What 'False Aids' DONT you agree with?

Those funny lunging things which are like pulleys... pessoa!! That's it. Not keen on these, was there a problem with normal lungeing that this had to be invented?
 
There's nothing that I don't particularily disagree with, as long as they're used correctly, and only as a last resort if schooling doesn't solve the problem..

I'm not a massive fan of flash bands, just because everyone seems to whack one on their horse even if they don't need it. I don't really see the point in draw reins unless used simply to save the rider's energy whilst building topline in the horse, but as long as they're used properly I don't have a problem with them.
 
I dont agree with any false aids at all, unless the person using them is completely able to use in the correct way. I have ridden for many years and if I find a horse too much for me, I dont go down the gadget road, I go to the source of the problem and work through it. My horses are ridden in a cavasson, snaffle and no martingale. In my day there were no gadgets apart from the odd martingale. That is not to say that gadgets dont have their place, just that not many are able to use them correctly. Myself included!!
 
The pessoa is amazing, dont knock it til you tried it - I certainly did and got my words ripped right out from underneath me after!!
 
Another school of thought would be that if you worked classically and didn't rush the horse you would not need "false aids".

The reason they exist is because the horse isn't doing what you want it to do so you conjure up a cheat.

(btw, I have used several "cheats/aids" over the years and have come to the conclusion that you just have to be patient and work through, cutting corners creates problems elsewhere)
 
flamehead said:
The pessoa is amazing, dont knock it til you tried it - I certainly did and got my words ripped right out from underneath me after!!
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Who said I haven't tried it?? Don't go assuming what you don't know.

Glad it works for you.
 
tallyho! said:
Another school of thought would be that if you worked classically and didn't rush the horse you would not need "false aids".

The reason they exist is because the horse isn't doing what you want it to do so you conjure up a cheat.

(btw, I have used several "cheats/aids" over the years and have come to the conclusion that you just have to be patient and work through, cutting corners creates problems elsewhere)
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Quite! Thought that Id be the only one!!
 
tallyho! said:
Another school of thought would be that if you worked classically and didn't rush the horse you would not need "false aids".

The reason they exist is because the horse isn't doing what you want it to do so you conjure up a cheat.

(btw, I have used several "cheats/aids" over the years and have come to the conclusion that you just have to be patient and work through, cutting corners creates problems elsewhere)
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totally agree!
 
I must admit I'm not a great fan of gadgets.

Especially draw reins. Yes, I appreciate they have a place and can be very useful in certain circumstances. But you see so many people who have become dependent on them, and I don't think they necessarily promote a correct outline. Sure, the horse has its nose on the vertical, but many aren't working through from behind over their back, they have just learned where to place their head.
 
I'm another who isn't keen on draw reins at all! I think they do nothing but put the horse in the worng place.

The problem we have as a nation is wanting to look pretty and good but not wanting to put the work in and this where all these fancy gadgets come in. Is it really so embarassing for your horse not to go perfectly and not look pretty? Heck if all our horses looked perfect there would be no need for this forum! :)
 
ahh, the aged debate over "false aids" versus correct training. I never knock any of the so called "false" aids because there have been times when I have needed to use something which would have totally inappropriate on another horse, so I no longer take the moral high ground about schooling through an issue. Sometimes, you do need to think outside of the box. I would never have used draw reins on my mare because it was patently obvious that her issues would never be helped with holding her in, I hack my gelding in them if we are going solo because his new party trick is spinning. I do use the pessoa as it gets the gelding to stretch over his back, it never worked on a previous boy because he just could not settle with the rope/pad behind his legs and he went better with little on the lunge.

So I take the standard approach of schooling with little over the basics, but am open to something that will help me with a particular challenge. Should point out however, then when I have tried something different like a pessoa, or a chambon, I have paid for a lesson to learn how to use them properly and what I am aiming for..
 
My opinions have changed over the years (as they do) but I think some 'gadgets' have their uses if used correctly.

There is something that confuses me though - I have watched some of the WEG dressage (and dressage in general) and I can't quite understand that if these horses are so well schooled and sensitive to aids then why is it they are ridden in double bridles ans the riders wear spurs?

Ok, the spurs I get - make the 'instructions' more precise but why double bridles? It just seems to contradict all that dressage professional harp on about -ie leg aids, balance etc. Can anyone explain why then they eed so much metal in their horse's mouths?? I for one don't get it especially when I have seen videos of people riding bareback with nothing more than a neckstrap having their horse perform dressage moves!
 
In my opinion to ride a horse in an ethical and correct way a rider should always aim for self carriage in their horses. This means not only is the horse moving in a rounded way, but it also has 'self' straightness, 'self' implusion, 'self' throughness, 'self' submission and so on! The horse therefore, is truely 'on the aids'. As such, gadgets are not needed because the horse does it him/herself. If training is consistent, clear and progressive the horse naturally achieves self carriage by themselves rendering gadgets useless. I would rather work on my self and my riding in order for the horse to achieve self carriage so as not to compromise the welfare of my horses. I'm still working on that one but getting there!
 
Agree with working on one's own carriage and balance to help a horse achieve self carriage. This used to be the norm in BHS but it's changed so much it's unrecognisable to me.

Another thing I hate is breastplates that are so tight they pull the saddle on to the shoulder. What's with the saddle too far forward fashion at the shows these days?
 
Dont know about aids as such but I hate nosebands like flashes, grakles etc. - anything which tries to strap the horses mouth shut IMO isn't a nice thing and its covering up another problem! Dislike martingales with avengence as well, I think horses just fight against them even more. Also despise 3 ring gags - especially on kids ponies who clearly don't need them...
 
QUOTE:- "I think they can be useful as long as they are used correctly"

Everyone normally replies like this to these threads........................does anyone ever confess to using them incorrectly? ;)
 
pastie2 said:
I dont agree with any false aids at all, unless the person using them is completely able to use in the correct way. I have ridden for many years and if I find a horse too much for me, I dont go down the gadget road, I go to the source of the problem and work through it. My horses are ridden in a cavasson, snaffle and no martingale. In my day there were no gadgets apart from the odd martingale. That is not to say that gadgets dont have their place, just that not many are able to use them correctly. Myself included!!
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Agree with this totally! I tried for years with my TB with various gadgets - ended up with a reversing horse too scared to go forwards......I started lessons with a classical instructor and I now have a happy, forward going cooperative horse which is up and in front of me rather than digging for Australia.....
 
tallyho! said:
Another school of thought would be that if you worked classically and didn't rush the horse you would not need "false aids".

The reason they exist is because the horse isn't doing what you want it to do so you conjure up a cheat.

(btw, I have used several "cheats/aids" over the years and have come to the conclusion that you just have to be patient and work through, cutting corners creates problems elsewhere)
Click to expand...

My exact thoughts....take a bit more time over trying to achieve the result and you end up with a happier horse.....
 
pastie2 said:
I dont agree with any false aids at all, unless the person using them is completely able to use in the correct way. I have ridden for many years and if I find a horse too much for me, I dont go down the gadget road, I go to the source of the problem and work through it. My horses are ridden in a cavasson, snaffle and no martingale. In my day there were no gadgets apart from the odd martingale. That is not to say that gadgets dont have their place, just that not many are able to use them correctly. Myself included!!
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Completely agree. False aids are just quick fixes which usually make matters worse (for the horse!). People should stop being so lazy and learn to ride and school properly! The trouble with this country is that people think that they can ride just because they can stay on and jump a few fences! Everthing that goes wrong is always the horses fault. Not so I'm afraid!
 
Disagree with Draw Reins being used when jumping and draw reins being used without reins, yes seen both and had to bite my tongue in both situations. The second, draw reins used one there own, creates Rollkur, so for any one who wants to see what Rollkur does to your horse, try this. :mad:

Those bungie things are horrid but again I have seen them used all wrong, attached to the girth and there just too close to the legs. they are supposed to be attached to the saddle, but again I dont like them.

I think draw reins used correctly are good, but again only on the right horse and only as a training aid in the school on the flat.
 
I particularly dislike anything that puts undue pressure on the horses mouth tbh. I can't imagine the pain some horses have to endure with badly used draw reins etc. especially being hauled on by a strong muscley bloke or woman! Then, if the horse has the audacity to spoil the 'effect'/ 'how it looks' by trying to relieve the discomfort/pain by opening it's mouth, slap a tight noseband on so he 'looks' right! Grrrrr.
 
I have used draw reins in the past, but as a short term thing to help with control, not to attempt to make my horse tuck his nose in.

Are chambons a gadget? I use one of those, and like it - it seems to work and he seems happy in it.

I don't get breastplates either, get a saddle that fits! Don't understand how it can be nice for the horse to have something dragging back on their shoulders all the time? And baggy ones? Whats the point! :D
 
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