What qualifications do you need to judge unaffiliated dressage?

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ChunkyMonkey25

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As title really - went to an unaffiliated competition yesterday and the judging was very very poor. I took a young girl with me who has never done dressage before and entered the walk and trot class and the bottom of her sheet had a comment of "horse and rider combination will not succeed in this sport until more work has been done"!

My sheet read "horse has problems - you shouldn't be riding him". Now I know my horse can be stiff (he's 15) but he is certainly not lame. If anything I am massively overprotective of him.

This particular judge is not on the BD list of judges so just wondering what qualifications you need? I am a fan of dressage and trying to attract new people to the sport but judges like this are going to ruin all chances of that
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You don't need any qualifications to judge unafilliated dressage.

Sounds like you had a very unsympathetic judge. Luckilly round here most venues use BD judges or trainees for unafilliated but as you've found not all do.

I would have a quiet word with the organisers and voice your concerns. Perhaps if you could go with a list of suitable judges if they are novices at running comps, that may be seen as constructive rather than sour grapes.
Even if there are major problems with a combination that you're judging there are better ways of putting things than those quoted. Judges like these could put people off from ever trying again!
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OMG those comments are horrible! I would have cried!! Definately speak to the organizers, would be a shame if this goes on
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You don't need any... and you can judge at BE intro and PN if you've ridden at Adv. level yourself.. ie there arn't enough BD listed judges to go round i guess.
Meaning if i do an Adv. next year, i'd be qualified to judge BE PN dressage, which i don't think i'd be good enough to do!!!
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I am sorry you had such a bad time. I have written quite a few times at unaffiliated competitions and I have been horrified by the judges I have been sitting with. Some of them have ended up asking me - the writer, what I think the mark should be. I have also had judges asking for the sheets back because they want to alter the marks to make sure someone doesn't end up winning.

I enter affiliated competitions because I hope I get better standards of judging.
 
That isnt very constructive. In fact is positively destructive!

FGS it was a walk and trot test. Meant for people or horses just starting out.

If the judge thought your horse was lame or whatever she should have spoken to you.

Not many judges are that negative though. Even when there is little good to say a judge will normally, at the lower levels, try to find something positive. Everyone has to start somewhere. Shame you had a bad experience. Dont let it stop you though.

I have seen bad judging in both affiliated and unaffiliated.
But most of the judging has been good in both.
 
I judge unaff but have no formal quals other than having rideen to medium level - I would NEVER write something like that on a score sheet - you are there to encourage not put someone off for life - helpful pointers may be taken wrongly but IMO those comments are not pointers
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You say about BD judges - a loval BD judge to me (only lower level BD qualified) wrote on a friends test sheet "this horse is useless for this sport and should either be destroyed or retired"
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I hasten to add not all BD judges are horrid either!
 
I've done it too (Prelim and Novice) and to make it worse the writer on one occasion was a Listed judge (but she had too many pupils competing in the competition so they didn't think it was fair that she judged). I didn't really enjoy it - found it easy to see what was wrong but less easy to put it into words and frame it positively. The marks for each movement were generally correct I think but the comments were definitely too nice and probably not helpful enough eg. of the 'good partnership, try to be a bit more accurate' or 'well tried' variety.
 
I judge unaffiliated and spend an awful amount of time on my education in this respect, sitting in, writing, practice judging. As one person has commented the collective comments really are the hardest to master.

There are a few awfully tactless judges out there, who just dont seem to care about the sport, at both affiliated and unaffiliated levels.

I am sure that by the end of the day you mention someone would have mentioned the conduct of this judge and hopefully the organiser will decline to invite them again.
 
I have recently started judging unaffiliated, on the recommendation of my FBHS trainer, she said I would be good at it because I explain things in a clear way. I have spent many years writing for BD and unaffiliated competitions. I only judge at Prelim, and quite often total beginners, I have recieved good feedback that I judge people as what they are (why give a beginner in P1 low marks and discourage them) and always comment in a positive way. I also take a fair time to make sure I think through the comments I put on the collectives. At our local venue the sheets are collected after every other horse, so there is no 'fixing' of scores and I always look at the results at the end and they are pretty spot on!
I once got a comment in a BE Novice test; above bit and hollow, and the judge ditto'd right the way down the sheet
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(admittely it was right, but how rude not find something good to say!)
 
Ditto the above comments about not needing qualifications.
I have judged quite a bit of unaffiliated dressage upto elementary and have never had any training but i am the sort of person who will make sure i know what im doing before i go and do it!
It sounds like your judge was on a bit of a power trip and not interested in helping people improve and enjoy the sport, completely wrong IMHO.
I enjoy doing it because its great when you see people getting their sheets and reading all the comments, i try to comment on most movements and spend ages doing the collectives. The best bit is when you get asked to go back to a venue and people have improved or they tell you they have their first affiliated competition coming up.
 
I did unaff dressage yesterday and was also a bit cross with the marking. In the walk and trot test I was on an obviously very green horse and dont feel the comments displayed that she recognised that fact.
My friend was doing her first ever dressage test and did a really good job to keep it together but scored 46%. Thats not right for that level
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thanks for all of your comments. I have written an email to the organiser. It's not sour grapes as I don't care what my horse gets, we do it for fun. I usually use these things as a training exercise so I can get other peoples opinion on what I need to work on but after reading this judges comments I felt like I shouldn't carry on! She gave one young girl 26% in her walk and trot! She should see that a young girl on a pony who did all the required movements deserves more than that!
 
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26%
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That's out of order.........I can't believe that anyone can deserve that, esp in an unaf. walk and trot test.
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BTW, I wasn't insinuating it was sour grapes on your behalf at all, just that the organisers might take it that way as you're complaining about the judge, with VERY good reason of course!
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Hopefully others too have voiced their concerns.

To just use it as a training exercise, ie to practise the tests is fine if you're confident to know that what the judge says is unhelpful rubbish and can have a giggle at the sheet before putting it in the bin. I can only imagine what some poor people must have felt though, on getting their marks and sheets.
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26%!!!!WTF! I think you are right to email the organiser.

Wonder what her comments were on the 26% test!
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Dont suppose that poor girl will try dressage again. What a shame. The judge should be shot.
 
I've had some pretty terrible remarks made on my sheets (some valid but not all)
and of course quite often not agreed with the scores ( low ones as well as some inflated ones)
these comments should encourage not discourage someone and at the very least be constructive.
recently heard some one had received a 'lost the plot' how does that encourage any one.
on the flip side to this its wonderful to have a good comment for something you've been working on is it?

definately complain it does work show organisers do listen.
 
[ QUOTE ]
She gave one young girl 26% in her walk and trot! She should see that a young girl on a pony who did all the required movements deserves more than that!

[/ QUOTE ]

Giving a young child 26% in a walk and trot test is appalling!!!! If you actually look at the wording for the number mark you will see that

0 - Not performed
1 - Very bad
2 - Bad
3 - Fairly bad
4 - Insufficient
5 - Sufficient
6 - Satisfactory
7 - Fairly good
8 - Good
9 - Very good
10 - Excellent

I do not know what test the rider did, or what mistakes were made, which could have taken marks way from her actual score, but if you look at the wording 26% would suggest that the test was ridden lower than fairly badly the whole way round. In a walk and trot test, if a horse or pony is walking or trotting in the correct direction from marker to marker, following a sensible line (regardless of the rhythm, length of stride, position of the rider, outline of horse/pony etc.), then the score can not be lower than a 5 (sufficient), because that is all the test is asking you to do. Higher marks are obtained when all of the above are taken into consideration. Lower marks would indicate that the horse/pony broke from the pace, bucked, spooked, etc.

Appalling judging in my opinion.
 
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