Well, we are trying loading again tonight.

LankyDoodle

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Tips please!

I have a 17.3hh WB who is quite thick (can't work out turning his body when he gets in the trailer), quite chlaustrophobic (can't see enough space in there, although as trailers go, this is one of the most spacious), quite stubborn and takes the mick (I know this because he has tried similar when going into his stable and we got through that, but that is easier than loading, isn't it?).

Basically, you lead him up the ramp, get to the top, he just stands there and as you try to get him to turn, he runs back and stands at the bottom of the ramp staring at us. His last owners (our friends) used to lead him up while the other stood in the box with food trying to tempt him to turn. The one who led him then quickly jumped down and shut the doors, but quite often he'd back up while they were shutting the doors. I am more than enough convinced that he is taking the pee out of whoever loads him rather than being scared, because of other things he's done (like the stable issue for eg). I was going to get one of those halters (as per Maxwell) and try some stuff with that, then try using it to load him, but my farrier said before shelling out on one of those, try the rope over the nose (which works with my cob when leading) first, as he seems to respond to this when the farrier does it during shoeing (when he messes around).

I know the theory and I am happy to explain how to approach training a troublesome loader, but now it's coming down to it I already have knots in my stomach.

1) He is reluctant to leave my cob, so should I first try loading with the cob already in there?
2) Any other tips?
3) Help!
 

MrsMozart

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Try putting a lunge line through a piece of binder twine attached to the tie-up ring, attach one end to ned and you hold the other, then when he tries to back up you'll have some degree of control
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.
 

Rana

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I don't have much experience with trailers, so apologies if this is a silly question
smile.gif


Why do you need to turn him once you're at the top of the ramp? I thought trailers were just straight in... Most of my loading has been done on horseboxes - to load the ones at the back, we used to turn them on the ramp. So if you wanted their heads to the left, you lead them up the right hand side, and just gently ease them to the left before they step onto the lorry itself. Makes it easier for them to sort their feet out
smile.gif
Not sure if this helps with your trailer loading as not sure why/where you need to turn
smile.gif


I would try loading with your cob there, but only if he's well behaved and doesn't mind the other one messing about.

Remember your gloves
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MrsMozart

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[ QUOTE ]
Oooh so let me get this right... the lunge line attached to his collar and me holding the other end, but looped through the binder twine?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup
smile.gif
. That way, you can lead him up the ramp. As you go up, take up the slack in the line; if he pulls back, you can put some tension on from ahead of him. If he's just being a twit, it might be enough to help persuade him to keep on walking
cool.gif
. If you can manage it, have a normal lead rope on so's you can tie him up once you get in there
grin.gif
.
 

LankyDoodle

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[ QUOTE ]
I don't have much experience with trailers, so apologies if this is a silly question
smile.gif


Why do you need to turn him once you're at the top of the ramp? I thought trailers were just straight in... Most of my loading has been done on horseboxes - to load the ones at the back, we used to turn them on the ramp. So if you wanted their heads to the left, you lead them up the right hand side, and just gently ease them to the left before they step onto the lorry itself. Makes it easier for them to sort their feet out
smile.gif
Not sure if this helps with your trailer loading as not sure why/where you need to turn
smile.gif


I would try loading with your cob there, but only if he's well behaved and doesn't mind the other one messing about.

Remember your gloves
wink.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, Rana. George is reasonably well behaved and we'll put the partition across once he's in.

The trailer we have is side loading. There is much more space inside than a normal trailer. Our old lorry was a side load as well. I like the idea of turning slightly while on the ramp - hadn't though of it like that. Nice idea.
 

LankyDoodle

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[ QUOTE ]
[ QUOTE ]
Oooh so let me get this right... the lunge line attached to his collar and me holding the other end, but looped through the binder twine?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yup
smile.gif
. That way, you can lead him up the ramp. As you go up, take up the slack in the line; if he pulls back, you can put some tension on from ahead of him. If he's just being a twit, it might be enough to help persuade him to keep on walking
cool.gif
. If you can manage it, have a normal lead rope on so's you can tie him up once you get in there
grin.gif
.

[/ QUOTE ]

Thanks, MM. I'd never heard this before, but it sounds a great idea!
 

MrsMozart

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You welcome
smile.gif


Given the layout of your trailer, it might work better if you have a second person at the other end of the trailer holding the line. If I could draw a diagram I would
grin.gif
.

Give it a go, with a bit of variation on a theme and see what works
grin.gif
.

It can also work in rear ramp trailers with horses that don't like feeling crowded. The line goes from horse, through trailer and out either the front ramp or the jockey door (going via the tie-up ring. Horsey can then be encouraged up without feeling crowded
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.
 

Rana

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Aah, I get it now - never seen a side loading trailer before
blush.gif


Turning on the ramp should make it easier for him to see where he's supposed to be, as you're kind of pointing him in the right direction before he gets there.

Good luck!
 

AmyMay

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I suspsect it's yout trailer that's the problem - not the horse.

A 17.3hh horse is big enough in any trailer, even the ones designed especially for big horses. Are you sure that your trailer is actually big enough for him?

If he is claustrophobic then it doesn't matter really what you do - it will just compound the issue won't it??
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LankyDoodle

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Yes the trailer is big enough for him. It is designed for 2 18hh horses and he's actually only ever been in it once - he had this issue in his last home where they had both a lorry and a trailer. When he is in the trailer, there is lots of space around him and above him (I will take a picture tonight if he actually goes in). If it was due to my trailer then it would be a new issue developed since he came to us, but it's not a new issue; it's an issue he has had for a long time.

I'm afraid there are no excuses - he is taking the mick. He may be a little claustrophobic, which is due to his size, but the trailer is very light and airy inside and is actually bigger than our LT35 was, in terms of internal space for the horse.
 

LankyDoodle

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LOL. Thanks Owlie.

Well we will see. I think that could work.

His last owners didn't really put in enough consistent work to break the problem. Their method of loading him would work after about an hour of messing around, but some of the time he would only get half way up the ramp before backing up! I don't know how, but I just KNOW he's taking the mick (in part, I think I trust my very knowledgeable and experience farrier's wisdom there), and in part it's because he's been allowed to in the past. The faff they used to have... it was like a contortion act!

Before we bought him, part of our consideration was a) whether he was too big to travel with another horse; b) whether he was too big/heavy for our trailer/4x4 combo. Both of these issues settled, we went ahead and bought him with the plan to concentrate on his loading issues.
 

kate081

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If it were me I'd use the Monty Roberts method - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGsOV_eOYXk

That way you control the backing up bit & he'll soon get bored of it & follow you on the trailer. You don't need a pressure halter so long as he respects you & the pressure you put on his headcollar.

I taught my recently purchased 3yo to load at the weekend using this method & it took me 15 min to get him in the trailer on my own. When I collected him it took 3 of us 2 hours.

Def worth ago & it's a very calm way of going about things
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sybil

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I'm seconding the "feed him in the trailer everyday for 8 weeks" worked with mine... well I didnt do it for 8 weeks but he goes in fine now if you rattle the bucket a bit... greedy clevelands!!
 

jhoward

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in regards to the pressure halters.. they have theor place, and im not a fan. i took a horse to a monty roberts demo for loading issues.. my exact words were dont make that horse rear.. due to the extreme pressue put on the dually the horse reared.

ive also seen it do the same to 2 other horses.

you may of done it, but before attempting to load into the trailer and turn id do the turning work on the ground. ie turning into a stable, or generally getting him to move away away from your pressure, i would imagine that can you can get him in the trailer just by moving hes quarters, possible a step forward or a near turn on the forehand to aline hes back end.

it could also be that hes worried about hitting hes hips in the trailer, not nessacary the actual height/space of it. pad him out in rugs, and before loading give him a good pat and run your hands all over him. so if as he goes in he does brush himself its not such a OMG to him.

the idea of the lunge rein i understand., as i used it to load a horse last week, if needed clip it the side of the trailer, bring around him and you keep control of it. as you get to the point where he stops, let him then just gently pull and give on the rein, so your almost rocking him forward.

i honestly find that when loading difficult horses people behind them etc just make it worse, doing it quietley by my self i find a lot easier, if the horse wants to rush backwards relise all pressure and let it, then go back to where you were, you not getting stressed will also keep your boy calm,

the only time i apply more pressure is if the horses starts to switch off... ie is stood resting a leg, or looking about, that shows me its being a stubborn git and not scared of a thing.. phew.. sorry thats a bit long!
 

LankyDoodle

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Thank you EEE. I may well give it a go.

JHoward, thank you for your detailed post. Do you mean that you clipped the lunge line to the trailer then put it behind him? :S

Yes, I have done plenty of groundwork with him, especially with regards to stables as he had a few tantrums about going in and out of one!

Also, what you said about the looking around etc. This is another reason I think he really isn't scared but is being a typical stubborn WB! He doesn't just walk up the ramp and back straight back down. He will sometimes (often actually - this is why he has only been IN our trailer once) go up the ramp, stand at the top and just look round, look at us, lick us, chew the door, anything but move forward, for about 5 minutes! He will go as far as front legs in the trailer with head over the partition (so imagine him standing looking at the opposite wall where the other horse would stand) and his back end on the ramp, then he'll seem to think 'well if you're not gona MAKE me do anything then I'm gona have some fun. Waaahaaay!')
 

jhoward

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yes, i clipped the rein over a hook.. worst case it could come off on its own accord, kept the lead rope in one hand and rein in the other.

doing it yourself allows you to know how much pressure to apply. try and kepp it just above the hocks., not round the quarters as by being on the hocks its a weaker point to be able to pull the legs forward to encourage them to move.

at the point of entering the trailer be carful not to pull on the head, as if he shots hes head up and bangs it it will give you more issues, use your rein to pull him in.
 

Coffee_Bean

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Get the Richard Maxwell Halter- I got my unloadable mare loading with it(and by unloadable I mean every trick in the book, rearing vertical and throwing herself on the floor was her favourite trick). I did 40 mins groundwork with it after watching the video and then she walked straight on. I practised every day for 3 months-she now loads perfectly everytime. And she is travelling better every time she goes- had an hour journey on her own yesterday and hardly broke a sweat
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I also got a 16hh brute of a cob loading after 15 minutes groundwork- who was doing exactly the same as your boy does. He was totally taking the piss with his owners by just standing at the top of the ramp then pissing off across the yard when he got bored. 15 mins work the halter and he followed me straight on- and I was only 14 at the time, but he didn't dare take the piss with it as he knew how it worked.

Honestly- they are worth their weight in gold!!!
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LankyDoodle

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Thanks JHoward, will see what happens.

CB, It was the RM halter I'd been thinking of getting. I enquired months ago about getting him out, but then our friend offered us the DVD. She hasnt found it yet so I may just buy one. I had real faith in RM's methods, hence wanting to get the halter. I am so impressed by the successed you had. Well done!

Am off in 5 minutes to do some practising with him. So nervous! Think I might end up buying the DVD and halter tonight.
 

Rachaelpink

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My pony was a pain to load e.g. 4 hours or more. Had a natural horseman come out and that worked for a while.

She goes in fine now, mine's a side loading small box.

I use a monty roberts headcollar and I would definately put another horse in first if you can. I had to fit a mirror in mine as I can only carry one and she has a treacle lick in their for the journey- she never has the treacle lick at any other time so she looks forward to it.

The natural horseman told me to keep her moving side to side at the edge of the ramp and not let her stop moving and try leading her up to ramp then backing up etc until they get fed up.

I also used to feed her in the box and not go anywhere then go around the block. My pony also likes to have a window to look out of- has your horse got a window he can see out of?
 

LankyDoodle

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[ QUOTE ]

My pony also likes to have a window to look out of- has your horse got a window he can see out of?

[/ QUOTE ]

Yes, it is a huge great Equitrek (the bigger one) and has a window in the rear door.
 

LankyDoodle

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Right, anyway, update.

I am SO proud of my boy! I think the groundwork I've put in over recent months has helped. The fact he knows if I want him to do something then he normally has to do it, and messing around doesn't pay off, has also helped. Anyway, George went in first. Bit of messing around from him but he more or less went straight in. Rope went over L's nose and we led him to the ramp. He put a foot on the ramp and up we walked together. As we got near the top I started moving him round a bit. Got to the top of the ramp and in he went, used a stick to just tap his back end round and into the box, which he did with minimum fuss. Then before I said anything, over comes my lumux of a husband and as loud as you like says 'right I'll shut the doors' and slams them shut!
shocked.gif
Cue Lanky rushing backwards. So I went and calmed him down, talked to him, stroked him etc, told my husband in no uncertain terms to WAIT for me to say to shut the doors and to do it with no fuss and quietly. Walked towards the ramp, up he went, turned himself at the top and I stood with him talking in a hyper-happy voice to him, praising him. Husband came over, slowly and quietly shut the doors while I let Lanky mooch in a treat packet, up came the ramp, bit of kicking but that was it. Then he got fed in there. Stayed in there a short while, loads of praise and then out again; he was quiet and calm coming out as well. Walked Lanky back up on his own and he was absolutely fine!

I am so pleased with him. Obviously our relationship developing has helped, and like I said the groundwork, but George being in there at first was the main thing I think. George and Lanky will mainly be travelling together anyway, but it is nice that he went up alone as well.

Going to practise daily for many weeks I think and will perhaps still look into the halter/dvd from RM because I think it is more suitable than the rope over the nose job I did tonight.

Thanks for the advice everyone. Wooohoooo!
 
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