What really hardens hooves

Frumpoon

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As title really, horse cannot keep shoes on and each time he loses one a chunk of hoof comes away too so that now we cannot shoe him at all and there is precious little left so we are trying shoeless....not by choice but necessity

Horse is crippled but we have to persevere for now

We have been feeding biotin and painting iodine at vet recommendation but does not appear to be improving and I can't stand watching poor thing struggle

What else can we paint on? In my day it was formaldehyde but that harder to get hold of now and fumes etc make unpleasant

Should add it has only been 2 and half weeks
 

Auslander

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You're not going to see an improvement in 2 and a half weeks - it takes months for new horn to start growing down, so you need to be prepared for the long haul. I'l let the foot lot talk through diet - that's the important bit. To get you over the hump, it's probably worth investing in some hoof boots, so that your horse can move comfortably.
 

ycbm

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It sounds like he needs boots.

Formaldehyde is easily available as Keratex (Very expensive) or sheep foot dip (Very cheap for a litre from a farmer, water down by three times its own volume).

A low sugar diet with balanced minerals hardens feet, and over time they tend to match the surface on which they are kept.
 

SusieT

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If he is crippled you need to give him bute, stable him on a soft surface or provide boots for him - it is not fair to expect him to bear the pain until his feet grow.
 

paddy555

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he needs a lot more time. a fortnight is nothing. I wouldn't touch formaldehyde with a barge pole not near either me or my horse. I don't think that there is anything you can paint on that will solve your problem,

I would start feeding a good quality supplement to get some decent growth. You need quality horn growing. That would be either equimins (which I use) or forage plus which many others use.

To deal with your immediate problem will depend on your horse's living arrangements. I presume your concerns are how to get over the next few weeks with a cripple. I wouldn't give bute. If he is in the field is he OK especially now it is softer and muddy or do you really need to boot in the field? In the stable presumably he is on a soft bed and OK. For going between the two I would either boot or if it is a short distance you could roll out a length of old carpet to provide a comfortable surface to walk over.

You make no mention of his frogs and thrush. Many horses that come out of shoes have thrush. That can cripple a horse and needs dealing with quickly. The other thing you don't mention is the trim when his shoes came off. It is very easy to cripple a horse at that stage by overtrimming. That is something I would be looking at.

If he is a cripple I expect you are only looking at boots to get him to the field and for general living not riding. For that I would use cavallos on the basis they are one of the cheaper boots and if you move on to riding you can eventually move on to a better riding boot idc.. Cavallos are easy to put on and off.
 

Frumpoon

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Very generous advice, thank you people

Yes I know 2 weeks is ****** all but it's hard watching him struggle

Ok so regime wise he's stabled at night with rubber mats and shavings and he's fine in his box, he's even fine on the concrete yard bit...he's getting less fine as his paddock dries out so I'm praying for more rain, but he's definitely not alright on the stony bit (about 6metres) between the yard and the field and like I say as his field dries out he's less well on it

He's on a lowish sugar diet, just happy hoof and normal hay, not haylage

I don't have too much of a problem with formaldehyde in principle, former medical student etc so I might try the keratex hoof hardener as a short term fix with the biotin supplement as a longer term solution

What do folks think about the cavallo for fit etc, are they true to size, do you need to go up etc?
 

PoppyAnderson

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You cannot put anything on externally to improve the hoof or harden it - you have to grow a strong foot. Happy Hoof is awful stuff - full of sugar/molasses (no matter what the lammi trust say). Get him off that and onto something with no molasses. Hoof boots will help to make him comfortable in the meantime.
 

Frumpoon

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Oooh poppy, what would you recommend for hard feed? He just needs a good quality chaff really with a few bits and minerals thrown in...everything seems to have at least a bit of molasses
 

ester

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well mostly feed but not biotin, any healthy horse will make plenty of that for themselves! A good broadspectrum no iron supplement and micronised linseed is a better idea.

What is the thrush situation. and if he wasn't keeping shoes on white lines disease status? Which bit have we been painting the iodine on?

I don't feel strongly either way on the keratex front if it helps and is needed, but red horse products which I generally like also make 'stronghorn' which might be worth trying.

I think turnout is what cavallos were made for (I wouldn't get past a walk in them by choice :p). IMO they fit true to size but you could always take pics with the tape measure and ask one of the nice shops and mention that you may need to use pads (and have space for them). They are also pretty cheap. The pads they come with are hard silicone so you may want to switch those out for softer easyboot ones, or people have used EPS pads if a horse is particularly sore https://www.equinepodiatrysupplies.co.uk/product/pair-eps-4lb-pads/ (the owner of that shop is helpful). It is hard to judge because only you know how sore he is really hence giving you multiple options. But it sounds like you need something to put on at least for the days that it is harder in the field.
 

ester

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Feed - how fussy is he?
base for supplements: speedibeet, plain straw chaff if not fussy, plain grass chaff if fussy - plenty of those chaffs about these days, I use agrobs aspero atm but am going to trial my fusspot with the new baileys one. You don't need much of any.

So plain straw chaffs, honeychop/topchop I think (never used as mine far too fussy!)
grass chaffs: agrobs aspero, baileys meadow blend, d+h just grass, emerald green grasstastic, simple systems does a timothy one, thunderbrooks, there are loads essentially! I try to avoid the ones that are ryegrass only.

Supplement. I use equimins advanced complete (powder or pellets) and add magnesium because it is a bit low and definitely for my grazing (he got cresty without it). Alternatives are forageplus, prohoof from pro_earth on ebay or equivita.

And charnwoods micronised linseed.
 

splashgirl45

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he needs a lot more time. a fortnight is nothing. I wouldn't touch formaldehyde with a barge pole not near either me or my horse. I don't think that there is anything you can paint on that will solve your problem,

I would start feeding a good quality supplement to get some decent growth. You need quality horn growing. That would be either equimins (which I use) or forage plus which many others use.

To deal with your immediate problem will depend on your horse's living arrangements. I presume your concerns are how to get over the next few weeks with a cripple. I wouldn't give bute. If he is in the field is he OK especially now it is softer and muddy or do you really need to boot in the field? In the stable presumably he is on a soft bed and OK. For going between the two I would either boot or if it is a short distance you could roll out a length of old carpet to provide a comfortable surface to walk over.

You make no mention of his frogs and thrush. Many horses that come out of shoes have thrush. That can cripple a horse and needs dealing with quickly. The other thing you don't mention is the trim when his shoes came off. It is very easy to cripple a horse at that stage by overtrimming. That is something I would be looking at.

If he is a cripple I expect you are only looking at boots to get him to the field and for general living not riding. For that I would use cavallos on the basis they are one of the cheaper boots and if you move on to riding you can eventually move on to a better riding boot idc.. Cavallos are easy to put on and off.

where are you in the country? i am in suffolk and the ground is hard again definately not soft and muddy...

i would use hoof boots as a temporary measure to keep him comfortable and feed a supplement to help with hoof quality. i have fed formula4feet over the last few years and found it helped my cushings mare's feet as they had deteriorated ..
 

PoppyAnderson

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Oooh poppy, what would you recommend for hard feed? He just needs a good quality chaff really with a few bits and minerals thrown in...everything seems to have at least a bit of molasses

I know, doesn't it! There's not much on the market but Agrobs and Thunderbrooks are 2 you can use.
 

DabDab

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I find sudocreme better than iodine for giving infection protection in a compromised hoof as it doesn't dry the hoof out.

For protection, hoof boots as above, or alternatively could your farrier look into plaster casts?
 

ester

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I'd use hoof stuff or field paste over sudocreme for infection protection any day :) (as a big sudocreme fan, half cover the horse in it and sulphur at times!)
 

Beausmate

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I've had good results with Red Horse Product's Stronghorn. Better than Keratex, cheaper and much, much less nasty to use.

Ultimately you need to grow a better quality hoof, so the right diet and exercise are what you need to aim for.
 

Frumpoon

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Ok sorry I probs won't manage to answer all questions in onego but with try best

Hoof casts - yes, did that the last time he lost a shoe but not a long term solution as did not allow much horn growth

Iodine - just the soles but did try tubbing this afternoon

Thrush/frogs - not a problem, as far as I can see, no evidence anyway...just really footsore soles
 

ester

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I'd treat frogs for thrush regardles on a just out of shoes horse, I treat my long out of shoes horse every week or so as it seems to keep them in better nick even though no evidence of disease.
 

Rosiejazzandpia

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I'd be feeding for better quality hoofs, not painting things on.
My 75 year old farrier recommends a fibre only diet. Feed good quality hay/haylege through winter and don't feed cereal based feeds.
The horses at my yard are almost all barefoot, they have great grazing in the summer and in winter get adlib hay and haylege which is very good quality. Most are fed with fast fibre, a good balancer and a handful of plain chaff. We don't hose off feet or have an unnecessary moisture. When the horses come in for breakfast in winter they have muddy feet, within an hour the mud is dry and can be brushed off.

If transitioning to barefoot keep the horse on soft surfaces, and build up slowly to roadwork/forestry paths. If you really need to then biotin or oil added to the feed really seems to make a difference. Good hooves come from good feeding, so unless you need to energy from cereals stick to fibre only and see what kind of hoof you have in 4 to 6 months.

Also look at how the well the hooves are trimmed and balanced. Make sure toes are rolled well to reduce chipping and cracks and that you're not over trimming. Really reduce sugars in the diet to an occasional carrot or apple.

I've learned so much from my farrier who has trimmed worldwide and gives a very no nonsense approach to trimming. There are no hoof miracle potions, just good feed, trimming when needed and not expecting results in weeks. Hope this helps :)
 

DD

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have shoes removed. make sure diet is balanced with adequate biotina nd other minerals and vits. boot if necessary. commence program of hardening hoofs including walking on tarmac when horse has sufficient growth probably in about 8 weeks time
 

DD

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I'd be feeding for better quality hoofs, not painting things on.
My 75 year old farrier recommends a fibre only diet. Feed good quality hay/haylege through winter and don't feed cereal based feeds.
The horses at my yard are almost all barefoot, they have great grazing in the summer and in winter get adlib hay and haylege which is very good quality. Most are fed with fast fibre, a good balancer and a handful of plain chaff. We don't hose off feet or have an unnecessary moisture. When the horses come in for breakfast in winter they have muddy feet, within an hour the mud is dry and can be brushed off.

If transitioning to barefoot keep the horse on soft surfaces, and build up slowly to roadwork/forestry paths. If you really need to then biotin or oil added to the feed really seems to make a difference. Good hooves come from good feeding, so unless you need to energy from cereals stick to fibre only and see what kind of hoof you have in 4 to 6 months.

Also look at how the well the hooves are trimmed and balanced. Make sure toes are rolled well to reduce chipping and cracks and that you're not over trimming. Really reduce sugars in the diet to an occasional carrot or apple.

I've learned so much from my farrier who has trimmed worldwide and gives a very no nonsense approach to trimming. There are no hoof miracle potions, just good feed, trimming when needed and not expecting results in weeks. Hope this helps :)

excellent advice
 

Rosiejazzandpia

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Oooh poppy, what would you recommend for hard feed? He just needs a good quality chaff really with a few bits and minerals thrown in...everything seems to have at least a bit of molasses
Feed a very low sugar chaff such as topchop zero. Get a good balancer and add extra fibre with fast fibre coming into winter. Horses really don't need hard feed, they need forage and fibre
 
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