What would you do?

[ForeverBroke_]

Looking for some totally unbiased opinions as my head is totally scrambled when it comes to my loan horse.

I've posted about him before. Short story for those that do not know - I rescued him and I adore the bones off of him. That said, simply due to work commitments and having 3 others whilst he never went without I always said if the 'perfect,' loan home came around for him to be a companion/light hack/loved more than I could offer then I would do it.

That situation arose. I didn't find them, they found me. Lovely family looking for a companion for their companion whilst their riding horse went out. Occasional plod to the farm shop but otherwise left to be fussed and loved. I knew the people through various other people and they are 10 minutes up the road from my current yard. Originally started off great. Few things weren't quite 100% my way of doing things, but I guess they never will be realistically speaking and they are really trivial things.

Fast forward 3 years and I'm just not 100% happy any more. He's absolutely fine, aside from being very fat, and whilst that does terrify me he is otherwise having his needs met. That being its own issue - he's also been moved three times without my prior knowledge. He was originally at a house, then moved to a field down the road, then to another location again only down the road. I did a bit of an unintentional drive by over the weekend as I was half passing and he's visible from the road - only to find him and his mates no where to be seen. Went to his previous 'location' which is 5 minutes down the road and he was back there, thankfully. As much as he seems to 'rotate' between these two places - they are separate properties and I am just feeling as though if I didn't half 'know,' the loaner I would be annoyed. I know they aren't doing it to be evasive or to make a runner with him, and are just alternating their grazing, but should I be being more strict on things or not?! My contract states he cannot be moved without my consent, but as he's not being boxed up and moved elsewhere I don't know if I am make it a bigger deal than it needs to be.

I would just love to have him back so I can take control of things more. The loaner is genuinely a lovely person, just a bit blase perhaps. If I got caught short and had to bring him back immediately I could, but I'm not in an 'ideal' position to take him back either (if that makes sense). I'm just rubbish at any kind of confrontation and worry that me saying that I essentially 'spied,' in on him on the weekend and he wasnt there/I'd like to be notified is going to be more upset than it needs to be..

 

[AandK]

My take on it is this... He is your horse, you are not happy with how they are looking after him (fat and doing less with him than you would), and moving him without your knowledge, albeit just down the road. If it were me, I would end the loan and take him back. Doesn't matter how lovely the loaner is IMO.

 

[Tally05]

Its your horse, you don't need to tell them anything other than you would like him back. I'd start making plans to get him back and then tell them when you are ready. There doesn't need to be a confrontation. Loaning is exactly what it is - loaning. On the other hand, you could say you would like to see him and check in on how he's doing, you are well within your rights to do a welfare check, then mention that he's overweight and ask what they are doing to combat it and then go from there. Ask how much they go up, if they can exercise more to get his weight down etc?

 

[DiNozzo]

You need to think about what exactly you want for him.

I don't think a companion horse (provided he had plenty of room) needs to be mucked about with, so that he's only being checked on and that it, is not necessarily an issue.

Is he that fat its worrying going into winter? Or is he just fatter than you'd like him to be?

I would have a chat about him being in different fields. They've possibly just not thought of it as him being moved if its what they've always done with theirs. You're well within your rights to ask though.

ETA: If you do want him back though, you are his owner and you can cancel the loan whenever. Like Tally and AandK have said

 

[IrishMilo]

The only thing I'd be annoyed about is that he's very fat. All of the other things sound like non issues.

I don't see what the problem with them rotating their grazing is.

You say that you wanted a companion home for him but then go on to say you don't want him just sat in a field. I'd be confused if I was loaning your horse.

 

[ForeverBroke_]

The only thing I'd be annoyed about is that he's very fat. All of the other things sound like non issues.

I don't see what the problem with them rotating their grazing is.

You say that you wanted a companion home for him but then go on to say you don't want him just sat in a field. I'd be confused if I was loaning your horse.

The being sat in a field is absolutely fine - but in an ideal world he'd be checked more than once a day IMO. They are rotating their grazing, but it is a 5 minute drive up the road/ not the same property - so they have moved yards each time they have done it. Just so happens they return back to where they've been before.

 

[ForeverBroke_]

You need to think about what exactly you want for him.

I don't think a companion horse (provided he had plenty of room) needs to be mucked about with, so that he's only being checked on and that it, is not necessarily an issue.

Is he that fat its worrying going into winter? Or is he just fatter than you'd like him to be?

I would have a chat about him being in different fields. They've possibly just not thought of it as him being moved if its what they've always done with theirs. You're well within your rights to ask though.

ETA: If you do want him back though, you are his owner and you can cancel the loan whenever. Like Tally and AandK have said

This is kind of exactly where I'm at. He's essentially absolutely fine - but his weight does need to be addressed. He's fine as he is at the moment but certainly can't get any fatter.

 

[TPO]

Given that you aren't in an ideal situation to take him back I'd suggest you speak to them as the first port of call.

It doesnt have to be a confrontation, it's just a chat about him and as his owner that's perfectly normal and expected.

Ask to visit him and have them there. Whilst there it's the perfect time to see him "legitimately" and tell them that you are worried about his weight. Ask or tell them how you want him managed.

Same with the time being spent, or not, on him. Ask them what their plans are, it could be that their situation has changed and they dont have the time that they did initially.

It also gives you a chance, while at his field, to say that you know he started at A yard then was B, you drove past him at C and now hes back to B and while you dont mind and understand why they move it's in the contract that you should be asked before any moves. Tell them that you would appreciate getting notice in the future.

If you're still not happy having spoken with them then just say thay you've thought about it and would like him back so serve them notice of the loan ending.

 

[HashRouge]

As others, he's your horse and if you're not happy then take him back. BUT the only thing I can actually see a genuine reason to be annoyed about is the fact that he's too fat. The grazing situation sounds like they have access to different fields on the same lane - presumably they have been rotating round these fields in the three years they've had him? Have you ever asked them about the grazing set up and which fields they use when?? However, they aren't actually moving yards, so presumably didn't think there was any need to say anything. Plenty of livery yards have summer fields that are quite a distance from the main yard and well away from the winter fields. I used to be on one where the winter fields were a 15 min walk from the main yard (we all used to drive). And the sitting in the field thing...you did loan him out to be a companion to a companion so I'd say that's fairly standard. Most horses are very happy to stay in the field!

 

[windand rain]

To be honest he isnt really moving he is still with the loaners and he is being well cared for if a bit fat. He went as a companion so wouldn't expect him to be doing a lot so not sure what you have concerns about. Of course if you simply want him back that is fine it is your choice

 

[HashRouge]

The being sat in a field is absolutely fine - but in an ideal world he'd be checked more than once a day IMO. They are rotating their grazing, but it is a 5 minute drive up the road/ not the same property - so they have moved yards each time they have done it. Just so happens they return back to where they've been before.

Do you 100% know he's only being checked once a day though? And that someone else isn't paid to check him at the other end of the day? I only ever see my two once a day, but I pay my YO to check them the other end of the day.

 

[ForeverBroke_]

Thank you all. I am appreciating the perspective already.

I didn't word my first post particularly well and have amended. I'm MORE than happy him just being a companion. I have no issues with that whatsoever. I just know he only gets checked once a day which in an ideal world wouldnt happen but it is what it is.

As my initial post states I think aside being fat, he's totally content and happy. Just wasn't sure whether people would be annoyed/not bothered by the change of location.

 

[HashRouge]

Thank you all. I am appreciating the perspective already.

I didn't word my first post particularly well and have amended. I'm MORE than happy him just being a companion. I have no issues with that whatsoever. I just know he only gets checked once a day which in an ideal world wouldnt happen but it is what it is.

As my initial post states I think aside being fat, he's totally content and happy. Just wasn't sure whether people would be annoyed/not bothered by the change of location.

I'd only be annoyed about him being fat. Re the change of location - just ask them which fields they use when so you know where he will be.

 

[ForeverBroke_]

I guess if I look at it rationally and not like a control-freak horse owner I trust the loaner with him 110%, so if they find a field that better suits their needs then I'm all for it.

I think I'll address his weight if its still a bit scary next time I see them all, and let the other elements go a bit! Think I'm just having a wobble!!

 

[ester]

I can imagine also, getting there and not finding your horse where you expect it takes you back a bit too.

I'd plan to speak to them before spring about the weight, and say what weight management techniques you'd be happy for them to do (not everyone agrees with muzzles etc) and if they don't want to take that on board perhaps they need a different companion who can take that amount of grass (whatever it is!). But you have space and time to discuss that and make any alternate plans if you then need to.

 

[JulesRules]

I agree with TPO, maybe just ask to pop and see him and use the opportunity to address the weight. When people see a horse every day some times it's harder to notice weight gain. If you are worried by his weight is definitely talk to them as if he gets laminitis you will wish you had said something.

In terms of the grazing situation, I'm not sure if they have moved yards or if they have various grazing that they rotate and I suspect you aren't sure either. I'd use the opportunity just to ask and see which it is. If they are actually moving yards I'd remind them that they need to let you know as/when they move.
I don't think a general chat about his wellbeing helps to remind them that he is still your horse as people can be complacent after a long term loan and start to forget he isn't theirs. A gentle reminder probably wouldn't hurt.

 

[Polos Mum]

In your shoes I would have a friendly chat with them and see what they think of his weight - if they have noticed and have a plan that would reassure me. If they take on board that now is the time to address the weight - great too.
at the same time I'd mention that I'd driven past and spotted he'd moved again so would they mind just dropping you a text when he moves from yard to yard.

My next step would totally depend on their reaction - calm rational "of course, no problem" I wouldn't give it a second thought. If they were defensive or I felt like they weren't listening then I'd start thinking of plan B.

 

[Pedantic]

From reading the post, it sounds like the only real problem is being overweight, which isnt good, alternating grazing fields over a short distance isnt really being moved as such, unless I am missing something, I am really fussy over my boys care, so I know how things can cause concern.

 

[misst]

If you aren't happy then have him back if you feel that is best. However is he really being "moved"? You say yourself they are just rotating grazing and if that is the case they probably don't think of it as moving him precisely - more putting him in a new field.
The weight - I understand your concerns. You probably need to have a conversation about how they plan to manage him this autumn and next spring but having had a overweight retired horse I did not realise how fat she had got until I saw a photo of her posted by my daughter on here! I just didn't see it until I looked on here and saw the photos of the golden oldies and realised my golden oldie looked totally different to my own idea of what she looked like. I saw her every day and it just didn't register. So perhaps they need something pointing out. If they are open to managing things to your liking I would leave him there personally unless I could offer perfection at home.

 

[Floofball]

Not read the rest of the replies so sorry if it’s been said above BUT his needs are NOT being met if he’s too fat - your right to be terrified. The swapping of fields isn’t the issue. You know them - go talk to them. If they’re not willing to address his weight issues get him back. That’s what I would do

 

[ForeverBroke_]

Thanks for all the help and perspective everyone.

I am definitely more relaxed about the moving of fields/yards. As it seems to be the same 3 places and he's not actually being boxed up and moved miles away I think I can let it slide. I think as another poster said, it just threw me a bit when I expected him to be at one location to find him elsewhere more than anything else.

I will address his weight with an arranged visit. I fear if we get a frost it might really cause us a problem.

Thanks everyone again.

 

[Annagain]

It sounds like you've got a plan for the weight - for the moving, maybe you could tell them you drove past the other day and had a bit of a heart in mouth moment when you couldn't see him or his friends until you realised they'd gone back to their other grazing. You could then ask them to let you know next time, just a text would be fine, so you don't panic when you can't see him?

 

[Ranyhyn]

No, I wouldnt be worried.

I'd just ask them to text me when he moves so I know where I can pop past and say hello.

 

[Fred66]

You said he was fat but not dangerously so, you just wouldn’t want him getting any fatter. On the basis that we are just heading into winter then with a grass kept older horse this might actually be ok as he is likely to drop some over the winter.
However equally it’s an ideal time to mention it the loanee as you can be non critical in the way you approach the subject.