Why it is not good for ponies to be 'pleasantly plump'

TGM

TGM

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 April 2003
Messages
16,547
Location
South East
Visit site
Just thought I would post a bit of information for those who feel it is not really a problem if a horse or pony is 'pleasantly plump' or 'comfortably cuddly'. Unfortunately, being overweight is really a big health risk for equines. It is now known that fat cells can produce a wide range of hormones - if the animal's fat deposits are larger than normal then this can upset the hormone balance and result in the animal becoming insulin resistant, which in turn makes the animal very susceptible to laminitis.

A good summary of the problem here:

http://www.lakeviewvets.co.uk/index...icle&id=80:ems&catid=38:equine-info&Itemid=67

and a key quote from it:

"Obesity, as a direct result of excessive calorie intake, is the primary cause of insulin resistance in horses (as with people). It is now known that fat cells can produce a wide range of hormones and inflammatory mediators. These hormones down-regulate the sensitivity of tissues to insulin, which is a normal body function. However, if they are produced by larger than normal deposits of fat, their down-regulatory action is too much for the body to cope with and insulin resistance occurs. The excessive production of inflammatory mediators by the fat tissue also leads to a constant state of low grade inflammation. "

And another easily readable summary from Dengie:

http://www.dengie.com/pages/dengie-...naging-a-horse-or-pony-prone-to-laminitis.php

Sadly, a big part of the problem is that owners do not always recognise when their animal is overweight. A WHW survey found the following:

"Despite being a nation of animal lovers, over half of the people surveyed either could not recognise an overweight horse or if they did, had no idea of the dire health or welfare implications to the animal. This compares to over three quarters of the people surveyed who believed being underweight was a threat. In addition, according to other research by the charity, between 35 - 45% of UK horses are believed to be overweight or obese."

Link is here:

http://www.worldhorsewelfare.org/information/latest-news?view=show&content_id=3185

So please don't be complacent about the 'pleasantly plump' or 'comfortably cuddly' pony in your paddocks - it is not a cosmetic or aesthetic issue, but a serious health one. You really don't want this to happen to your horse/pony:

Health_laminitis.jpg


severe-acute-laminitis.png
 
Thank you for posting this, there really needs to more awareness about obesity in horses, it really is a welfare issue.

One of my biggest pet hates is seeing overweight horses with overweight riders on top of them and the riders thinking because they are "bigger"!!! Really grinds my gears.

Oh and just for the record i no issue with any person riding a horse, just make sure its fit and healthy before you get on it , you wouldn't ride an emaciated horse after all
 
It is a big hate of mine to see fat horses. I used to be at a yard where a lady had 2 ponies and they were stupidly obese and were always getting laminitis. However many people told her they were fat she would just reply that she had horses for 30yrs and that they were fine. I also ride a horse at work that is obese and I get embarrased to hack it out as I feel everybody is looking at me
 
I totally agree with you. I see far too many ponies that are far too fat, with big shoulders and large crests - laminitis waiting to happen. Is this a current fad? Is it something to do with the type of feeds that are produced these days? I don't know, but if they were mine, they would be on a strict diet!
 
The worst is when you see these fat horse/ ponies and they're being fed haylage and hard feed. :eek:

Am I right in thinking as well that when a TB or other similar breeds put on weight it's closer to the internal organs therefore causing a bigger health risk than a native pony as they carry excess weight in their crest?
 
Good post and I totally agree. It's a shame some show judges can't appreciate this though. It would make a huge difference to attitudes if obese ponies were marked down rather than rewarded. Fat does not equal good conformation!
 
What about the seasons? For example, if you have a veteran pony living out in winter with little or no rugging, then personally I'd like them to be holding a bit of weight, but obviously not cellulite wobbling!. As we come out of winter they have hopefully got to the stage where they show some ribs, setting them up well for the new grass that's coming through. I admit that the approach might be a bit different if your horses live out 24/7/365 as mine do.
Somewhere recently I posted two photos that illustrate how I like this to look on my little veteran gelding.
 
My 3y.o is massive, but we have tried a lot to try and keep her weight down. She's half connie and just has to look at grass and she puts on weight! The paddocks are very lush but short of bringing her in to the winter paddocks (which she wouldn't like as she'd be on her own and the other horses down the road) I'm at a loss. She's half connie and carries it all in her crest and looks like a stallion! We tried strip grazing her, she has no respect for electric fencing and learnt to put her foot on the bottom wire and duck through, or trotted up to it and just popped over no matter how big you made it. Managed to get all muzzles off. When put in the starvation paddock (which tbh still has grass on it) she lifted the gate off its hinges with her shoulder, jumped over and got to grass the other side! I am thinking of putting a cap on the hinges to stop her getting through and shutting her in starvation - only thing is it would separate her from the other mares and they've all just settled down. Grr, bloody mare, if only she was old enough to work!
 
I often look at old hunting pictures and any old pic of horses or photos and wow what a difference to todays....a bit like people there is no difference.

The same can be applied to humans!
 
Tinypony said:
What about the seasons? For example, if you have a veteran pony living out in winter with little or no rugging, then personally I'd like them to be holding a bit of weight, but obviously not cellulite wobbling!. As we come out of winter they have hopefully got to the stage where they show some ribs, setting them up well for the new grass that's coming through. I admit that the approach might be a bit different if your horses live out 24/7/365 as mine do.
Somewhere recently I posted two photos that illustrate how I like this to look on my little veteran gelding.
Click to expand...

Trouble is, I think many people have forgotten the principle of them losing a bit over winter, so they go into winter a bit chunky, then get rugged up to the eyeballs, stuffed with all the feed under the sun because they 'mustn't drop a gram', then spring comes and they just get even fatter!

Good post OP.
 
I wholeheartedly agree that so many horses are over weight.

I let one of mine get a bit more than 'cuddly' to my regret and have taken steps to resolve this along with getting those only slightly cuddly to loose weight too. I have to say it has been extra work for me and I do think this is a factor for many owners. Restricting grazing and keeping a horse moving is still not an option in many liveries, no tracks, no grass free areas so owners are left with stabling as a big part of weight loss which is also not good for the horses metabolism as well as making weight loss and weight maintainance more difficult.
Leaving out much of the movement part causes the need to restrict forage intake which leads to possible colic and behavioural problems if the balance of forage intake isn't right. Of course us exercizing the horse is a huge aspect too but I am of the belief that continuous exercise is vital as well.We need to look what happens to couch potato humans over the years and horses are designed to move much more than humans in their day to day lives.

I believe changing management practices is a big way of helping owners keep on top of weight and other problems long periods of stabling cause. Out in a field 24/7 is fab if the grass is ok for that individual horse but sadly many of us don't live in areas where the field is a true paradise no matter how nice it looks.
 
excellent post, fat ponies and horses are a real bugbear of mine, far too many of them where i livery, 3 minis that are insulin resistant, 4 ponies that are borderline obese , but it's 'ok' because they are being strip grazed:rolleyes:
most of them think i am awful because i don't rug up to the eyeballs in winter, don't feed them bucketfuls of hard feed when they're not working and lord forbid i actually used a grazing muzzle on daughters old pony:eek:
i have one very good doer who i am constantly battling with, i'm angry with myself because the recent rain gave us a flush of grass and his crest has gone rock hard, i should have got him off the grass but i didn't:o
 
Totally agree TGM.

I spend my life trying to keep my incredibly good doer's weight down yet I regularly get snarky comments from other people at the yard that I don't feed him enough, about how much he'd love to have nice big hard feeds, that soaking hay is unnecessary (ie, going overboard), and asking why I don't put more rugs on him (because keeping him cooler means he doesn't put weight on).

I can't stand seeing fat horses, too many associated health problems.
 
we sold a gorgeous little shetland mare to a friend on the same yard as a companion. could be ridden but was mainly for the girl's horse. she was a bit 'mm' to consider but it was fine for a little while. we moved yards, she moved yards and got pregnant had a kid and didn't go up the yard.
both horse and shettie were on lush grass without management and the shettie who had been slim and healthy all her life got stupidly fat and laminitis so severe she should have been put down-we were told by a close friend.
however, she know has to spend her life in a stable or on a concrete yard-what kind of life is that for a pony?
both of them have been sold now but are still at that yard. thankfully their new owner isn't so stupid.

my mare got very overweigt recently-she was a healthy weight for a 17 hand horse! however she's been on strict diet and ribs can be seen/felt again.
 
Having three overweight ponies, 2 A's and a shetland who suffered laminitis last year, I cannot tell you how much of a headache feeding and exercise is. I managed to get my Shetland down to a super weight (he had ribs, withers, no crest) was out with a muzzle all day and on a very small soaked haynet at night. Muzzle was removed mid June and already he has balooned (paddock is incredibly bare) so the diet is back on. My other two are also a struggle to keep weight off - all are kept on the bare paddock and only the one A in at night on soaked hay. All get the tiniest hard feed to get all the nutrients they need. All three looked brilliant early spring and were a great weight. I often wonder if people realise just how hard these natives are to manage!
 
Good post! Glad other people think the same as me - you start to believe that you are a crual hard hearted b**ch when you don't rug up to the eye balls, exercise your horse every day (BIG SHOCK) and turn it out as much as possible on to ok ish grazing so that it shifts it's arse and does some walking!

My PET hate is seeing fat horses with rugs on, but with NOTHING to eat...not good....
 
I had to take action when my horse got laminitis in 2009 - too late I know! Previously he had been out 24/7 on short grass and fed hay on top in the winter...I was always pleased that I only ever had him in a light medium weight rug in winter and he was exercised every day during the spring and summer and then at weekends in winter time.
But the weight had crept on and I did too little too late. Luckily his laminitis came right but it was a hard lesson to learn and terrible to see my lad suffer.

He now has a complete change of routine where he is in at night all year round, on a bare but good sized paddock in the day, same exercise, but rationed hay at night and no extra hay in the day...he has to wander round and nibble bits. No rug last winter at all even when minus 10! I still struggle to keep the weight off but he is slimmer than he ever has been. He has no treats at all...no fruit, nothing. Last winter he grew the best coat ever and was always warm despite my fears he would be found in an icicle!
 
My vet told me you should be able to feel their ribs(I dont mean see but just lightly feel them). He is quite blunt about horses being fat and I thnk most probably are..got the impression they are fed up seeing it!
 
Out of interest, what would you advocate for horses that put on weight just by looking at grass?? The obvious things are ridden work, no hard feed or hay in addition to the grass, but there are some horses that seem to balloon just on natural grazing. A few people talk about keeping horses in for half the day or more with nothing to eat, but that worries me if there is nothing going through their stomachs for a lot of the day.
 
Nudibranch said:
Good post and I totally agree. It's a shame some show judges can't appreciate this though. It would make a huge difference to attitudes if obese ponies were marked down rather than rewarded. Fat does not equal good conformation!
Click to expand...

^^^^^ This^^^^^^^

My Sec A always gets put down the order because he 'needs more cover' regardless of the fact that he's perfectly behaved and not a 'fat' pony that need to be dragged into the trot up.

I am lucky as he doesn't need his grazing restricted as he seems to work off his calories but I wouldn't hesitate in putting him in a muzzle or 'starvation patch' if it was in his best interest.
 
I know it sounds wierd, and don't take me as an authority on this, but I think sometimes with the good doers you need to feed them something, but it needs to be the right thing. My pony ballooned when her hard feed was cut out and she was on sparse grass. On returning to more grass and re-starting her daily mug of Top Spec Anti Lam with a handful of chaff she deflated considerably in a week. They will balloon up if there is an inbalance in their intake. Jacke J A Taylor of The Metabolic Horse can be an interesting person to speak to about this.
 
Brilliant post TGM. I completely agree.

Having had many good-doers I understand how hard it can be to keep weight off but there is no excuse for obesity in horses. It is absolutely disgusting.
 
Saratoga said:
Out of interest, what would you advocate for horses that put on weight just by looking at grass?? The obvious things are ridden work, no hard feed or hay in addition to the grass, but there are some horses that seem to balloon just on natural grazing. A few people talk about keeping horses in for half the day or more with nothing to eat, but that worries me if there is nothing going through their stomachs for a lot of the day.
Click to expand...

I currently have two good doer ponies in a 'dieters strip' which is a long thin strip sectioned off from the rest of the field. The slightly better grazing and the natural shelter is at the far end of the strip and the water is the opposite end by the gate, which encourages them to move around a lot in the field. If they have to be in at any time they have some soaked hay that is double-netted - I find double-netting makes it last much, much longer and the soaking removes some of the sugar content. I have also used muzzles on both of them at times, and this is a good solution if the animals are kept in a livery yard where separate grazing is not available.
 
Added to that, the vast majority of owners have no idea what a condition IS. The number of 'OMG this horse is emaciated. You shouldn't be riding it' posts about horses who are in fact just thin with no muscle. Or the 'before and afters' when they start with a nice, lean but unmuscled horse and fatten it up is depressing.

People get used to seeing rounded well-covered horses (what most would call 'good condition' )when in fact the horse SHOULD be lean and angular if they're not in work to have muscle.

I have a horribly good doer and would LOVE him to come out of winter skinny and angular. I managed it 2yrs ago but he held too much weight this year :(
 
nikCscott said:
^^^^^ This^^^^^^^

My Sec A always gets put down the order because he 'needs more cover' regardless of the fact that he's perfectly behaved and not a 'fat' pony that need to be dragged into the trot up.

I am lucky as he doesn't need his grazing restricted as he seems to work off his calories but I wouldn't hesitate in putting him in a muzzle or 'starvation patch' if it was in his best interest.
Click to expand...
I've asked a question on another Forum about top line v 'fat' top line and there is a huge difference it seems. Perhaps some judges are muddling top line and 'cover' with fat?
I don't think being able to feel the ribs is a good guide on it's own. I can feel the ribs of a pony I'm dieting but she is still imo fat or should I say overweight. WHW body scoring is a much better way to go I believe. I know my lot all carry any excess fat in different places on their bodies.

Mta following TGM's last post. Since I've been soaking hay for, ended up being all, mine I have been amazed how much less they eat when that is the only forage they get. I wonder if the sugar effect of wanting to eat more starts to fall when they get a consistantly low sugar intake. I haven't found this effect with a mixed regime in the past interestingly. Just musing. I know if I start eating sweets i want more and more... lol
 
Last edited by a moderator:
I do agree with the sentiment of this. However it is very difficult when you are in a herd situation. I have two very good doers (one of whom I've just loaned out). The other is an ex SJ mare who must have spent all her life on a diet - in 20 hours, limited hay, no hard feed etc. I do feel really sorry for her and suspect that in the wild all the herd would have fat scored differently anyhow. She's coming back from stud tomorrow and I fully expect her to be the size of a house - she was last time.

My loanee phoned me with great delight to say she'd got my horse down to 575Kg which is great but neither horse showed any laminitic tendancies over the last 3 years so suspect there is more to this. What makes me really really mad is seeing horses in starvation paddocks filled with buttercups (highly toxic) which they end up eating.
 
My two native non-ridden ponies are on starvation padock 24/7 from about April till November. The paddock appears bare, butr if they come off for a day or two its amazing to see how quickly it greens up, therefore they are grazing something. That said they also have a net of oat straw morning and evening to keep their fibre intake up and have a mineralised salt lick. I wouldnt say they are an ideal weight, but are not obese.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top