Tiarella
Well-Known Member
The strongest bit ever made? Just curious
What is the strongest bit?
- Thread starter Tiarella
- Start date
emma69
Well-Known Member
I would guess a barbed wire bit off the top of my head.
However, different horses have different ideas on what is strong - some horses would like, say, a Waterford, but absolutely hate a straight bar for example.
However, different horses have different ideas on what is strong - some horses would like, say, a Waterford, but absolutely hate a straight bar for example.
jcberry
Well-Known Member
totally depends on the horse
but yea a barbed wire one would be pretty destructive
but yea a barbed wire one would be pretty destructive
Tiarella
Well-Known Member
On Oliver
jcberry
Well-Known Member
try a diff noseband/standing martingale? what about a hackamore?
Tiarella
Well-Known Member
I wasss thinking of trying a grackle. Are hackamores good?
only_me
Well-Known Member
just cos someone has to say it, a bit is only as strong as the riders hands
china
Well-Known Member
i have seen a chain with snaffle rings on the outside it looks like an eggbutt snaffle but the mouthpieces looks like a single link curb chain. not nice
china
Well-Known Member
emma69
Well-Known Member
It depends how the horse is evading. A grackle will stop them opening their mouth and crossing their jaw. If your horse doesn't do that, then a grackle won't help any. Hackamores have their uses, using pressure on different points depending on the type, but it isn't something I would turn to for brakes.
What have you tried?
What have you tried?
Tiarella
Well-Known Member
Well, I havent actually tried a lot yet. Just a gag on both rings. Both do nothing. It is very hard to explain what he is like. This is a video going over a jump, best to watch the bit after aswell as this shows what he does when im wanting to slow him down...
I believe I have quite good hands, this is him in a loose ring snaffle, and I end up having to give him a good yank in his mouth or else we will be going round forever and ever. He is actually a lot stronger and faster at the start. This video was about after an hour riding
This is quite a good video at the start to show what he is like normally when asked to do pretty much anything...
I believe I have quite good hands, this is him in a loose ring snaffle, and I end up having to give him a good yank in his mouth or else we will be going round forever and ever. He is actually a lot stronger and faster at the start. This video was about after an hour riding
This is quite a good video at the start to show what he is like normally when asked to do pretty much anything...
katie_and_toto
Well-Known Member
Marge
Member
Don't worry about which bit - just try some schooling?
Tiarella
Well-Known Member
[ QUOTE ]
Don't worry about which bit - just try some schooling?
[/ QUOTE ]
Do you want to come and school him
Don't worry about which bit - just try some schooling?
[/ QUOTE ]
Do you want to come and school him
NiceChristmasBaubles
Well-Known Member
Rather than trying to beat him with stronger and stronger bits which he may just fight more against, have you tried circling him away every time he starts to go a fraction faster? Is he like this even just doing flat work? It may take a few weeks of consistent schooling, but may work. When my mare used to go crazy I would just circle to the left then the right, ride lots of serpentines etc just to get her mind focussed on going where I wanted her to.
He's a nice horse though so would be worth investing the time getting it right!
Hope that helps.
He's a nice horse though so would be worth investing the time getting it right!
Hope that helps.
Tiarella
Well-Known Member
Thanks nikicb
Im not joking when I say this, but I have tried absolutely EVERYTHING! Changing bit to something else is my very last resort. Ive been schooling him for months & months & months in a snaffle. Absolutely nothing. No amount of schooling will change him if im perfectly honest. He is just a strong and fast horse.
NiceChristmasBaubles
Well-Known Member
It's really hard not being able to actually see him, but if he was mine this is what I would do (remember this is only my opinion so feel free to ignore me!).
I would take it back to basics. Forget the jumping for a bit, he needs to learn that you are the boss and has to go when you say and stop when you say (believe me I am always saying this to my son when he is charging round the school on his pony!).
If you need to wear him out a bit before you start you may want to lunge him to get the fizz out.
Then start by doing loads and loads of walk to trot, trot to walk, trot to halt, halt to trot transitions. If he starts to get strong ride a 10 - 15 m circle until he slows and start again, even if you have to yank him round a little bit (not really nastily but just to say look you're going to do what I say!). Even if it takes you an hour and all you achieve are a few transitions that are ok you will have progressed. Keep schooling as many days a week as you can until he can do this without being naughty and remember to praise him when he goes steadily. Then and only then start incorporating some canter work. He may try to rebel, bang your leg against the side of the school like my son's pony used to, stop dead in his tracks like a mare I used to school or something else, but you need to work through it! Hope this helps, as I say, only my opinion, but it's worked for me for several horses.
Good luck!
I would take it back to basics. Forget the jumping for a bit, he needs to learn that you are the boss and has to go when you say and stop when you say (believe me I am always saying this to my son when he is charging round the school on his pony!).
If you need to wear him out a bit before you start you may want to lunge him to get the fizz out.
Then start by doing loads and loads of walk to trot, trot to walk, trot to halt, halt to trot transitions. If he starts to get strong ride a 10 - 15 m circle until he slows and start again, even if you have to yank him round a little bit (not really nastily but just to say look you're going to do what I say!). Even if it takes you an hour and all you achieve are a few transitions that are ok you will have progressed. Keep schooling as many days a week as you can until he can do this without being naughty and remember to praise him when he goes steadily. Then and only then start incorporating some canter work. He may try to rebel, bang your leg against the side of the school like my son's pony used to, stop dead in his tracks like a mare I used to school or something else, but you need to work through it! Hope this helps, as I say, only my opinion, but it's worked for me for several horses.
Good luck!
NiceChristmasBaubles
Well-Known Member
Sorry last thing from me before I shut up, have you had his back checked, only I had a horse for a while that charged off every time his work was getting too much for him and we found he had a slight back injury from before I bought him - may be worth getting it checked.
Niki.
Niki.
Paint it Lucky
Well-Known Member
My coloured horse was like this, I did lots of schoolong to help but jumping was still highly exciting! I found a tom thumb is a very usefull bit, it is a precise bit, my horse ignores/runs through pelhams, dutch gags etc but this he listens to.
I have one like this but mine also has smooth copper ridges on the mouthpiece to make it a bit more effective. My horse normally needs a flash but doesn't with this bit as he respects and listens to it. I think he is more comfortable in it as he has quite a big tongue so as this bit is quite narrow he isn't trying to open his mouth and evade it all the time (as he doe with some strong bits). I can even hold him in it out hunting which is a miracle!
http://www.thesaddleryshop.co.uk/P/Sweet_Iron_Copper_Tom_Thumb_tom_thumb_bit-(781).aspx
I have one like this but mine also has smooth copper ridges on the mouthpiece to make it a bit more effective. My horse normally needs a flash but doesn't with this bit as he respects and listens to it. I think he is more comfortable in it as he has quite a big tongue so as this bit is quite narrow he isn't trying to open his mouth and evade it all the time (as he doe with some strong bits). I can even hold him in it out hunting which is a miracle!
http://www.thesaddleryshop.co.uk/P/Sweet_Iron_Copper_Tom_Thumb_tom_thumb_bit-(781).aspx
CrazyMare
Well-Known Member
My mare used to bolt and disspear before/after fences/periodically on the flat.
Try to NOT pull him up, try riding him forwards through it.
Don't try and bit him up yet, and I'd be tempted to take the flash off and loosen the cavasson - mine goes in a very very loose cavasson.
With regards to jumping, go back to poles, walk over the poles, building up to halting before and after, then trotting over the pole - approach in walk then gentley nudge him up to trot - trot the poles then back to walk.
On the flat, do a transition at every marker - between paces and within each pace, gradually extending the time spent in each pace. Try to do the downwards transitions from sitting deep and tall, breathing out and relaxing into him rahter than pulling against him.
Good luck!
Try to NOT pull him up, try riding him forwards through it.
Don't try and bit him up yet, and I'd be tempted to take the flash off and loosen the cavasson - mine goes in a very very loose cavasson.
With regards to jumping, go back to poles, walk over the poles, building up to halting before and after, then trotting over the pole - approach in walk then gentley nudge him up to trot - trot the poles then back to walk.
On the flat, do a transition at every marker - between paces and within each pace, gradually extending the time spent in each pace. Try to do the downwards transitions from sitting deep and tall, breathing out and relaxing into him rahter than pulling against him.
Good luck!
JM07
Well-Known Member
it depends on the tosser on the buckle end TBH.
JoJo_
Well-Known Member
I was thinking of changing my mare's bit but my coach changed my mind by saying most horses will just learn how to be strong in a stronger bit too. The problem will just get worse if you end up struggling in a pelham. Using your seat really does slow horses down you just gotta learn how to and stick at it. You shouldnt have to pull and yank on the bit to stop a horse.
My jump instructor did a good exercise with me just using poles on the floor to start with. Had to stop my mare after one pole and before I got to the other. Then built it up to a crosspole then stop before the pole on floor - never stopping before a jump as that teaches them to stop. But by the end of the lesson I was jumping a double and stopping within 5 strides after. My mare had a habit of running on too much after the last jump but shes much better now.
My jump instructor did a good exercise with me just using poles on the floor to start with. Had to stop my mare after one pole and before I got to the other. Then built it up to a crosspole then stop before the pole on floor - never stopping before a jump as that teaches them to stop. But by the end of the lesson I was jumping a double and stopping within 5 strides after. My mare had a habit of running on too much after the last jump but shes much better now.
Marge
Member
As I said, and the same as most of other replies kindly given but mine not sweety-wrapped, schooling - by you, or someone who is capable of it.
JoJo_
Well-Known Member
Sorry just to add cuz I watched the videos now. It looked to me like you are just pulling to fight him and we all know on a battle of strength we are going to lose. I think he needs lots of schooling on the flat to work on the downwards transitions so that you dont need to pull before you can help your jumping. Do you have an instructor to help you at all? Might be worth finding one to give you some good advise. It is great to have someone watching from the ground who can say things that you need to correct as your riding that you may forget if it isnt pointed out.
martlin
Well-Known Member
QR
I would ditch the martingale and if you really need something to protect your face - put a standing one on. The running martingale breaks the line of the rein coming from the bit to your hand and when he decides to f*ck off with you, you have no tools for an emergency stop.
Stick with a snaffle, or a snaffle with hooks and SIT into him, don't drop the leg off - you need the leg as much to stop as you do to move forwards.
It is often a vicious circle, especially with jumping - you know he speeds away, you try to approach slowly, it becomes to slow/not enough impulsion, he panics and speeds away.
Try not to pull on both reins, always try to bend and relax rather than stop and keep going.
The two things he can't do at the same time is to go fast and bend the neck, so your goal for now is to release the neck and get it bendy, then you'll be able to circle and slow down much better. To start with, you can drop the outside rein and bend his head all the way to your leg.
All that is assuming there is no physical problems with the beast, ie the back in particular is fine.
I would ditch the martingale and if you really need something to protect your face - put a standing one on. The running martingale breaks the line of the rein coming from the bit to your hand and when he decides to f*ck off with you, you have no tools for an emergency stop.
Stick with a snaffle, or a snaffle with hooks and SIT into him, don't drop the leg off - you need the leg as much to stop as you do to move forwards.
It is often a vicious circle, especially with jumping - you know he speeds away, you try to approach slowly, it becomes to slow/not enough impulsion, he panics and speeds away.
Try not to pull on both reins, always try to bend and relax rather than stop and keep going.
The two things he can't do at the same time is to go fast and bend the neck, so your goal for now is to release the neck and get it bendy, then you'll be able to circle and slow down much better. To start with, you can drop the outside rein and bend his head all the way to your leg.
All that is assuming there is no physical problems with the beast, ie the back in particular is fine.
jumpthemoon
Well-Known Member
If you've not had his back/teeth checked then I would get them checked. Then I'd get a good instructor to help you sort out his flatwork - I definitely wouldn't go for a stronger bit while he is going like that as you'll end up making things worse imo.
Zambo
Member
If you wanted to change bits i would possibly only try a hanging cheek snaffle as this may help to bring in his head a little by having poll pressure, I also agree with the standing martingale idea, some horses don't like the running martingale, giving a second pressure on the rein so fight more.
What does your instructor say?
I would also check back saddle and teeth if you haven't already done so??
Good luck let us know how you get on?
What does your instructor say?
I would also check back saddle and teeth if you haven't already done so??
Good luck let us know how you get on?