What’s going on with my horses feet. :(

[poiuytrewq]

This is seriously stressing me out!
Seedy Toe? The first tiny crack appeared a while ago but it seems to have recently worsened a lot and is both fronts, the hinds don’t look amazing either.
I mentioned it to my farrier last time he was here and he was very unfazed, sprayed it with some iodine and said I panic too much.
I’ve tried to pick it out and keep it clean but I can’t get it all out with the shoe in the way.
I’ve been standing and soaking him for as long as he will (probably not long enough) in copper sulphate solution which completely sorted my pony when he has seedy toe, he was shoeless though and it was easier for me to dig the soft manky stuff out, soak and pack with hood stuff. I’d hoped by standing him in buckets of solution wit would help.

He is always shod with side clips rather than a toe as his toes are weaker but also when we have tried in the past he has been uncomfortable for a few days directly afterwards whereas normally he’s completely sound straight after shoeing, as of course he should be.



These photos were taken today. He is almost 6 weeks, I think 5+ a few days post shoeing. Obviously the one with the chunk out is my biggest worry but not so long ago that was just a little crack and the better hood barely anything.

I do feel like he would benefit greatly from 6 months without shoes but as long as he’s in work this isn’t really feasible. If he turns into the horse from hell again this winter I may well pull them off and concentrate on improving his feet rather than swinging off him for winter. iIts very stony between the field and yard is my worry.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Also aside from that particular issue, If anyone see’s other issues please do let me know.

 

[Barton Bounty]

Do you feed biotin or seaweed?

 

[ester]

Hopefully not

p the last pic would leave me wanting to know how far that one goes up, I’d it’s getting worse it might be better to resect it (I’d prob see about xraying to check for any gas pockets indicating infection higher up)

 

[Tiddlypom]

Hopefully not

p the last pic would leave me wanting to know how far that one goes up, I’d it’s getting worse it might be better to resect it (I’d prob see about xraying to check for any gas pockets indicating infection higher up)

Agree with both of these points .

Having had a seedy toe which ended up nearly as high as the coronet band, even though it didn’t look much from the outside, I’d want that checked out. An x Ray will show how high it goes, but my vet got stuck in with a dremel and just kept going far further than he initially thought that he’d initially need to.

Even my good farrier was useless at spotting seedy toe. He’d declare that a toe crack was tiny and nothing to worry about, and later the same day I’d go excavating with a galvanised nail and discover a massive cavity .

ETA the seedy toe always came good in the end, though . Even though my ex team GB vet said that he’d never seen seedy toe as severe.

 

[Gloi]

That looks like quite nasty seedy toe which possibly needs resectioning.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Sorry! Hope fully not what? Feeding seaweed or biotin?
I do feed a hoof supplement which contains biotin yes. As a little more back ground horse has always had ok feet, not amazing but never lost shoes or had problems. They would look the same after a week that they looked after 5 or 6. He has been on a strict 5-6 tops cycle. Then one time back in summer he suddenly had loose shoes, risen clenches and looked like he'd not seen a farrier in months. This was when I started the supplement so he's not been on it all that long. I *think that's when the initial crack appeared. He's never been one that I've had to think about his feet really.
He had Aviform Biodura as its the only thing he will eat.
So I'd say he has had hoof problems, that he didn't previously since about July- At the time i put it down to hard dry ground etc.

Eugh god, not great then. Why are farriers so blase about things sometimes?! I'm dreading this conversation. With the pony it was very much "ahhh not a lot we can do about that but he will be fine" It was only that I looked into it elsewhere that i knew and was able to fix it. I do in general rate him and really like him but fml i wish I could get a bit more out of the guy!


How can I prevent the second hoof becoming as bad?

 

[Tiddlypom]

If your farrier is likely to be difficult/blasé then go straight to the vets and mention wanting foot x rays.

Vets do any resectioning, that’s not a farrier job, but remedial shoeing might be needed afterwards.

The longer it is left, if it is seedy toe, then the worse it will get.

 

[FieldOrnaments]

re. feeding -- biotin isn't really absorbed from food afaik& few supplements contain enough to make a difference to hooves anyway
and
seaweed is just going to cause iodine overload without providing much/anything else of benefit

hoof gurus please correct if wrong on anything!

 

[IrishMilo]

I personally think he's shod short, I'd like to see the shoe longer to support the heel.

 

[Equi]

I find the lines on the top of the hoof interesting. Has he struggled this spring/summer with laminitis?

 

[ester]

I personally think he's shod short, I'd like to see the shoe longer to support the heel.

It’s a bit short but also one of the better shoeing jobs we’ve seen on here.
Ditto TP skip the farrier for the time being. I’d probably pack the smaller one with hoof stuff (after soaking) if you can around the shoe but the longer one as it stands I think you’re risking just blocking stuff in.

 

[Tiddlypom]

This is the only pic that I find of my mare’s seedy toe resection. It was taken after the first refit so several weeks after the resection, and it had already grown quite a long way down.

It had looked fairly innocuous from the outside . It had taken hold under my long standing farrier’s watch, who had ignored it/not noticed it.

I accept it wasn’t a great foot, but that was 10 years ago and I’ve learned a lot from HHO since then.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I personally think he's shod short, I'd like to see the shoe longer to support the heel.

Yes I'd think the same, However this was how he was shod, or similar when i bought him and my farrier has tried a few different things, My previous horses (same farrier) have all been given more heel support but this horse makes what is right for him pretty obvious pretty quickly, like the toe clips for eg.

@Equi No he didn't. I only really noticed them taking the photos' and was trying to think what had changed or what may have caused them. I've never been told this but my farrier said when i first got him that he had had laminitis in the past and that I'd need to be a bit careful with grazing etc so i always have been. He spent spring and summer with two cushings ponies and lots of hay.

 

[poiuytrewq]

Ester- Will do. The farrier is here tomorrow which is what prompted me posting. I will give it them a good soak after he's done as his feet will be clean and trimmed. Maybe actually I could soak them while his shoes are off and farrier could trim a pony in between.


Tiddlypom- That looks awful, Did it return completely to normal?

 

[Barton Bounty]

My farrier said to help any hooves, the only thing that works is a pure biotin supplement or seaweed.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Tiddlypom- That looks awful, Did it return completely to normal?

A qualified yes, in that the vet was too conservative first time round and it recurred. Second time round he was more radical and that sorted it. It took about 10 months to grow out, though.

She was three in that pic, lost her age 13 earlier this year, but the seedy toe didn’t recur.

ETA that pic is of the first ‘too conservative’ resection . After the initial two weeks box rest she was sound and able to be turned out with the cavity packed with Keratex hoof putty. She was unbacked so not in work, though.

ETA2 same foot 6 years later .

 

[sbloom]

My farrier said to help any hooves, the only thing that works is a pure biotin supplement or seaweed.

I would tend to disagree, from what I've read, though I'm less an expert on feeding than I used to be. Methionine supplementation may be more appropriate, or a selection of amino acids, and seaweed is indeed, as said above, very high in iodine. Interesting stuff on Forageplustalk website - Eleanor Kellon on hoof health https://www.forageplustalk.co.uk/feeding-horse-hoof-health-dr-kellon/#more-5181, and the amino acid articles are good.

 

[FieldOrnaments]

Seaweed for Horses: Miracle Supplement or Massive Con?

Learn why seaweed might not be a good choice for many horses because of the risk of iodine toxicity, low trace mineral content, and more

feedxl.com

 

[Barton Bounty]

I would tend to disagree, from what I've read, though I'm less an expert on feeding than I used to be. Methionine supplementation may be more appropriate, or a selection of amino acids, and seaweed is indeed, as said above, very high in iodine. Interesting stuff on Forageplustalk website - Eleanor Kellon on hoof health https://www.forageplustalk.co.uk/feeding-horse-hoof-health-dr-kellon/#more-5181, and the amino acid articles are good.

Yip, ill think I will stick with what I know though and Orbis feet are absolutely amazing with just biotin.

 

[I'm Dun]

Yip, ill think I will stick with what I know though and Orbis feet are absolutely amazing with just biotin.

The biotin is doing nothing. Seaweed is now known to be detrimental.

 

[Barton Bounty]

The biotin is doing nothing. Seaweed is now known to be detrimental.

I beg to differ, im not aware of any farriers on the forum so you do you! And ill stick to my regime thanks though.
ETA Im not the one looking for advice, might be better responding to OP.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I personally think he's shod short, I'd like to see the shoe longer to support the heel.

Agree the shoe is too short needs more heel support.

 

[PinkvSantaboots]

I personally think he's shod short, I'd like to see the shoe longer to support the heel.

Agree the shoe is too short needs more heel support.

I would get him to cut the toe right back then get a very small syringe and squirt it with a diluted iodine or Milton solution everyday.

I do rate Swan antibac treatment for any sort of fungal foot issue.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I do have to agree with the biotin thing tbh. I have heard about seaweed causing problems but Biotin I do rate.
I used to have terrible weak nails and my little dog has a problem with his claws. I started him on Onychotin which is a biotin supplement for dogs and its literally been a life changer. took a good while to get into his system and grown stronger claw but he absolutely has. When i was unable to source it a while back he had problems again within 2 months (I'd guess) back on it and *touch wood* is ok again. Off the back of this i started taking a human supplement myself and my nails are definitely better.
I'm not a huge supplement fan, but due to the above reasons its one I'm happy to chuck in his food, even if it just makes me feel better

 

[poiuytrewq]

A qualified yes, in that the vet was too conservative first time round and it recurred. Second time round he was more radical and that sorted it. It took about 10 months to grow out, though.

She was three in that pic, lost her age 13 earlier this year, but the seedy toe didn’t recur.

ETA that pic is of the first ‘too conservative’ resection . After the initial two weeks box rest she was sound and able to be turned out with the cavity packed with Keratex hoof putty. She was unbacked so not in work, though.

ETA2 same foot 6 years later .

View attachment 148102

Hoof goals!
Thank you!

 

[Barton Bounty]

I do have to agree with the biotin thing tbh. I have heard about seaweed causing problems but Biotin I do rate.
I used to have terrible weak nails and my little dog has a problem with his claws. I started him on Onychotin which is a biotin supplement for dogs and its literally been a life changer. took a good while to get into his system and grown stronger claw but he absolutely has. When i was unable to source it a while back he had problems again within 2 months (I'd guess) back on it and *touch wood* is ok again. Off the back of this i started taking a human supplement myself and my nails are definitely better.
I'm not a hug supplement fan, but due to the above reasons its one I'm happy to chuck in his food, even if it just makes me feel better

I would buy just biotin or biotin plus, I buy gold label so that it is just that supplement in it, nothing else

 

[ester]

A healthy horse shouldn't need supplementary biotin but it's not doing any harm, can say about dogs , seaweed is probably less problematic than garlic at least but we have waaaayyy better options these days. Biotin can cause cob mallendars/sallenders issue exacerbation but unlikely the issue here.

P I would absolutely see if you can soak while shoes are off first.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I would buy just biotin or biotin plus, I buy gold label so that it is just that supplement in it, nothing else

He won’t eat anything other than Biodura, I’ve tried about 60 billion varieties

 

[poiuytrewq]

A healthy horse shouldn't need supplementary biotin but it's not doing any harm, can say about dogs , seaweed is probably less problematic than garlic at least but we have waaaayyy better options these days. Biotin can cause cob mallendars/sallenders issue exacerbation but unlikely the issue here.

P I would absolutely see if you can soak while shoes are off first.

Will do. I’ll also ask him to dig it out as much as possible.