What is the longest time an abscess takes to burst?

[MDB]

Hi everyone.

I am sick with worry and feel pretty helpless at the moment.

My mare appeared badly lame about a week ago. The vet came Friday, nerve blocked low down at the heel and she went sound. She has a raised pulse, no heat, no swelling, no tenderness at all. No reaction to hoof testers. Vet thought abscess but was concerned it wouldn't burst as they said hat her hooves are the toughest hardest they have seen. She is barefoot if that makes a difference.

So the nerve block wore off and she is back to hopping lame. She is worse after she rests, then she is crippled when she starts moving. She is hopping on her toe and struggles to put the heel down. If she stands and dozes the heel will eventually go down and she weight bears fairly well. Once she is moving it gets a bit better although, minimally better. She is better going downhill. Uphill is awful, I guess cos there is more stretch on the heel going uphill.

We were supposed to have x rays today. I don't know what happened. The vet came and tried hoof testers again, but wants a colleague to come tomorrow and retry to get some response and then x ray. So my mare has to wait another day crippled.

I have soaked, poultice, done Cleantrax soaks, massaged, done passive movements, prayed! My question is this. If this were an abcess, then wouldn't it has burst by now? Or at least be a change in symptoms as the abscess tracked or worsened? I just dont know how she can still be crippled aa week on with no sign of things changing one way or another.

Does anybody have any experiences? This is the same mare that appeared hopping lame on the other front leg 3 months ago. Vet thought abscess. Nothing appeared and the lameness spontaneously resolved. Could it be a musculoskeletal issue in both fronts, and ovrcompensation after the last lameness episode has flared up an issue in the other leg?

I know that nobody can diagnose over tintrnet. Just looking for any similar experiences.

 

[atropa]

Hi,

Sorry I can't be much help other than to say that a few years ago my gelding went through a horrific time during the summer with abscess after abscess, first in one front foot, then the other, then back to the original one. It took probably about 6 weeks for them all to burst and drain (through foot AND coronet band) and about 4 months later the farrier sloughed off a massive chunk of hoof - the abscess had made a huge cavity in the wall.

Has the vet not suggested having a farrier out to possibly pare away some of the hoof and see if they can find a track?

I'd also always be wary of possible navicular changes with heel pain, but that's down to my own personal experience.

 

[Annagain]

Sorry no advice as, despite 30 years experience, I've not really dealt with an abcess (just one that burst out spontaneously without my horse being lame before!) but just wanted to say I hope she's better soon. They do like to worry us, don't they.

 

[ihatework]

You get the odd tricky one that can take forever to burst, if it is not helped on its way.
A week on and hopping lame needs intervention. X-ray pronto.

 

[HufflyPuffly]

Skylla took 3 weeks though she was intermittently lame, we think it was a bruise which then brewed into an abscess, hope she's better soon.

 

[ycbm]

Is she on bute or antibiotics? If not, I would have expected it to have come out of the heel bulb by now and I would be demanding an x ray in case there is something else going on like a broken navicular bone or a foreign body. Sorry to scare you but I can't see why your vet did not x ray today. Did they even bring the kit or had it been diverted somewhere else? If the latter, I wouldn't be paying today's bill and I'd be querying it anyway. What did this visit add, exactly? You could have told them yourself that nothing had changed.

 

[MDB]

You get the odd tricky one that can take forever to burst, if it is not helped on its way.
A week on and hopping lame needs intervention. X-ray pronto.

I know. We discussed an x ray on Saturday via whastapp and was all ready for one today. They said they wanted another vet to try hoof testers first tomorrow. Whatever happens tomorrow, we are doing an x ray. She is crippled. If this goes on much longer there is no way the rest of her limbs are going to hold up. I have posted a video on the Barefoot Horse Owners UK page if anyon3 wants to look. But this is not her at her worst.
https://www.facebook.com/groups/138...960823&notif_t=like&notif_id=1501352835499990

 

[MDB]

Is she on bute or antibiotics? If not, I would have expected it to have come out of the heel bulb by now and I would be demanding an x ray in case there is something else going on like a broken navicular bone or a foreign body. Sorry to scare you but I can't see why your vet did not x ray today. Did they even bring the kit or had it been diverted somewhere else? If the latter, I wouldn't be paying today's bill and I'd be querying it anyway. What did this visit add, exactly? You could have told them yourself that nothing had changed.

We have discuss payment and they said I will not pay for this vet visit. It was the same exam as Friday. Plus I have sent videos ovr the weekend. So there was nothing new. I expect they were busy.

She was on Bute and antibiotics, but I actually stopped them myself because it makes no sense to be on them for a suspected abscess. To be honest she really isn't much different off the them. Possibly slightly worse.

 

[ycbm]

Cross posted

 

[ycbm]

We have discuss payment and they said I will not pay for this vet visit. It was the same exam as Friday. Plus I have sent videos ovr the weekend. So there was nothing new. I expect they were busy.

She was on Bute and antibiotics, but I actually stopped them myself because it makes no sense to be on them for a suspected abscess. To be honest she really isn't much different off the them. Possibly slightly worse.

I afraid the use of bute and antibiotics explains a week's delay completely. You'll need to wait, if it is an abscess, for it to completely defeat the drugs and eat its way out. I wish vets wouldn't treat things that they have no diagnosis for when the most obvious suspect is an abscess in the foot.

 

[wingedhorse]

Nearly three months. Repeated x-rays didn't show it (despite being sent for second opinion). Lots of vet and farrier visits.

Eventually came out of coronet band, heel, and sole. Absolute nightmare. Vets didn't think it was an abscess as no heat / pulse / leg filling / nothing showed on x-ray. Bad bruising as initially suspected, once fracture ruled out. Horse was mostly dead lame with the odd sound in walk period.

Took about another 3-6 months for the internal structures of foot to recover from all the pus tracks.

Opposite foot was flatter for next few months from compensatory load.

 

[rara007]

About 3 weeks personally- came out the bulb of heel.

 

[L&M]

I would be getting your farrier/bare foot trimmer out asap. I only use a vet for foot problems if I can't get my farrier......my farrier has always resolved abscesses/foot problems far quicker than any vet.

Sending healing vibes x

 

[paddi22]

i had one lame for weeks, and then the abcess burst and he was still lame. Went in for xrays and he had a gas pocket pressing on his pedal bone. What does your farrier thing, good farriers usually have a gut instinct about things!

 

[MDB]

So my farrier just arrived. I sent him a message at the weekend and he was in the area so popped by.
He doesn't think it an abcess. He thinks it looks more musculoskeletal.
So my next question is... if an xray doesnt show up anything catastrophic.... how long is it ok to let a horse struggle around a paddock for virtually on three legs without signs of improvement?

 

[honetpot]

I am surprised that they have started antibiotics.
I have had a couple of different horses have them treated by different vets and the standard treatment is to hold off antibiotics until you can get them to drain, either by paring, poulticing, or the abscess bursting onto the surface. If you give antibiotic the abscess can get 'walled off' and form a pocket of infection which the blood supply can not reach and makes it harder to treat.
You also get this in human medicine,http://medical-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/antibioma

 

[Wagtail]

So my farrier just arrived. I sent him a message at the weekend and he was in the area so popped by.
He doesn't think it an abcess. He thinks it looks more musculoskeletal.
So my next question is... if an xray doesnt show up anything catastrophic.... how long is it ok to let a horse struggle around a paddock for virtually on three legs without signs of improvement?

I would be putting her on box rest on a deep bed. If it's not an abscess then I would give bute and xray asap. How stressful for you, OP.

 

[MDB]

I would be putting her on box rest on a deep bed. If it's not an abscess then I would give bute and xray asap. How stressful for you, OP.

this is the dilemma I have. vet i feel wants it to be an abscess. farrier says no. my gut says no. but even with xrays it may not give us a diagnosis. so do we restart bute. or hold off incase of abscess. box rest. or encourage movement. i feel we are just fumbling about blindly. i guess we need to take one day at a time. so annoying that they didnt xray today when they knew over the weekend that she was bad.

 

[stormox]

Antibiotics are not recommended for hoof abscesses. Has the vet/farrier not tried opening a hole in the sole of the foot to see if he can drain it?

 

[AnShanDan]

I have had a horse very lame with an abscess for weeks. She is an older retired horse, no shoes, initially very lame (hobbling) in a back foot, got vet out and didn't think it was an abscess, neither did 3 different farriers. Gave bute and said to keep her moving, thought maybe a flare up of arthritis in her fetlock, but no real symptoms except the lameness. It got a bit better over a week or so and came and went for about another 2 weeks, sometimes looking OK, sometimes looking pretty sore. I was at my wits end with her and was literally just about to phone the vet again to start proper diagnostics, I went into her stable to look (for the millionth time) at her leg/foot, and much black gunk was coming out of her heel. The whole hoof was deformed for months afterwards too.

 

[MDB]

Antibiotics are not recommended for hoof abscesses. Has the vet/farrier not tried opening a hole in the sole of the foot to see if he can drain it?

the farrier doesnt think it is an abscess, he thinks it is musculoskeletal. the vet thinks it may be an abscess but there is no tenderness anywhere, and hasnt ruled out an other cause.. and i am not sure i want them opening a hole in the sole just because it may be an abscess.

 

[MDB]

I guess i just feel frustrated that i have had no instructions on how to manage my horse who is clearly in pain. I have been left over the weeken until now with no directions on whether to rest her or keep her moving, soak the hoof or not, pad it up with boots or leave her, address any dietary issues. There has just been no instructions other than Bute and antibiotics which I decided to stop because it makes no sense if it an abscess. I guess i will see how things go tomorrow and insist they x ray.

 

[Cecile]

This may not be feasible but is at all possible that your farrier could be present with your vet tomorrow
so that they can discuss things together with you present, otherwise I have a feeling you will just be trying to relay what your farriers thoughts were
I can almost feel your distress and frustration with all this, which is totally understandable
If its not possible for the farrier to be present would your vet just phone your farrier to get his thoughts on it all
Good Luck tomorrow and I hope you have some answers shortly

 

[ycbm]

the farrier doesnt think it is an abscess, he thinks it is musculoskeletal. the vet thinks it may be an abscess but there is no tenderness anywhere, and hasnt ruled out an other cause.. and i am not sure i want them opening a hole in the sole just because it may be an abscess.

Almost non weight bearing is a heck of a musculoskeletal problem. Has she been put through a scintigraph? If you are insured, I would.

 

[Slightlyconfused]

I had one take six weeks to burst, by week three we had to xray and it was so deep the vet dug as much as she could then it was just a case of hot poultice that hole twice a day and one day he was sound and I had a lump of pus the size of a 5p on the poultice

 

[MDB]

Almost non weight bearing is a heck of a musculoskeletal problem. Has she been put through a scintigraph? If you are insured, I would.

No, she hasnt, and i dont even know what that is ycbm. I will look it up. She is not insured. We bought her for 600 euros and we know that she is stiff and arthritic. We bought her because she was a confidence giver for my beginner husband, and hoped that we would get maybe 5 years of gentle hacking out of her then she could spend the rest of her days in the field mooching around.

 

[MDB]

I had one take six weeks to burst, by week three we had to xray and it was so deep the vet dug as much as she could then it was just a case of hot poultice that hole twice a day and one day he was sound and I had a lump of pus the size of a 5p on the poultice

Was he very badly lame slightlyconfused? And was the lameness the same for 6 weeks?

 

[MagicMelon]

I had one who had an absess for 3 months. She wasn't crippled with it though like usual absesses, it just simmered away quietly making her a bit lame. Vet had advised bute at the beginning which I did, I believe that dragged it on. It just wouldn't come out fully, two tiny holes appeared (one on her coronet band and another I think on her heel) which I poulticed like mad but hers finally ended up being cut out by the trimmer - she had to cut away a whole edge of her hoof to finally release all of it. That was a nightmare! If I were you I'd just continue poulticing the whole foot (including coronet band and heel where sometimes they come out), not much else you can do. If she's that lame then Id expect the pressure will be released very soon on its own. One of mine used to get absesses 3 times a year without fail, his would last 3 or 4 days in total from being very lame to pretty much sound.

 

[Fun Times]

It's difficult OP because how you would treat an abscess (no Bute, no antibiotics and kept moving) is the direct opposite of how you would want to treat most skeletal issues. Has the vet dug around and found any sign of abscess? If.it were my horse I would want an x-ray pronto and if that didn't show a very obvious abscess/gas pocket I would want an MRI of the foot. Please be aware that pedal bone fractures do not always show up on x-ray and require MRI. I am not trying to panic you, just give you info.

 

[ycbm]

No, she hasnt, and i dont even know what that is ycbm. I will look it up. She is not insured. We bought her for 600 euros and we know that she is stiff and arthritic. We bought her because she was a confidence giver for my beginner husband, and hoped that we would get maybe 5 years of gentle hacking out of her then she could spend the rest of her days in the field mooching around.

Sorry, most people call it a 'bone scan' but I find that a very inaccurate description. It shows up active areas of bone remodelling by making the horse radioactive and then taking a scan of it that shows where the radioactivity is being taken up most. It's well over £1000 so I guess that would rule it out.

I hope you find something very clear on the x ray tomorrow.