Weight & Muscle Maintanence (help!)

[Keimanp]

Hi All,

It has been a while since I have posted on here but I was wondering if you could offer any help/advice.

I have a 18.5year old Welsh Section D gelding (Prince).

Around 18 months/2 years ago I started having trouble maintaining Prince's weight, he got fairly ribby (within a couple of weeks, I was working away at the time and they are kept at home, (he was checked on twice a day whilst I was away). I put it down to a poor amount of grazing available and the quality of the grass not being as good as it could be. Since loosing this weight we have not yet managed to get it back on and stay on! I used to have the other issue that if he was out of work I would be fighting to keep the pounds off! He is not a greedy horse and doesn't rush his food, never has)

My two have been wormed regularly, they are the only ones on the pasture and I rotate the fields frequently, checked by the vet etc.

At the begining of this year he was about right and where he should be so I brought him back into work and gave him a reasonable feed following exercise to account for the additional I was asking him to do. This didn't stop the weight coming back off, I would have expected some fat loss and toneing up of muscle, but instead we had muscle and fat loss. At this point I was concerned and he was due his annual jabs so the Vet came back out and gave him a clean bill of health, I raised my concerns about his ribs being visible (not that you could just feel them you can see them!)and his reduction in muscle coverage mainly accross his back but I was dissmissed and told I should limit his grazing and feed intake as he is significantly overweight.

I reduced his exercise although this wasn't much and didn't really know what to do! My farrier then came out and commented on Prince's weight, and how he was getting better weight wise and closer to where he should be, but he needs to put a bit more on to cover his ribs! I trust the farrier more than the vet!

At the moment he is turned out 24/7 with unlimited grazing (grass is about 4-6inches in length, and their not making much of a dent on it and I have two further summer paddocks to go at if needed!). He is getting ad-lib hay, A haynet gets hung from the tree in the field and replaced when empty (his companion is a shetland so by hanging it out the way the mini-one doesn't eat that much of it, he's more interested in the grass, he is also very rounded and I'm trying to limit his intake!). He is also getting a feed morning and night amounting to a total of 4 scoups of Build-up mix as advised by D&H

He is still not putting weight on, he isn't cold, he is however happy in himself.

Over the past 6 months he has lost muscle accross his topline even though he is working really well, Dressage instructor loves him! He has gone from a wide/extra wide fitting saddle to a medium. I would expect him to change shape as he gets older but the muscle loss has been significant and his back has hollowed out.

I have another Vet coming out on Wednesday afternoon, I have requested the one everyone recommends from the practice and have since found out the one I had is known as a bit of a numpty.

I am requesting he is checked over and requesting blood tests for tapeworm (although he has been wormed for this) and for Cushings (ACTH).

He doesn't have the typical cushings coat, but it is duller when comparing with photographs of previous years. His creast is large (it always is when he is being fed, just wish it'd move to where it is needed!) but he is suffering muscle wasteage and weight loss elsewhere. He has also developed a nasal-ly noise form time to time and his glands are up and down on an irregular basis through no apparrent cause. (All has been relayed to the vets during visits and call outs but I have been told he is fine, I've had him 14 years I know he isn't!)

I have also taken samples and I am sending off today for worm counts to be done.

Is there anything else I should consider or ask for, should I change his feed? Is there anything in the pasture he could ingest that could cause this (As far as I know there is nothing that could cause this within his pasture (all of the fields, and that the other mini one access to as well with no signs of ill health) but if there is something I should look out for!

Apologies for how long this is, hopefully it is readable and you can give me some ideas!

Thanks

Robert

 

[be positive]

Bloods are a good place to start, not just cushings and tapeworm but a general check too, he may have some liver damage or kidney problem that is preventing uptake of nutrients.

If he is working correctly he should have a topline, even if underweight it should be maintained by correct work, I would get a physio to look at him, if he is sore somewhere he will not use himself properly, although may appear to, a crest can be a sign of the horse holding themselves in a fixed way in order to protect sore areas, front foot pain can result in a large crest forming, they hold the neck tight so the crest builds up, a badly fitting saddle can also contribute .

Lots of things to look at, there may be a simple answer shown in the bloods, otherwise it is a case of working through the whole horse step by step.
As the feed is not helping, I would look at trying something else, a mix is not ideal as there is too much sugar in them and even if he is not laminitic it is not good for him to have so much, I have had good results with Baileys Topline cubes.

You have not mentioned his teeth, have they been done recently?

 

[TGM]

Cushings would be my first thought given his age and the way he has lost topline so good thing you are testing for that. Horses don't always get the typical Cushings coat - I had one that didn't but still tested strongly positive for Cushings (he had also lost his topline).

 

[Keimanp]

He has had his teeth done and has no problem in eating, he isn't due to have the dentist back out for a while and he didn't need much work doing on his last visit.

I am just about to book the phsyio to come out and give him a work up. I don't think he is sore on the forehand and his crest isn't particularly muscle buildup from holding himself but where he is storeing fat/sugars, If I stop or reduce the feed then his crest does decrease. I will however look into it more.

I am feeding him a mix as he doesn't get on well with cubes, they tend to make him cough/splutter and wheeze regardless of how much I have wetted them (I suppose I could turn them into a mash). I can get away with it if I put them in a slow feed ball and put it in the field so it takes him a lot longer to eat, but I don't know how much he is getting by doing this. (Also the mini-one definately doesn't want to be clearing them up!)

I will have a look at feeds and options as to how I can change it round and reduce the sugar but without getting him coughing!

I forgot to mention that his droppings are well formed and he is taking on and processing all the food.

Thanks for the replies and ideas!