What do you expect from full livery?

[SillySally]

Our livery yard has said recently that they'll only poo pick every week or so now it's winter. To me this seems ridiculous and I'd expect every day, all through the year.

Does the definition of full livery vary so much from yard to yard in your experience? I don't think there should be too much in the way of legislation and rules, but surely it ought to mean much the same thing everywhere.

 

[IrishMilo]

I wouldn't expect poo picking to be done every day unless it was individual turnout on a relatively small bit of land.

 

[PeterNatt]

Poo Picking should be carried out every day to break up the worming cycle and preventing damage to the pasture.

 

[teddypops]

It will depend on your contract. I poo pick every day, but I have my own yard. Whoever is in charge will decide what happens and when.

 

[Auslander]

I don't poo pick in winter, as it's heavy clay and far too muddy to get a wheel barrow out there. My liveries are all aware of this from the outset, and they know that the fields will be harrowed and rolled in spring, and then poo-picked religiously throughout the summer. My woodchip pens are poo picked all year round, and any individual turnouts, but I'm not prepared to kill myself climbing around in the mud to do the big fields! My hay bill triples to around £1k a month in winter, so if everything is broken down in terms of financial value - the liveries are still getting their moneys worth!

 

[AmyMay]

Never been on a yard that poo picked, unless horses were turned out in small sections.

 

[ihatework]

In full livery I think land management is up to the landowner to decide.
Once a week may be perfectly acceptable if fields aren’t overstocked.
You as the client are obviously free to decide if the land management suits you or not and place your business appropriately.

Personally, weekly poopicking in winter wouldn’t bother me at all

 

[Waxwing]

On the yard where I keep my horse it depends on which field they are in; certain fields are poo picked daily and other larger fields are harrowed. The yard has plenty of grazing; the horses are always turned out in the same groups but regularly move to different fields depending on the condition of the ground and the needs of the individual horses. The majority live out all year round; but all have the own stables and can be in at night depending on their requirements.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

I don’t think there is a set way to manage poo on fields what matters is the overall state of the grazing as a result. Is what they do in method and/ or frequency keeping the fields in decent order or is it under layers of poo and full of sour inedible grass?

 

[Pippity]

My field is poo-picked daily on a rota basis. Even on full livery, I'm expected to take my turn. (I don't. I pay somebody else to do it.)

 

[MuddyMonster]

Not poo picking in winter is normal on the yards I've been on - in fact, two didn't poo pick a year round. Only one set up I've been on has poo picked over winter.

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

Our livery yard has said recently that they'll only poo pick every week or so now it's winter. To me this seems ridiculous and I'd expect every day, all through the year.

Does the definition of full livery vary so much from yard to yard in your experience? I don't think there should be too much in the way of legislation and rules, but surely it ought to mean much the same thing everywhere.

From full livery

I would expect mucking out every day
hay included
2 feeds
a good groom
feet picked
exercised at least 2 - 3 times
tack cleaned after riding
turned out each day either mixed or individual
held for the vet or farrier
caught in and turned out
and rugs changed.

Depends what is in your terms of contract - I poo pick daily on this yard 364 days a year. As mostly Christmas day the horses stay in and if anyone wants to turnout they have to poo pick themselves. I get complemented on how clean they are, get good results generally on worm counts.

If I was looking for full and wanted fields done, I would make sure the yard did this in their claws

 

[SillySally]

Thanks all. Seems to be a pretty wide variation from never/daily/DIY for the poo-picking at least!

 

[ycbm]

If fields are big enough horses tend to create toilet areas which they don't eat. Poo picking for worm control is only necessary for grazing areas which are"too small".
.

 

[MrsMozart]

Our big fields aren't poo picked - they're harrowed etc. The small paddocks are poo picked daily all year round if they're in them.

Ours are all full retirement livery and live out 24/7/365.

 

[Leandy]

If you are on full livery (on any description to be honest), land management is entirely up to the yard. I'm astonished that anyone on full livery is even bothering thinking about poo picking to be honest, unless the turnout is obviously disgusting! There is a complete obsession in the horsy community with poo picking. There are other routes to managing grassland to avoid a worm burden so it is not the be all and end all. Farmers don't poo pick cows or sheep! I think it is reasonable to poo pick less in winter. Given the mud and cold etc it becomes less necessary and less easy.

Full livery to me entails full care of the horse so that the owner does not need to do anything. I would generally expect this to include exercising several times a week as well as trimming. Some people would define it to include all care but not exercising but I would define that as part livery. There are so many variations though that it is always wise to check exactly what is and isn't included and what may be charged extra.

 

[Widgeon]

There is a complete obsession in the horsy community with poo picking.... Farmers don't poo pick cows or sheep!

I think the problem is that many (most?) of us have to keep our horses on areas of grazing land that are really far smaller than ideal. Farmers tend to keep cows and sheep on enormous fields. Most yards cannot afford the luxury of several acres per horse, particularly with the current cost of grazing land. Then on top of that, the grazing is often of the wrong kind, i.e. lush grass, so if you have a fatty they have to be restricted, which means a smaller area again. So I don't think you can blame people for being religious about cleaning their little patches of grazing.

 

[Leandy]

So I don't think you can blame people for being religious about cleaning their little patches of grazing.

Agree with what you say about keeping horses in little patches but that is more to do with individual turn out than lack of land very often. I don't think it is right to say farmers have acres per animal (although it may appear that way because they have a lot of space and not loads of tiny fields). The concerns around today's agriculture are of course its intensiveness and I think most people are surprised when they hear how many animals a farmer actually has very often. I was just pointing out that poo picking is not the only way to manage land. It is certainly not the optimal way from the perspective of labour intensiveness.

 

[Widgeon]

that is more to do with individual turn out than lack of land very often

Yes, that is very true, good point.

It is certainly not the optimal way from the perspective of labour intensiveness.

...and I couldn't agree more with that!

 

[ILuvCowparsely]

If you are on full livery (on any description to be honest), land management is entirely up to the yard. I'm astonished that anyone on full livery is even bothering thinking about poo picking to be honest, unless the turnout is obviously disgusting! There is a complete obsession in the horsy community with poo picking. .

Quite frankly I am amazed, people go fanatic on the horses bed and stable are clean puffed up looking pretty, yet they don't care what its grazing area/play area looks like. After all a lot of horses spend more time in the field than the stable.

I poo pick, as I don't like my fields looking awful and covered in poo, its not a big job and I feel if I bother to make the stables looking nice, I should put the effort and make the fields nice.

Each to their own - but I could never look out over my fields and see crap all over the fields. If I was on full livery, and judging on my worm counts, so many new horses that come in often have a med eggs seen. It would be something I would look for when searching for a yard.
As with cows pooping trying to pick up cow pats with a poop rake and fork would not be easy, I would not want to try pick up sheep poop as the pellets are too small, though we have found their poop in our hay before.

 

[Ali27]

I’ve had mine on full livery twice and had to poo pick myself as they didn’t poo pick any fields! I didn’t last long at either yard! Now got my own place and poo pick twice a day even using head torch when dark! I could never keep a horse on a yard which didn’t poo pick! Unless huge fields and Winter!

 

[SO1]

I was DIY grass livery with harrowed large fields and my pony got very ill with a tapeworm infestation. He ended up on 4 tapewormers a year to stop him getting infected. My vet referred him to a parasitologist as she could not understand why he kept getting infected.

I moved to a part livery yard where the fields are poo picked with poo Hoover quad and he is now on no tapewormers a year.

I think if you are going to harrow you need to regular worm counts and saliva tests to check the horses are not getting worms and you may need to worm more frequently to keep worms under control.

 

[spotty_pony]

How much are they out in the winter? Not necessary to do every day if they are only out for part of the day and in at night.

 

[ycbm]

I was DIY grass livery with harrowed large fields and my pony got very ill with a tapeworm infestation. He ended up on 4 tapewormers a year to stop him getting infected. My vet referred him to a parasitologist as she could not understand why he kept getting infected.

I moved to a part livery yard where the fields are poo picked with poo Hoover quad and he is now on no tapewormers a year.

I think if you are going to harrow you need to regular worm counts and saliva tests to check the horses are not getting worms and you may need to worm more frequently to keep worms under control.

If the fields are large they shouldn't be harrowed until the horses are taken off and then there should be a long period while the field is not used for horses and preferably used for sheep or cows.

I've kept horses in 10+acres for 30 years, usually 2, sometimes 3, occasionally 4 and once by accident 5 for a short time. I've never poo picked or harrowed. I worm with ivermectin and praziquantel once in summer and moxidectin once in winter and my worm counts are fine.

I have heard of some particular fields where dogs have been exercised having continual problems with tapeworm infection. A vet warned me about it, I've no idea if it's true.
..

 

[laura_nash]

I poo pick, as I don't like my fields looking awful and covered in poo, its not a big job and I feel if I bother to make the stables looking nice, I should put the effort and make the fields nice.

Each to their own - but I could never look out over my fields and see crap all over the fields.

I don't poo pick at all and my fields don't look awful or covered in poo.

The trick is to have enough grazing and to actively manage it, you can't just not poo pick. I rotate frequently, giving fields a good rest when needed. I harrow, top, lime etc (have my own kit). I have a small herd of cows for land management who graze down anything that is getting horse sick and go on after harrowing for worm control.

Poo picking is one solution but not the only one, and not one that's great for the land. I think it's become the norm due to all the DIY livery yards with small fields, where it's really the only workable option.

 

[ycbm]

The trick is to have enough grazing and to actively manage it, you can't just not poo pick

You can, I do. I don't "manage" my land at all, I call it benign neglect. It's a wonderful hill meadow of wild flowers and mixed grasses now, it was almost pure rye 30 years ago.

But as I said, I hugely understock the field. I also tend to have very hard frosts in winter and birds and driving rain which breaks down the piles.

The poo spots change over the years so they seem to do their own rotation.
.

 

[I don’t like mondays]

If it was individual turnout I’d expect poo picking regularly (because they tend to be smaller fields/pens and I wouldn’t want the poo to spoil the grass), if it was hers turnout then maybe not