What do I do? :’(

[poiuytrewq]

Beloved old horse, actually only 20 but he’s had a tough early life as a hireling in Ireland then was hammered in the school (think 90 min intense sessions daily)
Had lots of soundness issues and the decision was made to pts as he was unable to do either of the above without being crippled.
I was his groom and begged to be allowed to take him and try to keep him sound myself so 8 years ago he came home with me
He managed a good 5 years quiet hacking happily with the odd week off or shot of cortisone. Until 3 years ago, although sound I knew he didn’t want to be ridden anymore so stopped. He took to retirement pretty well, I got him a pony from the blue x as he got upset when the others were ridden but kept separately the two of them were happy.
He still gets stiff, needs bite for a few days before the farrier etc or if it’s really cold/horrible weather.
Last autumn he came down very suddenly with laminitis in all four feet. After a long box rest then woodchip paddock rest he came sound.
He was very miserable on restricted turnout and just stands all day rooted to the spot windsucking which of course is no good for his other issues, so I made the decision that I’d allow decent (ish) turnout, just enough to keep him happy, moving, grazing but not loads of grass. I also decided to pts if he got another attack. My rationale being winters a bit tough being old and stiff, summer is time for a retired boy to enjoy and if he’s on box rest or penned away he’s not enjoying it. He hates being stabled at anytime other than horrible winter nights, then he’s more than happy to come in and be tucked up!
His “stable” is part of the grain store and currently mid harvest I don’t have use of it. I do have a smaller wooden box, currently occupied but can chuck that one out but he’s miserable in it and eats it!
So anyway, this morning he’s lame with obvious laminitis and raging heat in all 4 feet.
He’s spent the past 2 weeks on a pretty bare paddock with last year’s soaked hay and a handful of chaff with his supplements in so I just don’t understand
However it’s not easy to pts now.
I’m going to try again but minus the long box rest. Maybe a few days and see how he does.
Heartbroken

 

[Chinchilla]

I can't really advise you on what to do but thank you for giving him a better life, sounds like he really landed on his hooves with you, whatever you decide to do next.

 

[scats]

I’m so sorry, it’s devastating when a beloved horse is unwell. Given his age and problems I think I would probably consider putting him to sleep.

He sounds like he’s had a fantastic 8 years with you and is obviously much loved. Big hugs whatever you decide xx

 

[Auslander]

It's rotten, and I hate saying it, but I'd be saying my goodbyes at this point. If he's gone down with lami again, on a bare paddock, you're very low on options - and a bare paddock/dry lot existence isn't much of a life for an old, retired horse.
I speak as someone who fought tooth and nail to fix an older horse who went down with laminitis - she was on box rest for months, and pen turnout for a year - I'm all up for giving it a go if they can at some point in the future enjoy a relatively normal life. I don't really see that happening for your boy, I'm afraid

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It is a puzzle isn't it? Have you had him tested for Cushings recently?
TBH I think I would pts at this stage. It doesn't sound as if you can keep him well and happy now, given his conflicting needs for his various ailments. You have given him 8 fabulous years of enjoying life with you which he wouldn't have had if you hadn't intervened. It is always hard to decide what to do but I am always an advocate of 'better a week too soon, than a day too late'.

 

[poiuytrewq]

He was last tested early summer, not sure exactally when but I was so convinced he had it so needed to know before making the choice of a bit more freedom.
Having spoken at length to his long term vet and his old owners/my employers yard manager (knows the horse inside out and was a big part of persuading the owners to give him to me at the time and always my first port of call)
I’ve decided to bring him in onto a small area of deep woodchip. Just had the first load delivered and another en route. Give him bute and see what happens over the weekend.
If there is no vast improvement or he worsens then the call will be made.

I re-read my post, I’m a bit rambly this morning sorry!

Please keep your fingers crossed for my old man

 

[poiuytrewq]

I thought he looked a bit sore yesterday but massive skid marks round the field and I assumed he’d been playing a bit much with his friends

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I thought he looked a bit sore yesterday but massive skid marks round the field and I assumed he’d been playing a bit much with his friends

Fingers firmly crossed for him, here. We had our Appy tested (ACTH) several times because we were suspicious, she was always within limits. Then we had the TRH test and it was 8 times the upper acceptable limit.

 

[poiuytrewq]

I did mean to have that done, then he’s been so good I told myself it was a one off attack hence the “if it ever happens again I’ll pts”
I will, if he doesn’t get comfortable very quickly I will..

I appreciate the replies here as I now feel a bit more confident in saying that and that if I do need to make that decision over the weekend it will be ok and the right thing to do.

 

[poiuytrewq]

O/H has just pointed out all the fresh shoots of grass on the side of the field they are not in. It still looks brown but there is definite life in it and I guess would have been their side but probably instantly nibbles off which could be the explanation. We had heavy rain two days ago

 

[meleeka]

Agree with the TRH test. False negatives are quite common with the standard cushings test and he does sound as if that’s what he’s got (unless it is because he’s been charging round the field). I don’t think any decision is the wrong one. You may choose to get him diagnosed and treated (diagnosis and treatment was the best thing that could have happened to my mare. She’s much more active so her stiff joints are a lot better and she’s literally got a new lease of life). On the other hand you could decide he’s suffered enough and make the call, which would also be perfectly reasonable and understandable.

 

[tda]

With an old pony i used to look after, he got to the stage when anything could set laminitis off, and we didn't always know what that was 😐 was totally off grass, lived in the farm yard, so that decision had to be made
It's very sad, I have two old ladies that I dont really want to put thru another winter, but making the call when they are still perky is hard 😓

 

[JillA]

And bear in mind we are in the seasonal rise of ACTH levels - even if the result was accurate in early summer it may well have tipped into problems now. Maybe long term a Prascend trial, it may very well help not only his feet but also what sounds to me like lethargy and depression.
Short term, bute, careful diet, conforming surface to support the bony column from his feet and maybe boots if you can't keep him in for long, with conforming pads for support. Or even just pads or other supports taped on.
But really, to be perfectly honest, calling it a day would be a kindness for him by the sound of it, you know the saying - better a day too soon than an hour too late

 

[poiuytrewq]

I know, I don’t think he is particularly lethargic and definitely not depressed it’s literally only if I keep him on really restricted turnout he’s miserable. I’m über careful about his happiness, that’s my main concern. Currently every time I go to them he’s eating hay, grooming or playing with daughters horse. His face looks happy, that sounds stupid but the last horse I pts had lost his sparkle, his eyes looked unhappy, this one isn’t. I will be very careful about that.
He does a beautiful trot over to me in the morning and is eating well and looks great.
The fact I feel he’s happy in himself at the moment is what’s put such a huge doubt on my decision to pts the second he showed any symptoms again. If I didn’t feel that i’d Have called the hunt first thing not the vet, boss and posted here.
It’s so bloody hard.

 

[Apercrumbie]

I don't think you're out of options yet so don't feel rushed into a decision, unless as you say he loses his sparkle. I would get that second cushings test and the woodchip sounds like an excellent idea.

 

[Louby]

So sorry to hear about your boy. Just wanted to share what a friend is going through atm. Her horse has had Lami once before and my friend works hard now to hopefully prevent it happening again, muzzled when out, limited turn out, exercised, lean etc etc. However last week she came in pottery, vet was called, xrays done and was surprised given the way she looks and how hard her owner works at trying to prevent it. A new horse had been introduced to the herd and basically ran my friends horse ragged, they have come to the conclusion that it is stress induced/concussion with the hard ground that has brought it on. She is now on box rest. Just wanted to share as you said you seen skid marks in the field so maybe could be the same with your boy?

 

[alainax]

I let my old boy go on too long, and it still haunts me. I try and tell myself I was just a teen at the time, but I so do wish that back then someone had told me " better a week too soon, than a moment too late"

It sounds like whatever you decide it will be with his best interests at heart. Thinking of you.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

It's rotten, and I hate saying it, but I'd be saying my goodbyes at this point. If he's gone down with lami again, on a bare paddock, you're very low on options - and a bare paddock/dry lot existence isn't much of a life for an old, retired horse.
I speak as someone who fought tooth and nail to fix an older horse who went down with laminitis - she was on box rest for months, and pen turnout for a year - I'm all up for giving it a go if they can at some point in the future enjoy a relatively normal life. I don't really see that happening for your boy, I'm afraid

This.

My mare when she was retired, and to be honest even in her ridden work, we always said that if she came down with lami then she would be pts.
She coliced on box rest and had arthritis.
She came out her stable one eveing, had been in out of the flies during the day, crippled lami in all four hooves. Coliced from the pain.
The vet that came out wasnt listening that i wanted her pts so we got her over the colic. Lots of pain meds and my normal vet came out the next morning to pts.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Beloved old horse, actually only 20 but he’s had a tough early life as a hireling in Ireland then was hammered in the school (think 90 min intense sessions daily)
Had lots of soundness issues and the decision was made to pts as he was unable to do either of the above without being crippled.
I was his groom and begged to be allowed to take him and try to keep him sound myself so 8 years ago he came home with me
He managed a good 5 years quiet hacking happily with the odd week off or shot of cortisone. Until 3 years ago, although sound I knew he didn’t want to be ridden anymore so stopped. He took to retirement pretty well, I got him a pony from the blue x as he got upset when the others were ridden but kept separately the two of them were happy.
He still gets stiff, needs bite for a few days before the farrier etc or if it’s really cold/horrible weather.
Last autumn he came down very suddenly with laminitis in all four feet. After a long box rest then woodchip paddock rest he came sound.
He was very miserable on restricted turnout and just stands all day rooted to the spot windsucking which of course is no good for his other issues, so I made the decision that I’d allow decent (ish) turnout, just enough to keep him happy, moving, grazing but not loads of grass. I also decided to pts if he got another attack. My rationale being winters a bit tough being old and stiff, summer is time for a retired boy to enjoy and if he’s on box rest or penned away he’s not enjoying it. He hates being stabled at anytime other than horrible winter nights, then he’s more than happy to come in and be tucked up!
His “stable” is part of the grain store and currently mid harvest I don’t have use of it. I do have a smaller wooden box, currently occupied but can chuck that one out but he’s miserable in it and eats it!
So anyway, this morning he’s lame with obvious laminitis and raging heat in all 4 feet.
He’s spent the past 2 weeks on a pretty bare paddock with last year’s soaked hay and a handful of chaff with his supplements in so I just don’t understand
However it’s not easy to pts now.
I’m going to try again but minus the long box rest. Maybe a few days and see how he does.
Heartbroken

If he were mine - I would get some joint supplement - like Flexijoint and some milk thistle which is good for laminitics, soak his hay 24 hrs give him a safe hard feed . https://ker.com/equinews/laminitis-new-research-milk-thistle-silymarin/. I would also check out a yard who offer larger stables too so he can move more and either do strip grazing or track grazing, my boy won't keep muzzles on so he goes out 2 1/2 hrs then in 4 then out 2hrs So far we have kept any flare ups at bay.

The other thing good for horses is hydrotherapy either pool or treadmill, if he needed a low dose bute I would do danilon.

That is what I would start by doing and in winter put leg wraps on either magnetic or just wraps to keep joints warm

 

[Sukistokes2]

Thank you for giving this horse the life he deserved in the first place. The decision is yours but I believe you have given him everything he could want or need and tried your best. Letting him carry on is not wrong, putting him down is not wrong. It’s a hard one. When your keeping them going for your own benefit ( that’s a general you) rather then for their benifit it’s probably time to call it a day.

 

[Clodagh]

Just remember, whichever you decide, that 20 is very old for a horse, very old indeed. People do have big horses that live into their 20s but they are not the norm. Either way don't beat yourself up, what a fantastic life he has had.

 

[TheresaW]

Just to add a little experience of my own.

I was convinced my Mac has cushings, but 3 tests all came back negative. Vet was last out in April to give him a once over and do his teeth, and straight away, she said, he’s definitely cushingoid. I mentioned the 3 tests, 2 of which she took herself, and she said false negatives aren’t uncommon, the test doesn’t work for all horses. She told me to start on half a pill a day and see how he went. I saw a marked improvement overall within a fortnight. Might be worth asking for a trial?

Mac has never had lami thankfully, but in your shoes, if you want to try a little bit more, I don’t think it’s wrong, I also don’t think you’d be wrong to say goodbye to him now either.

Good luck either way. Xx

 

[sport horse]

Now we have had rain and the grass is starting to shoot again the sugar levels will be very very high. No idea why but it happens! So sorry about your horse and thinking of you this weekend. So difficult to make the right decision but remember the old saying 'better a day too soon than a day too late'. Good luck. xx

 

[poiuytrewq]

Thank you all so much! I’ve been all teary and emotional feeling all day
I had to go to work for a couple of hours and came home to a far more cheery face. He’s on very deep chip and had 4 Bute so I suppose it’s inevitable he’s brighter but I’d not expected that much difference.
So part of me is relieved I gave him the chance, part of me is terrified now at having even more to panic about, will he get it now every time it rains? Will he be able to live out.
How much difference would 4 Bute make realistically?

 

[Ceriann]

You’ve got him more comfortable and he’s improved - take time to take a breath before you work out what next. Speak to your vet and try and take a step back (easier said than done I know) - is there an underlying trigger, can he be managed, can he have quality of life etc. Whatever you decide will be right - he’s had a wonderful few years with you, with someone who clearly cares for him.

 

[Doublethyme]

My old retired mare lives an unrestricted grazing life, she gets fat in the summer and I've said categorically that if she gets laminitis she would be pts. She loathes muzzles, box rest or restriction of any kind nowadays and I don't see the point. She has the right to enjoy her time left. Having said that I will find it as hard as you are to make the final decision, but quality over quantity every time in my opinion. You have given him an amazing extra bit of life, be proud of that. If he's miserable restricted, I think I know what my decision would be.

 

[poiuytrewq]

My old retired mare lives an unrestricted grazing life, she gets fat in the summer and I've said categorically that if she gets laminitis she would be pts. She loathes muzzles, box rest or restriction of any kind nowadays and I don't see the point. She has the right to enjoy her time left. Having said that I will find it as hard as you are to make the final decision, but quality over quantity every time in my opinion. You have given him an amazing extra bit of life, be proud of that. If he's miserable restricted, I think I know what my decision would be.

This is totally my thoughts, until yesterday morning it was concrete in my head.
If he’d still been as he was yesterday today it would still have been the plan.
This morning he’s completely normal again, I won’t ever box rest him again. This woodchip pen was bit of a clutching at straws idea, not mine my O/H who’s totally non horsey but worships this one. Sadly I can see us coming to blows over this as he seems to think this will work long term. It won’t.

 

[tda]

You say he's completely normal again today, but he's on 4 Bute a day? The horse must be in severe discomfort 😐

 

[eahotson]

My old retired mare lives an unrestricted grazing life, she gets fat in the summer and I've said categorically that if she gets laminitis she would be pts. She loathes muzzles, box rest or restriction of any kind nowadays and I don't see the point. She has the right to enjoy her time left. Having said that I will find it as hard as you are to make the final decision, but quality over quantity every time in my opinion. You have given him an amazing extra bit of life, be proud of that. If he's miserable restricted, I think I know what my decision would be.

I think that is a lovely attitude.Quality over quantity.

 

[Tiddlypom]

I think that is a lovely attitude.Quality over quantity.

Echo this, and something to think about for all of us with compromised horses. I may be needing to make 'that' decision for my grass sensitive PPID senior mare before long. It is getting harder to balance managing her with giving her a good retirement with plenty of turnout with the others.

Long term life in a small grassless lot for a retired horse is not IMHO a great option, no matter how well they are loved and cared for.