very fat cob! Advice if possible please

[sue_ellen]

As some of you may know, I have owned Sherman for just over 1 year. He is 7 yo, 15.1 h/w type cob with 9.5 inches of bone. I bought him from a riding school and he was very overweight, and despite my best efforts, he still is. The lightest I have managed to get him is 555kg on the weigh tape. He is on a quite bare paddock and I ride or lunge as often as I can but I keep getting thwarted, you know the kind of thing, sick kids, late at work, weathers too hot, weathers too wet!

Any way, summer hols are looming and as I work in a school that means 6 weeks off for me, so I have decided on a concerted effort to get that weight down.

So, just for a week to start with to see how he goes, stable overnight, 5 pm to 9 am the following morning, turnout on bare paddock, ride or lunge every day. Feed as much soaked hay as he wants, plus a tiny feed with vits and mins.

Does this seem reasonable? Whats an easy way to soak hay? Is there one? Can you reuse the water, we dont have a tap at the yard, we have water always available but I dont want to waste it unnecessarily. How long do you have to soak it for, and could you use haylage instead and soak that in the same way?

Sorry for all the questions but I've never had to deal with a good doer before, its a whole different ball game from a skinny type isnt it? A whole new set of problems and worries! Thanks for reading if you've got to the end!

 

[vieshot]

Ride, go out brisk walking for as long as you can manage.

 

[Honeypots]

Sounds like a plan yes

I soak my hay overnight or for 12 hrs for my fatties but definitely use fresh water each time.
Don't starve him but at the same time a few hrs with no hay will do him no harm either (other than boredom).
I'd be tempted to stable him in the day as you will be riding so that will break up his boredom in the stable and they generally tend to eat more in the day. Then out at night in the starvation paddock with soaked hay/or not depending on the amount of grass in your paddock. If there is any grass at all I would leave him without hay.

 

[madiz123]

oh dear!!! i'm trying to get two of my horses fit atm and I cant stable them, which is proving problematic!

I take my horses out once or twice a day, trotting out in the morning, then schooling in the afternoon/evening (involving lots of cantering ie for ten minutes on each leg roughly, possible do that twice with a big break in between). Make sure if your exercising a lot everyday to not do it on hard ground because it'll really strain their legs.

 

[Storminateacup]

Its a nightmare isnt it. I have a fat HW cob with 10 inches of bone and never manage to get him really slim no matter what ever I try although he is looking fairly good ATM. Sorry to sound defeatest.
Mine has a scoop of Safe & Sound after ridden work which is 4 hour and half hacks per week plus a bit of schooling. he then has turnout in the day in a well grazed field and at night turnout with lamanitic in an almost bare field.
I do not feed any hay until around mid December.
I would say feeding ad lib hay even that which has been soaked is still too much nutrition.
Try feeding a medium sized haynet of soaked hay or feed him a hay/ straw mix. That too is very effective and my friend does this with her laminitic horse, who now looks like a whippet.

As far as reusing water for days I heard that after 3-4 days of soaking hay in it the water will give it the same bacterial contect as raw sewage! and therefore must be disposed of down the main drainage system!!

 

[BSJAlove]

i wouldnt bother feeding to be honist. our family fatty is ideal weight at the moment and only gets fed after a ride and he only has enough to get some garlic in him. hes on a paddock with just enough grass sharing with another cob and he is ridden 3 or 4 times a week. he lives out 24.7.

we brought him 8 years ago and he was 100kilos over weight, obviously he suffered a few laminitus attacks and that was a kick in the gut to get the weight off. so he was put on a starvation paddock and only got fed enough to mix in some suppliments once a day.

good luck, regular exersize, even if you lunge is worth it and perseverance works best.

 

[ester]

exercise as much as you can manage, I'm afraid to say its part of owning a cob.

Stuff the weather to be honest (as it will prob be hot over the next 6 weeks), my pone gets very hot but his weight is more important so he will be worked but carefully hosed off to cool him down later. Its not always fun but I ride him regardless rain/shine because that is my responsiblity to him and because I need him fit enough to compete

For future reference I find it much easier if I can stop him getting to that point in the first instance ie the minute the spring grass starts coming through his exercise is upped to 6 days a week.

I would not feed soaked haylage- I don't soak hay, so don' t think I can comment on re-using water etc, I would say not but am not sure

I have some pics of my boy- this is when I bought him after approx 4-6 weeks of being in light work and on summer short grazing.

This is him now (he is still shiny light was rubbish as first thin in morning).

I haven't got any of his progress (this is 4 years later) but I think I had him to a more reasonable weight by the end of the first summer we went from and x-wide to medium width saddle. I had him vetted and vet said he was quite fit still underneath so he did go into reasonably hard work pretty quickly.

Currently he is worked 6 days a week, gallops/long canters on grass track twice a week, lunged once, schooled once, jumped once. and long hack once. normally. I am currently midway through a 2 weeks of not riding due to an ankle injury and have lots of friends booked into ride him cos I dare not let him go without exercies. I have no school but he has to work despite the hard ground, I have so far never had a lameness issue due to this and think he is used to it.

If you struggle to keep him exercised would you consider having a sharer/helper to help with the riding. I did this for a lot of people riding out their horses before I had my own.

I think I just want to say that it is possible but you have to work at it and with Frank I have found that exercise is the key, moreso than his intake

 

[ester]

would just like to add the reason I have always preferred the exercise rather than the starvation paddock too is that I have seen numerous incidences of impaction colic from horses on starvation paddocks so I would never purposely withold hay.

Also he gets no food apart from formula 4 feet and in the winter gets adlib hay, pony nuts, hifi and depending on work load a small scoop of sugar beet twice a day.

 

[Patches]

[ QUOTE ]
would just like to add the reason I have always preferred the exercise rather than the starvation paddock too is that I have seen numerous incidences of impaction colic from horses on starvation paddocks so I would never purposely withold hay.

Also he gets no food apart from formula 4 feet and in the winter gets adlib hay, pony nuts, hifi and depending on work load a small scoop of sugar beet twice a day.

[/ QUOTE ]

I've heard of sand colic when people keep them in a manege with very little to eat, meaning they end up hoovering up the sand in the school for tiny bits of hay etc that might have dropped on the surface.

To the Op:

I am pretty sure I read somewhere once that the water from soaking hay becomes toxic when left for over 24 hours and therefore needs to be replaced daily to prevent your horse becoming ill as a result. I might be wrong though.....but I'd swear on my life that I did read that.

I don't think you need to ride your cob every day to within an inch of his life either. I have two fatties by breed, a Shetland and a Welsh Section A, who are rarely worked....well never in the case of the shetland.

I keep them on a starvation patch in the day, muzzled. It isn't bare soil, there is grass cover, but it's shorter than a bowling green. They pick on there for 14 hours a day. I then open the fence into the rest of the paddock overnight. There's only a little more grass in there, just a bit more green, but it's enough to stop me feeling guilty. They are still muzzled overnight.

No feed at all....just a mineral lick (and not a mollassed one).

If your horse is very unfit as well as overweight, I'd have thought the best advice would be to hack your horse until he started to shift weight. Expecting him to canter for ten minutes or so on each rein whilst he's grossly unfit can't be good for his health. It'd be like expecting Dawn French (bless her, she's great) to wake up one morning and compete in a marathon! No one would suggest that was a good idea, without a good diet and training/preparation.

With mine, I bring them in every third day for a few hours just to feed them all a small amount of long fibre. I admit I choose to feed haylage (but it's not alot) as one of mine has sinus problems and I find it less of a bind than soaking. I personally feel that topping them up with some long fibre every couple of days is good for the gut.

 

[ester]

patches I should have qualified that better the colics were mostly paddocks that had been used for winter turnout and hence had lots of bare earth hence the colic, it does depend on what people class as a 'starvation paddock'

Frank was on restricted back in april because he was off games due to injuring himself on the beach and that paddock was prob a bit like you bowling green one.

I do think if he is unfit you will have to up his exercise slowly, as I say Frank had been in proper work up to about 4-6 weeks before the first photo and had been hacked out in the meantime. He was a recent purchase by someone else who didn't get on with him, his initial schooling and lungeing sessions were quite short but were frequent and we did lots of long walk/trot hacks.

 

[Spudlet]

QR

http://www.worldhorsewelfare.org/information/right_weight_advice
Many useful tips here, podcast available and you can also get a free DVD if you give them a call.

Good luck, and well done for trying to tackle the problem!

 

[Dteccytiv]

Have you tried turning him out at night and stable him during the day, because during the day the grass is at it's richest. My boys well built, and he's on a starvation paddock 24/7. He only gets fed when i ride him and thats just a handful of chaff and an apple. I do try to ride at least an hour every day.

 

[wildpoppywild]

my highland is a night mare for her weight she's always podgy but cant ride her out just now (waiting for shoes!!!) she wont lunge she broke my fingers last time, she used to free school well but surprise suprise i dont have a school now

we use a grazing muzzle on her which she cope with fine, if she has to be brought in through the day she is, and no hard feed. i've been rying for 6 years, nothing beat hacking out over hills everyday for fattys imo

 

[Guinness]

Have you got any photos? For a 15.1 HW cob I would say 550kg is pretty good. I have a 15.2 ish cob and was weighed at 610kg at his fittest (on a weigh bridge) when he was in medium work at an equine college. Here he is anyway, I think he looks just right:

I have him out at night and in during the day with no hay, just a bit of hifi lite to feed a balancer. Seems to work ok for us

 

[Cuffey]

I too would have him out at night and in through the day
Agree with a balancer and add extra magnesium if he is cresty
Soaked Hay goes ''off'' very quickly in this heat so instead of soaking just use small hole hay nets, perhaps 2 one inside the other to slow down intake
If hay is dusty you may need to ''rinse''. Even haylage will not keep in this heat once opened.
Never starve
As much steady exercise as you have time for.

 

[PeterNatt]

Any weight loss should be done gradually.

I would suggest hacking your horse out for at least 4 hours per day and keeping it in a small mature pasture grass turnout paddock of about a quarter of an acre.

 

[traceyann]

I have a 16.1 cob vet wants him 500kg which i think is to thin but he now 560 still no ribs so he might be right. i soak my hay all day and quarter scoop of safe and sound just enough for vit and min supplement and small hole haynet and he grazing on mud but he seems to have stopped loseing anymore

 

[Slinkyunicorn]

My 15h cob has lost nearly 20 inches of her girth since I have had her - the best way of shifting it was by adjusting her diet last year due to laminitis. Previously I had done the restricted grazing no extra feed lot of work etc but the most efficient way of shifting the extra weight and keeping it off has been sticking to the laminitis diet. The most important thing is to weigh and measure any feed - and that includes hay. My cob has 6kgs of soaked hay a day all year round - it goes into her postage stamp pasddock with her - keeps her weight right but as important it keeps her gut moving. By feeding liitle or nothing they hold on to their weight more as their metabolism slows down in order to conserve energy.

 

[hollyandivy123]

i don't know if you have your own land or livery but the best thing i did for my 2 good doers is to set up a lane round the edge of the field known as a race track and also known as "paradice pasture mangement" in the wild esp with native ponies/cob they use to continually walk all day in search of grazing
the way we manage is good pasture fields means they are getting to many calories without the constant exercise.
i found if put them in a small paddock then the weight didn't shift but if i put them where they move more then they maintain their weight better. i feed 3yr old hay a nets worth if the old one looks a bit tucked up
so if you can i would try this, i made mine out of elec tape

 

[Patches]

I've heard this mentioned a few times. I get the idea, but if I did this to my paddock, my horses would have more grass area than they do in a small fenced off "fatty paddock".

Unless you are thinking of replacing the grass with sand, woodchip, hardcore etc I don't see what benefit it will really give. Mine wander about all day searching for that tiny bit of grass to shoot up.

If you do mean to replace the grass, then that's also a no go for us. It would breach our cross compliance rules for the single farm payment, not to mention it'd require planning consent.

 

[Honeypots]

I made my track in winter so that they trashed it to mud. What grew back in spring is minimal but enough to keep them happy and moving:

Majority is just dirt...at the back and the right hand corner is some grass but its sparce and weedy but it's enough to keep them occupied along with a couple wedges of soaked hay between them to fill their bellies.
Occasionally I'll let them in the middle to keep it down as a treat

 

[ester]

From a thread below, example of racetrack system

 

[Honeypots]

hahahahahahaha....people are gonna get soooooo sick of my pic

 

[ester]

Honeypots you got there before me! was just borrowing your pic as I thought it showed it well

 

[Honeypots]

[ QUOTE ]
Honeypots you got there before me! was just borrowing your pic as I thought it showed it well

[/ QUOTE ]

No worries...I got confused tho...thought I'd hit submit twice..lol

 

[ester]

and me!

 

[hollyandivy123]

i don't replace the grass with sand etc and it is down to the bare bowling green, they have to walk more to get the same amount of grass and also i don't turn them out into fresh grass at night but will give a small bit of very old hay if the old one looks like he needs the bulk or sometimes i might move the fence in 6 inchs for a couple of feet
they spend the whole summer round the edge, grass grows in the middle which is cut for hay and around the end of august september (depending on the weather) then i move them into the middle so the edge can recover for the winter.
one is 30 and i thought i would be making rainbow bridge this year as he was really stiff and pottery on the front. 2 weeks with this and he changed as he was walking more.
my race track is only about wide 4m wide, i use to strip graze and move the fence and put another one up behind but tried this and it works well

 

[Patches]

Arrr I see now.

My hubby and father in law would have a pink fit if I did that to the edge of their field though...I mean the mud bath bit. They already think I'm a candidate for RSPCA cruelty proceedings when they look at the non-grass I keep them on now.

 

[hollyandivy123]

just to add mine is green not mud as i am to aware of the field management and farm etc the farmer i rent of would have a fit

the track was only put up for the spring and summer grass and will be taken down for the winter

 

[Honeypots]

To be fair...mine is quite exteme and you can obviously have your tracks as wide or as long as you need to avoid poaching. Mine has literally been a life saver for one of my ponies and has worked out very well for the other three too but obviously isn't an option for everyone.