Why is winter turnout not a thing!?

[PSD]

How many of you have winter turnout on livery yards?

where I am is great, fantastic hacking, location and facilities. Good prices and great liveries however in winter we get 20 minutes a day “turnout” in a mud paddock which to me isn’t enough, especially for a youngster.

I’ve been looking at other yards and it seems most are either the same or have no winter turnout at all. I’ve found a lovely private yard close ish, with weather permitting day time winter turnout, 24/7 in summer, , sand paddock for schooling, secure tack rooms and storage barns.

now I’m not sure whether I want to move or not for definite, I’m trying to think ahead and think what would suit myself and my horse.

but is this a common thing for livery yards now? They just don’t offer winter turnout for horses? I find it bizarre that they find 20 minutes per day acceptable for 6 months of the year.

 

[paddi22]

it's all land related. I lived in a city area and used to be constantly hassling my yard owner for more turnout in all weather. when I got my old fields I totally understood the hassle yards have if they don't have enough acreage/right clay. I think yards will have to create more all weather turnout areas in order to offer some kind of quality of life for horses. I agree, 20 mins is horrific

 

[HappyHollyDays]

I’m DIY with no restrictions on turnout whatsoever. I leave mine out at night until Christmas unless it’s very wet and they start going back out at night in March/April. Same routine in summer, they are out nights and in during the day.

I wouldn’t go anywhere that didn’t offer decent turnout in winter.

 

[PapaverFollis]

It depends where you are I think. In some areas it's just so wet it's almost impossible to keep horses on fields in winter. In other areas land is so expensive yard owners have to over stock to make ends meet...

The yards I was on in Cumbria ranged rom no turnout at all (we'll let you turn out in the school and they'll go out on dry days... 1 month later, actually no we won't and no they won't... cue lots and lots of hand walking two slowly going mental horses for me and a horse that promptly required vet attention after the first attempt to turn out in spring... we moved yards that week!) to 6 ish hours most days. And the 6 hour turnout fields got completely trashed! But that yard had separate summer and winter grazing so it was fine. Some places had smaller trash paddocks for winter other places you had to manage all year round in the same field so there was more restrictions. Some places had good intentions and more land and realised they were keeping horses not bowling greens. Other places you were taken out and shot if your horse so much as put a hoof print in a field.

I don't think limited turnout is good for anybody but I can see why it happens especially now I have my own fields to look after! But I think for the sake of horse welfare some general shift and creative solutions are required. But it all costs money doesn't it?

 

[SatansLittleHelper]

Mine are out 24/7 and one of the reasons I wont go onto a livery yard is due to restricted turnout.
Noone will ever persuade me that it is anything other than a serious welfare issue to have horses stood in boxes all winter

 

[PSD]

I just don’t know what to do. I’m tempted to have a look at the private yard however there’s no other liveries for now just the owner and her 2 horses, so I’m not sure whether that would work.

but the winter turnout option is swaying me at the moment, I’m on a huge yard and to share a small mud paddock in winter is going to be a nightmare, I also think 20 minutes is nowhere near enough. Though we will have a loose pen to let them have a run but again it’s not the same as actual turnout.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Is this an unbroken youngster, OP?

 

[Leandy]

Not that common in my experience although happens in a very few yards I'm aware of but only where the land is very wet clay or similar. If by youngster you mean unbroken and so cannot be worked then this is a completely unsuitable way to keep a youngster and you need to find appropriate herd turnout. If the horse is able to work and you have time to do it/money to pay someone else to do it and are prepared to give sufficient exercise then I have no problem with stabling for the winter especially if it preserves good turnout for the summer which they get the benefit of.

 

[PSD]

Is this an unbroken youngster, OP?

It is, if she was broken I wouldn’t have so much of an issue as I could just ride her more

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

I am in Sussex and I have also found that many yards have limited turnout - I definitely think it is becoming more common due to the amount of horses needed to make ends meet for these sites. However I am lucky that I have found a yard which has truly unlimited turnout 24/7/365 as we are truly DIY. It's up to us to make sure we look after our fields, and we have winter/summer fields (although we only go on summer fields after second hay cut so can't trash winter too much).

 

[Sussexbythesea]

Most yards around here offer at least daily turnout in winter (proper days to minimum half day). But we’re mostly on chalk or other reasonably well drained soils. Go inland onto the Wealden clay areas and the winter turn out is more restricted although I’ve personally never come across any yard without any winter turn out. Having been on the heavy clay for one year at a previous yard it was horrible and nearly every horse got severe mud fever. Only time I’ve ever used a snuggy hood and a tail bag to prevent horse being encased in clay that sets like concrete.

 

[Tiddlypom]

You’ll have to move, then. It is just about doable for a horse in full work, but never for a youngster.

 

[dorsetladette]

Could your youngster not go on youngstock livery somewhere. Usually 24/7 turnout within a similar aged herd. Even just for the winter and then in the spring bring them back to a yard with turnout for the summer.

 

[chaps89]

I'm not sure I'd have horses if I couldn't offer them good quality all year turnout.
No point having unlimited turnout if it's in a mud bath but equally I don't find 20 minutes a day acceptable, sorry.
Not so bad perhaps for a fit hunter or competition horse who is working HARD but the average leisure horse I really don't think it's ok, and really not for a youngster.
So I'm glad you're trying to find an alternative.
The trouble with all day turnout on a 'weather permitting' basis, is last winter it rained pretty much from November to March. Does that mean they would have no turnout at all in that time?

Some areas of the country are just wet and have poor ground for having horses on.
If wetter winters are becoming the norm, YO's really should be investing in some serious drainage or all weather turnout areas, or cutting back on numbers. All these things cost money and it seems as yet the horsey world isn't generally prepared to pay what it would cost if these things were to be done.

In your shoes I'd maybe send her away, out of the area if necessary, to a full grass livery setup where maybe there is a barn/lots of shelters, plenty of space and herd company

 

[PSD]

Could your youngster not go on youngstock livery somewhere. Usually 24/7 turnout within a similar aged herd. Even just for the winter and then in the spring bring them back to a yard with turnout for the summer.

To be honest I want to try and avoid moving a lot. I’d rather find a yard that met hers and my needs and be able to stay there long term

 

[PSD]

I'm not sure I'd have horses if I couldn't offer them good quality all year turnout.
No point having unlimited turnout if it's in a mud bath but equally I don't find 20 minutes a day acceptable, sorry.
Not so bad perhaps for a fit hunter or competition horse who is working HARD but the average leisure horse I really don't think it's ok, and really not for a youngster.
So I'm glad you're trying to find an alternative.
The trouble with all day turnout on a 'weather permitting' basis, is last winter it rained pretty much from November to March. Does that mean they would have no turnout at all in that time?

Some areas of the country are just wet and have poor ground for having horses on.
If wetter winters are becoming the norm, YO's really should be investing in some serious drainage or all weather turnout areas, or cutting back on numbers. All these things cost money and it seems as yet the horsey world isn't generally prepared to pay what it would cost if these things were to be done.

In your shoes I'd maybe send her away, out of the area if necessary, to a full grass livery setup where maybe there is a barn/lots of shelters, plenty of space and herd company

That’s what is niggling at me. Weather permitting - what exactly does that mean? I guess I could have a chat with YO and see what they mean by that.
What bugs me where I am is we have tonnes of land, so winter turnout could be done it just isn’t. Plus the paddock that gets used turns into a complete swap due to the amount of horses that use it and I’m not really keen on the idea of putting a horse in a mud bath

 

[TheMule]

For a horse in work, with some kind of walker/ all weather pen I can just about accept that some people need to keep horses that way.
For a young horse it's an absolute no. Don’t subject her to that kind of torture.

 

[Auslander]

It's pretty rare in my area to have winter turnot. I do, but my fields get horrifically trashed - it's like the Somme for a few months. i've done my best to keep the horses as cheerful as possible, with hard sanding pens, and hardstanding at the top of the fields - but if they want to go out in the fields, they need to wade through mud soup to get there! None of them appear to mind all that much, and the land bounces back after a good harrow and roll

 

[PSD]

I understand the land issue I completely get it. But for a yard so large with limited turnout it’s bothering me. I don’t want to move but I can’t have a 2yo stabled for 6 months of the year (summer turnout ends in November and restarts end of April) it just isn’t fair to me. Especially when in winter time is limited anyway due to daylight and there’s only so much in hand work one can do with a stables 2yo!

 

[PSD]

It’s also bothering me how much ragwort is in our summer field and nothing is being done about it. Like it’s REALLY bothering me!

as I say I’ve found a small private place up the road with a sand paddock to exercise in, storage barns, tackroom and winter turnout. I think it’s worth a look

 

[TheMule]

Just send a 2yr old to youngstock livery- there are lots around and it will do it the world of good, I wouldn’t stable a 2yr old in any capacity

 

[dorsetladette]

To be honest I want to try and avoid moving a lot. I’d rather find a yard that met hers and my needs and be able to stay there long term

I can understand that, but as pony matures your needs will change anyway. So what suits now may not suit in a year or so's time when your ready for backing/breaking. and a year after that when your ready to get out and about more and show pony the sights.

 

[PSD]

I can understand that, but as pony matures your needs will change anyway. So what suits now may not suit in a year or so's time when your ready for backing/breaking. and a year after that when your ready to get out and about more and show pony the sights.

this is the other side of my argument. This time next year my needs will have changed again no doubt and perhaps where I am now may be more suitable! Argh it’s a tough one

 

[PSD]

Just send a 2yr old to youngstock livery- there are lots around and it will do it the world of good, I wouldn’t stable a 2yr old in any capacity

there isn’t any youngstock liveries that I know of in my area

 

[Gingerwitch]

That’s what is niggling at me. Weather permitting - what exactly does that mean? I guess I could have a chat with YO and see what they mean by that.
What bugs me where I am is we have tonnes of land, so winter turnout could be done it just isn’t. Plus the paddock that gets used turns into a complete swap due to the amount of horses that use it and I’m not really keen on the idea of putting a horse in a mud bath

I did the weather permitting once....never ever again they were in even on dry days eventually from Oct til April as the acted like loons on a weekend, so yard owners shut the fields. It nigh on killed me as had 4 at the time. I was on verge of selling up or putting down but moved miles away. Ponies out every day with exception of ice and it has to be quite bad to stay in eg yard will text to say ponies in, but if you want to turn out at your risk you can but also have to bring in yourself, which I think is very fair. On occasion if terential rain and icy winds they come in at 3 when on winter turn out but from march til sept, early Oct they are out for 20 out if 24 hours, only coming in for a break from heat and fly's and a check over. It's not cheap and it's a bit far really for me but it works and ponies all settled.

 

[holeymoley]

All the yards around my area have winter turnout. It’s not 24/7 though, they all come in and go out during the day. The rainfall and flooding is getting worse each year though so my yard is now down to half day turnout which is absolutely fine for mine. Some other yards do alternate days turnout and another I knew closed the fields and put them on hard standing with a rota system(hellish).

 

[DirectorFury]

I had to move my horse 20 miles away to get somewhere with guaranteed all year turnout that wasn’t just a few hours in a mud pit in winter. Because it’s so far she had to go on full livery which also had cost implications. It’s the best thing I’ve ever done, for both the horse and me!

In your situation I’d send her to your nearest young stock livery on full livery, even if it’s quite far away and you can only visit once or twice a week.

 

[dorsetladette]

there isn’t any youngstock liveries that I know of in my area

Ring around a few local studs. They will normally put an extra one in with there youngstock for the winter (or how ever long you want).

 

[ForeverBroke_]

I'm in the south and mine go out every day without fail til at least 12pm if its horrendous, but usually its til about 2pm. They've only ever stayed in once and that was with the ' beast of the east,' but even then they went out for a mooch about for an hour while getting mucked out.

 

[dorsetladette]

this is the other side of my argument. This time next year my needs will have changed again no doubt and perhaps where I am now may be more suitable! Argh it’s a tough one

I can't see 20 min turn out would be suitable for anyone apart from something on box rest or a rehab yard maybe.