is in foal.

This is my maiden mare at about the same 'stage' as your mare. Her belly is just different to your mare and she was very well bagged up too.
NewCamera30thApril2011076.jpg
 
I know nothing about foaling or mares but you do seem to be going to considerable effort/ expense for something that may/ may not happen.

I really hope you aren't disappointed.

Im very surprised that the vet can't do anything to confirm pregnancy.

Fingers and toes crossed for you.

V x
 
Of course the vet can confirm trickivicki, but that would require the vet actually seeing the mare.

OP has the vet actually seen your mare since you suspected pregnancy or have you just had a phone chat and been given advice based on the information you priovided?

Answering this would perhaps explain the confusion because if your vet has been to see the mare and is properly equipped and can't tell you if your mare is pregnant or not, then I would suggest a change of vet!
 
MrVelvet said:
off topic but - is that some sort of artificial tail? or just a swipe of a leadrope at the right moment!? :)
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I should by now know better than to post pics of her tail wrapped up as I get asked every time! It's a tail wrap, to protect her tail as its so bliming long!
 
missyme10 said:
She wasn't always 315 days though was she, u suspected pregnancy earlier as per previous thread.
I really do not understand you not getting a blood test to know one way or another. You felt it appropriate to move her to a bigger box, sort a foaling kit, but not ask the vet to test for pregnancy?

Perhaps my sense of common sense is far to sensible ;)

I do hope all goes well if she is in foal.
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No, you are correct, she obviously was not always 315 days, and for a long time I decided that I would just see how it pans out, she is fit, healthy and the vast percentage of horses foal without hitch. Since, she was not showing signs of laminitis with regards to her size and was on limited grazing and in work, I decided to let nature take its course as it couldn't be changed, and just monitor her and prepare closer to the time. She has just moved to a bigger box and the foaling kit is a negligable cost, which would in any case be of use for a first aid kit even if it was not needed for a foal. Perhaps you think me to laid back, I however feel that my vet and I have spoken and he will come when needed, foaling is a natural process and generally goes without a hitch, veterinary advice is that supplements for that amount of time will not cause a detrimental effect to her if she is not in foal. I have the utmost confidence in my vet, my partner and the livery yard owner (both of the latter posess many years experience in breeding/delivery of larger animals. Futhermore, knowing my mare, if it did turn out to be just weight, then with the onset of winter, I would not be worried about it. I guess that time will tell. I understand that many on here would have wanted to 'know' but for me what will be will be, the vet has given me the 'all clear' to use the supplement which was no extra expense as it was left over from ben when he was growing, the farrier says that knowing ebony he is not at all worried about it being just fat and risking lami. I do not see that I am being neglectful, she is being monitored, catered for, and I am taking advice. I am happy with the decision and the course I have chosen, I am not worried about her in the slightest and can guarantee you that if I was, I would not hesitate to act and call my vet.
 
Shame you're feeling that you have to prove that you're not a negligent owner. It sounds as if you've got it covered to me.

queenbee said:
No, you are correct, she obviously was not always 315 days, and for a long time I decided that I would just see how it pans out, she is fit, healthy and the vast percentage of horses foal without hitch. Since, she was not showing signs of laminitis with regards to her size and was on limited grazing and in work, I decided to let nature take its course as it couldn't be changed, and just monitor her and prepare closer to the time. She has just moved to a bigger box and the foaling kit is a negligable cost, which would in any case be of use for a first aid kit even if it was not needed for a foal. Perhaps you think me to laid back, I however feel that my vet and I have spoken and he will come when needed, foaling is a natural process and generally goes without a hitch, veterinary advice is that supplements for that amount of time will not cause a detrimental effect to her if she is not in foal. I have the utmost confidence in my vet, my partner and the livery yard owner (both of the latter posess many years experience in breeding/delivery of larger animals. Futhermore, knowing my mare, if it did turn out to be just weight, then with the onset of winter, I would not be worried about it. I guess that time will tell. I understand that many on here would have wanted to 'know' but for me what will be will be, the vet has given me the 'all clear' to use the supplement which was no extra expense as it was left over from ben when he was growing, the farrier says that knowing ebony he is not at all worried about it being just fat and risking lami. I do not see that I am being neglectful, she is being monitored, catered for, and I am taking advice. I am happy with the decision and the course I have chosen, I am not worried about her in the slightest and can guarantee you that if I was, I would not hesitate to act and call my vet.
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missyme10 said:
Of course the vet can confirm trickivicki, but that would require the vet actually seeing the mare.

OP has the vet actually seen your mare since you suspected pregnancy or have you just had a phone chat and been given advice based on the information you priovided?

Answering this would perhaps explain the confusion because if your vet has been to see the mare and is properly equipped and can't tell you if your mare is pregnant or not, then I would suggest a change of vet!
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Sorry, was just about to answer trickivicki but then saw that you had responded, no TV, vet could say one way or the other with an internal.

Missyme10: No, vet has not been out with equipment to do an internal or blood test on ebony regarding pregnancy, I suspect that this may have something to do with him being our neighbour and a horse breeder himself and his knowing my mare of old in general, I went to see him at his home discussed the scenario, showed him the pics, he asked my opinion on my mare, in general and whether I felt a definite need to know, I asked what effect caring for her as if she was in foal would have on her if she was not in foal, he told me 'none whatsoever on the basis of the time scale you have given me' as a result, I was told to monitor her, and treat her as if she was and see the outcome nearer the time and that if I changed my mind he would come and do an exam for me, but unless I specifically 'needed to know' then there would be no negative to come from not knowing. Honestly, many horses successfully breed without the faffing around of too much intervention, if the horse is fit and healthy what is the problem? And yes, the vet did see her earlier this year for an unrelated reason and diagnosis: a fit and healthy mare. I understand your concerns missyme, but I am not being neglectful in my opinion by not 'needing to know' bearing in mind the advice that I have sought
 
she looks in foal to me but i haven't been around in foal mares for a very long time so i might be a bit rusty on the looks!

i understand you doing things the way you are, especially as it's not really causing you much more expense. it sounds like you've got everything covered and are prepared for the outcome either way.

IF she is in foal then i really hope it all goes smoothly and there are no problems.
 
Laafet said:
I've foaled over 50 TB's in the last two years and I would not put her as being 315 days, even for a maiden. But she does show some sign so of being pregnant.
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Yes, she is not the largest, but we shall see :) the thing is that unless she had a visitor in the night he is the only one that could have got her, and unless he has 3 bollarks, the time frame is quite definite, I saw them geld him, she went back in with him the first weekend in November (6th) at which point he had been gelded for 2 1/2 weeks, so even if it took a week or so to get what was left of his tackle in order, we are only talking 2 weeks max really.

We did think about the possibility of a phantom, but she is 18, as i understand it, phantoms at this age are not common and she has never had one before. I suppose time will tell. Either way, she has given her little heart out to me and I could have never asked for more (and that is without the consideration of a foal) :D
 
Tinypony said:
Shame you're feeling that you have to prove that you're not a negligent owner. It sounds as if you've got it covered to me.
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Thank you TP :) I just thought that everyone might like to follow the story... wrong again! LOL :D

Guys, no one knows for sure, and I don't care, she is my one in a million foal or no foal, just thought people might have liked to follow the story of a happy healthy mare who may or may not be pregnant.
 
We had a mare at work that was in foal without us knowing. she became rather large but ribby at the same time. We had no idea when she was due but took her off the riding list and set her up to have the foal. 2 months later i came down to a small foal in the stable! She did not wax up or bag up at all! we were not expecting her to drop that night! They can surprise you sometimes! I think she looks in foal.
 
Queenbee, a well equipped vet confirms via ultrasound (mobile unit), an internal isn't necessary.
But the fact that no vet has been to see your mare explains why you don't know if she's pregnant or not.

I have at no point suggested your mare is neglected, only questioned how you don't know, have not confirmed pregnancy etc. and the logic behind the thinking of not getting a vet to confirm yet preparing for a foal.
It just didn't make sense when your initial posts suggested your mare had been seen by your vet, but you have now clarified that she has in fact not.
So it all now makes sense, good luck x
 
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