White Line Disease

skint1

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My 18yo mare has been suffering for the last month with bruising of the sole and abscess after abscess on her left front foot. I called the vet again,( she has seen vet and farrier a lot in the last month) , and they've diagnosed white line disease, vet feels with correct management my mare will be fine, I have resisted the urge to google so, would anyone like to share advice about treatment/management and that kind of thing?
 

amandap

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My 18yo mare has been suffering for the last month with bruising of the sole and abscess after abscess on her left front foot. I called the vet again,( she has seen vet and farrier a lot in the last month) , and they've diagnosed white line disease, vet feels with correct management my mare will be fine, I have resisted the urge to google so, would anyone like to share advice about treatment/management and that kind of thing?
What did the vet recommend?

WLD can be linked to excess sugars in the diet, metabolic issues and or mineral imbalance/deficiency or excess of particular minerals. Repeated abscessing the same.
http://forageplus.co.uk/abscesses-and-poor-hoof-quality/

ps. It can be complicated by pathogens invading the compromised white line.
 

skint1

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They recommended that we poultice the foot and clean it out, she mentioned a product called Clean Tracks but also said Milton Steriliser fluid would do the same, farrier has to be involved to ensure all he infection gets dug out, then once the infection has healed it has to be sort of sealed off and protected. I didn't really take it all in, the farrier is going to call me with an action plan.
 

amandap

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Clean trax is very good (and safe) but you need long soaking boots and a long soak. This will deal with the infection but you need to address diet as well ime. It will have to grow out so expect it to take a bit of time to resolve it.
 

Scatterbrain

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My farrier discovered white line disease in a rear hoof of one of my horses just the other day there. I've never encountered this before. The only change I've made in the last few months is to graze some sheep in my paddocks and the farrier reckons the bacteria from their droppings may have caused it?
He's dug out the area, packed the hole with cotton wool soaked with hydrogen peroxide and shod as per normal. I've to spray under the shoe with Osmond's Bactakil twice weekly and he'll reassess at his next shoeing.
I hope this is the correct procedure to treat it? Time will tell I guess.
 

deb_l222

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Hmmm my favourite subject.........

It's all going to depend on how far the hoof wall has separated as to how well your mare will recover without surgical intervention.

I've had two years of nightmare now with my boy. Two surgeries and misdiagnosis from vets which has resulted in the poor lad being left untreated for longer than necessary.

If it is white line disease, the infection won't be an abscess in the normal sense of the word, it will be the lamini itself that has become infected, which can compromise the pedal bone (as in my lad's case).

I would suggest you get 'expert' advice, as in a hospital specialist vet as they deal with this stuff day in day out, unlike a regular vet.
 

skint1

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thank you everyone for your responses, sounds like i need a soaking boot and some anti-bac, the vet didn't specify (that I recall) how often I should change the poultice (daily I would assume) or at what point I should change from a wet to dry poultice, or how often I should soak it? How often would you recommend?

Deb- how awful for you and your horse, and must have been incredibly frustrating for you. Should I ask for the vet to ex ray or scan? Or a referral to a hospital vet? How to tell the extent of it? Has your boy recovered now?

I've made her a pen in the field to restrict her movement and grass intak as she was going nuts in her box alone and there isn't always horses available to stay in with her. The vet said it was ok to do that but that she'd recover faster in a box (providing she would've kept still)

My YO has made her the most incredible boot to keep her foot clean, but it wouldn't be any good to soak. This evening she seemed a lot more comfortable, I guess the pressure on the internal parts of her foot has been eased somewhat.
 
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amandap

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thank you everyone for your responses, sounds like i need a soaking boot and some anti-bac, the vet didn't specify (that I recall) how often I should change the poultice (daily I would assume) or at what point I should change from a wet to dry poultice, or how often I should soak it? How often would you recommend?

I've made her a pen in the field to restrict her movement and grass intak as she was going nuts in her box alone and there isn't always horses available to stay in with her. The vet said it was ok to do that but that she'd recover faster in a box (providing she would've kept still)

My YO has made her the most incredible boot to keep her foot clean, but it wouldn't be any good to soak. This evening she seemed a lot more comfortable, I guess the pressure on the internal parts of her foot has been eased somewhat.
I take it the poultice is for the abscess? I haven't poulticed for years since a vet dug one, so perhaps check with the vet as to what they advise.

If you are going to go with cleantrax to soak it has very strict instructions as to how much water to add - 1 gallon (it is in US gallon so don't forget to convert!) and it requires a boot that goes more or less to the knee to prevent slopping as well as contain the quantity. Here''s some info and a pic of the type of boot needed. http://www.equinepodiatrysupplies.co.uk/Hoof-Treatments
A 30-45 minute soak is recommended so your horse must be able to stand (with hay obviously) calmly for this. The odd step is ok I've found but be aware some horses may panic if they feel the fluid sloshing when they move.

I am a cleantrax convert but have used a weak milton solution (20 mins soak) in the past with good effect and with tyre inner tube as a boot!

Turnout as you have done will help imo as it encourages circulation and most of all reduces stress for horses like yours.
 

Alyth

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I am quite surprised to read about abcesses being linked to wld.. aka seedy toe? I have always been able to control seedy toe by cleaning with hydrogen peroxide, opening up the area a little to allow air to penetrate (the pathogens are anaerobic) and then packing with copper sulphate dissolved in Vaseline...as the hoof grows and is trimmed the damage grows out....
 

deb_l222

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Sorry for delay in replying, been away with work for a few days.

To be honest my lad's case was extreme but it didn't start out that way. I guess what I'm saying is, follow what your 'normal' vet is saying as this may well be enough to sort it out but if the abscess / infection doesn't go away then seek a specialist referral.

I won't bore you to death with my story as it goes on and on and on and on but in my case things were made more complicated as they found two keratomas in the hoof, which shifted the focus away from the real problem, the white line disease. He now has some necrosis of the pedal bone, from the repeated infections.

Anyway, yes the lad is fine now. Had another surgery in February of this year. Re-sected the hoof all the way up to healthy tissue and all the way to the bone (like I say extreme) but he's sound, happy, back in the field (which is nothing short of a miracle).

What caused it? Being barefoot, being very heavy (800kg), very wet weather and the decision of YO to cover paths in teeny tiny bits of grit. Have moved yards and he will never not be shod again.
 

amandap

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I am quite surprised to read about abcesses being linked to wld.. aka seedy toe? I have always been able to control seedy toe by cleaning with hydrogen peroxide, opening up the area a little to allow air to penetrate (the pathogens are anaerobic) and then packing with copper sulphate dissolved in Vaseline...as the hoof grows and is trimmed the damage grows out....
I have also dealt with WLD in a similar way but have found that unless I also address diet, problems tend to recurr unless the lamina/white line is healthy and well connected in the rest of the hoof.

I do think recurrent abscessing is a sign the hoof/hooves are not healthy and diet is a fundamental to health.

As this horse has both problems I do think diet is very probably a factor in both.

ps. Being barefoot shouldn't/doesn't cause WLD.
 
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Pipkin

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I am quite surprised to read about abcesses being linked to wld.. aka seedy toe? I have always been able to control seedy toe by cleaning with hydrogen peroxide, opening up the area a little to allow air to penetrate (the pathogens are anaerobic) and then packing with copper sulphate dissolved in Vaseline...as the hoof grows and is trimmed the damage grows out....

This, one of mine was diagnosed with it last autumn, (farrier said due to ground coniditons) he dug out, i kept clean with sole cleanse, sprayed it with foot master and then plugged with artimud from red horse products, damage grew out within 2 trims.
There is a gel called White lightening which is meant to be good, I never used it as kept mare shod, is meant to be fab stuff
 

amandap

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Packing will depend on what the vet and farrier decide to do, you can't pack a resected hoof as the wall has gone. It would have to be dressed.
I have found packing and disinfection works well to keep infection at bay.
 

Vanha12

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Farrier found this in my mare a few years ago. She was stabled most of the time and I used neat hibiscrub every day for a month and it all cleared up.
 

skint1

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I wonder if I am misunderstanding something then(, if abscessing isn't consistent with WLD), my mare's symptoms began with a stone bruise about a month ago, this was treated and cleared up fairly quickly, then about 2 weeks ago she began to get a bit footy on stony ground so I restricted her but this didn't help and she became very sore with bruising and abscesses on the sole of her foot, her soles are flat and soft and the general quality of the hoof is poor. This is despite a year of Formula4Feet and regular farriery.

My mare is shod, I don't think I could cope with trying to take her barefoot at this stage. I can't get hold of CleanTrax easily (have ordered some and the boot) so I have begun to tub her foot in a Milton Solution. She is a lot more comfortable in her paddock but still quite ouchy on the yard.

eta- as part of this exercise I am reconsidering her diet, currently she has formula4feet, Hifi Lite and a bit of FastFibre or QuikBeet, she has Equine America Airways and also PremierflexPlus and Tumeric. The vet has suggested EA HoofPowerPlus, I really thought F4F was the answer as believe it or not her hooves are better than they were when I bought her, but I guess not enough.

I am worried that if her symptoms are not consistent with WLD there is something else there that is being missed
 
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amandap

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I wonder if I am misunderstanding something then(, if abscessing isn't consistent with WLD), my mare's symptoms began with a stone bruise about a month ago, this was treated and cleared up fairly quickly, then about 2 weeks ago she began to get a bit footy on stony ground so I restricted her but this didn't help and she became very sore with bruising and abscesses on the sole of her foot, her soles are flat and soft and the general quality of the hoof is poor. This is despite a year of Formula4Feet and regular farriery.

My mare is shod, I don't think I could cope with trying to take her barefoot at this stage. I can't get hold of CleanTrax easily (have ordered some and the boot) so I have begun to tub her foot in a Milton Solution. She is a lot more comfortable in her paddock but still quite ouchy on the yard.

eta- as part of this exercise I am reconsidering her diet, currently she has formula4feet, Hifi Lite and a bit of FastFibre or QuikBeet, she has Equine America Airways and also PremierflexPlus and Tumeric. The vet has suggested EA HoofPowerPlus, I really thought F4F was the answer as believe it or not her hooves are better than they were when I bought her, but I guess not enough.

I am worried that if her symptoms are not consistent with WLD there is something else there that is being missed
WLD is a poor white line where infection is present and there is usually a cavity between the hoof wall and sole when debris is cleaned out. You will probably not be able to see it with a shoe on. The only time I have known it cause lameness is when bigger stones get wedged in the cavity. I am wondering if the thin, sensitive soles are the cause of pain. Thin soles are prone to bruising which can lead to sole abscess.

One possible problem with shoeing and thin soles is if the farrier is cutting sole at each shoeing and also the bony column is not supported by a shoe only the hoof wall, so the weight of the horse is bearing down on an unsupported thin sole. Here's a brief article giving some pointers about thin soles.
http://www.hoofrehab.com/WhyThinSoles.html

As above PPID (Cushings) is something to consider with thin soles not responding to diet changes.
Soaking wont help the thin soles but it will help WLD. Perhaps you need to ask your vet for clarifiation. WLD does not = thin soles but they can occur at the same time in one hoof.
 

skint1

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Thanks so much amandap, I think I need to talk to my farrier about this, he is coming out on Monday. I'm really stuck because the abscess is still draining away, but soaking it isn't going to help this other, potentially worse, problem.

Vet and farrier advise (currently) that once abscess is cleared I am to start painting her soles with antibac to harden them up and also rub cornucrescene on the coronet band, and also get a new supplement, all of which is fine, hopefully the farrier will have other ideas. She is sore on the yard, even with a big, thick, padded boot on. It could be that now the sole is even softer, the bruising has yet to heal, she has 2 big holes in her foot , or perhaps something worse is happening right under our eyes.

One thing I have noticed since I've been poulticing and soaking, and perhaps I need a photo to explain is that there is now a black line all the way around the edge of the hoof, could this be debris coming out?

No one has mentioned the possibility of Cushings, but I would not be adverse to having her tested.
 

amandap

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One thing I have noticed since I've been poulticing and soaking, and perhaps I need a photo to explain is that there is now a black line all the way around the edge of the hoof, could this be debris coming out?
Is the shoe off on that hoof?

Sub solar absesses are very sore and can take a while for soreness to resolve.

I don't think the cause of solar absess is likely to be WLD, bruising is more likely. If the absess is extensive the sole can peel off at a later date when new sole has grown underneath, a bit like a blister.
 

skint1

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Thanks again for replying! I am sorry to take so much of your time, but have found the info here very useful.

The shoe is off, been off for the last week as she had come up lame , started off with bruising, foot was wrapped to protect it, over weekend her discomfort increased so I called the vet who found an abscess, she seemed no better so vet came again and dug out a deep hole by her toe- she considered the overall health of the hoof to be poor and this is when WLD got mentioned. This second hole does seem overall to have made her more comfortable in the field, I guess I was hoping to see a massive and quick improvement to her comfort (as I have with my other horses when they've had abscesses) but it makes sense that if hers is extensive it may take some time.

I am anxious for her, if I may be sentimental she is my best bud and I hate to see her in pain (though she seems happy enough in herself) I think I've let her down and want to ensure she gets appropriate treatment.
 
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amandap

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If the shoe is off (sorry if I missed that earlier) then the black line sounds like a 'dirty' white line round the hoof if it runs next to the hoof wall.
Is this the only hoof with thin sole?
Did the vet consider an X Ray?

I'm sorry I got muddled, Alyth understood clearer than I did!
 

skint1

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]
Maggiehoof_zps4ca8f132.jpg


Here is a photo, it's a bit rubbish as it is hard to hold a mobile phone and a hoof at the same time :) The hoof is wet as it was taken in the middle of her tubbing session.

The vet hasn't really said much but the farrier has said to paint all the soles with antibac, he is coming Monday so hopefully he'll give me some more guidance then.

And I am sorry, as I have been a bit wordy in my descriptions, I have found everyone's input very useful, plenty to think about
 
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amandap

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The hoof looks as if it has been trimmed severely and looks very weak. I would suggest you consider a new hoof care professional and a careful support and then rehab program.
I know you don't feel barefoot is an option but I have to say that, going by that hoof, a break from shoes under experienced professional care would be a very good move imho.
I am sorry if this sounds brutal but I also can't see how that hoof could be shod anyway for a while, there's so little wall left to try and put a nail in. x
 

_HP_

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Has your vet/farrier ruled out laminitis and rotation?
The dark area between the point of the frog and the toe is about the area where the pedal bone would penetrate the sole in severe rotation and some of the laminae look quite stretched from what I can see.
 

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