Wobblers

[Tegan]

Hi

Please can you post your experiences of horses with Wobblers. We have a 4 year old with grade 2 wobblers. Hoping she will be comfortable as a companion (although hugely disappointed as she was meant to be for my mum to ride).Do you feed any supplements? I have read that vitamin E can help.

Thanks
Tegan

 

[Meowy Catkin]

My old mare had a foal who was diagnosed with wobblers around the time he was backed. Sadly he deteriorated rapidly and was PTS.

 

[Dream19]

Yes, we bred a foal, backed him and within a few months he developed wobblers, field rested but he deteriorated and had to be put down.

 

[RutlandH2O]

I have a 5 year old pure Shire gelding (my breeding), who was diagnosed as a high grade 3 wobbler at 12 months of age. He presented with acute ataxia and was barely able to walk. After performing several physical tests on the colt, my vet initially gave him a steroid injection and arranged X-rays to be taken within a few days (he wasn't stable enough for radiographs at first). The X-rays confirmed a narrowing at C5 or 6, can't remember. I was given two choices: PTS or, because of his tender age, entering into a stringent routine of daily weighed hay, based on a percentage of his body weight, and vitamin E supplement...nothing more. I chose the latter. He was kept in our 45' x 90' pole barn, in a space of 45' x 30', for 3 1/2 months. He was able to interact with my other horses over the divide, but was, initially, too ataxic to socialise. His appetite was unaffected by his condition, and his was ravenous. I think the strict adherence to his diet was the most difficult thing for me. He finished every last morsel of hay, which was weighed out in the morning and offered to him in small increments over 24 hours. His feet were not trimmed during his confinement for fear of his falling over onto the farrier. He dragged his feet because of a lack of proprioception, that is, wobblers don't know where their feet are. After 3 1/2 months, I had decided to have him PTS, despite his improvement. The JCB digger was due to arrive on a Wednesday morning, just before the vet was due. I got a call from the digger driver at 9am, saying that he had an emergency and had to go to a burst water main, and could he come on Saturday. I told him I'd ring the vet. When I spoke to the vet, she asked if she could come and see the colt that morning. When she arrived she had me walk the colt in wide circles to the right and left, and then in small circles, right and left. When I had finished and removed his head collar, the vet stood there looking at me with a very broad smile. She said she had never seen a wobbler improve two grades. My OH asked what she would do with the colt if he were her horse. She asked me if he would be ridden or driven, to which I said never. She said she would have his feet trimmed ASAP, have him gelded, and take it one day at a time. I told her I would keep him as a field ornament and pet for the rest of his days. The farrier came the next morning and trimmed his feet. The colt was so stable, the farrier let his apprentice trim his last foot. A few weeks later I had him gelded, and the rest is history. To see him trot across the field is always such a treat. He moves effortlessly and has great reach and drive. The vet said that the success of the strictly restricted diet was due primarily to his age. She said had he been a year or two older, the reduced food intake wouldn't have had such an effect because he would have had that much more growth during that time, which would have put more pressure on his spine.

I don't know what to say regarding your 4 year old. How is she affected? Does she trip and/or fall over? What has your vet suggested?

 

[Meowy Catkin]

Wow RH2O - I'm so glad that it worked out for your boy.

 

[khalswitz]

A yard I worked at had a horse diagnosed with grade 3 wobblers. They decided to let her have the summer on the grass, to be companion to a young horse before being pts. I witnessed her fall when cantering across the field on two different occasions, but my concerns weren't heeded.

There was then a horrible situation where the young horse came down with severe colic. She ended up being pts, but the wobblers horse was so distraught that she was trying to rear. She actually ended up falling down on top of me as I tried to restrain her.

She couldn't get up again so we ended up ptsing her where she went down after sedating her to get me out.

It was horrific, and to be honest I personally now would never keep a horse with severe wobblers going after that.

 

[Nugget La Poneh]

There is life after prognosis for some horses, and yes I believe in America they have found success with very high doses of Vit E in terms of making a horse a happy hacker. Grade 2 is not as bad as it could be, and I have heard of cases where the horse has appeared to grow out of it, making it possible a slightly over egged diagnosis was given.
I would just read and read and read some more about it. Some breeds are seemingly more prone.

 

[cptrayes]

My horse was ten before it showed, when he went very ataxic, but he was born with a narrowing of c3 and misalignment with c4.

He wasn't safe to be with other horses and I had him put down.

 

[Cortez]

I have bred a wobblers colt and had him put down as a yearling when he started falling when trying to play with the other colts. He was the most beautiful colt and it was terrible to see him struggle to keep up with the others. I would PTS on diagnosis if it ever happened again.

 

[RutlandH2O]

Thanks, Faracat.

Tegan: There are many articles, by vets and researchers, on the American website, thehorse.com. There is also the magazine, theHorse. It is free to join the website and you will have access to over 14,000 articles, papers, interviews on subjects regarding equine health, welfare, news. In the 4 years since my experience with my Shire, there has been more research into wobblers, more correctly referred to as CVCM (cervical vertebral compressive myelopathy). Since the majority of equine-related research is done on Thoroughbreds (big money/big business/big numbers of horses), there have been recent studies published, July, 2013, iirc, describing young Thoroughbreds with clinically and radiographically diagnosed wobblers, that have gone on to race, successfully. I must reiterate: the operative word here is 'young.' Also, the position of the compression of the spine must be taken into account. My vets at Oakham, in Rutland, gave me great support. It was their professional evidence and anecdotal-based opinions that led to my decision to adopt the 'starvation' regimen for my boy. Perhaps it was the-right-thing-at-the-right-time in his case. My gelding lives with my other 5 year old gelding. They share their fields and live together in the pole barn in winter. They play, they gallop, they cavort even now, at over 18h1" each. Neither of them is ridden or driven. If I had seen any incidents of falling or tripping, a post about my 5 year old previous wobbler wouldn't exist.

I have dear friends in Brittany who own a jenny donkey that was diagnosed with wobblers as a yearling. My friends were very careful with her weight, and while she did fall over and trip on a regular basis, she had only an aged horse as a companion, so there was no stimulus for her to race about recklessly. It has been 6 years since her diagnosis. I went to visit them last month, and seeing the jenny, there were no indications that anything was amiss. Again, she is not ridden or driven, and leads a very quiet, passive life with another ancient donkey companion. My friends said she hasn't tripped or fallen in several years. Perhaps the situation was right for her to grow out of the condition. I'm certainly not advocating the preservation of all wobblers. I have only posted my experience as asked for by the OP.

 

[Tegan]

Thanks for your replies. It is good to hear other experiences and I will have a read of the recommended articles. Her problem is at C3. She is a trotter cross and has always had an unusual gait but recent lameness caused us to investigate further. As I understand it she is too old for a chance of success with a restricted diet. Our vet has said that we could hack her as long as she isn't tripping but we have decided not to risk it. She does occasionally fall in the field whilst playing with my other horse and generally just gets back up and carries on. However she did get injured last winter. My feeling is that whilst she is happy in herself and not coming in from the field injured to keep her as a companion until she shows signs of being uncomfortable.

 

[DD265]

I have a slightly different story.

My boy was diagnosed with wobblers in 2010. He was 18 at the time. Now at 22, it would be unusual to notice anything amiss. I also got back on board last summer although we're yet to have truly regular work (nothing to do with wobblers). I wasn't given a grade, but it was his C5 I believe, caused by arthritic changes. The reason I picked something up at all was that we were trotting at the back of a ride and he just got slower and slower - not normal. We rested him but I walked him out inhand and noticed that he'd put a foot down then jerk as if it were in the wrong place so I got the vet who then referred us for xrays. The vets at Leahurst said to try box resting him and take him back in 3 months. After a couple of weeks box rest he deteriorated badly so I insisted on turnout in the arena. He began to improve, when the weather permitted I walked him out inhand and honestly the movement did him the world of good. He was turned out in the April and has gone from strength to strength since.

We're now facing PPID/ESM so probably going to test for that this month (honestly he's the most high maintenance native I've ever met!) but in terms of wobblers... I'm not convinced he's ataxic at all. We do take precautions; knee boots for all hacking, brushing boots for all rides and over reach boots for lateral work/jumping (yes, we jump! Only like 1ft though and only if he's up for it). I also do TTeam Body Wrap type exercises to try and improve his proprioception. He is turned out daily all year round, and if I haven't done anything with him in a few days I'll walk him inhand to get him going. He definitely benefits from as much movement as possible. Maybe it was a virus that caused the issue, I won't be taking him back to re-xray so we probably won't find out.

If she isn't currently a danger to herself and you can afford to keep her as a companion, do so and see what happens.

 

[RutlandH2O]

If she isn't currently a danger to herself and you can afford to keep her as a companion, do so and see what happens.

My thoughts precisely.

 

[Elbie]

I think if they are a yearling the chances of success with restricted diet and strict monitoring can be quite good.

I work in equine insurance and see a variety of cases. You get the ones where they start as a grade 1, then deteriorate to a 4/5 in a matter of days, the ones where they go from being fine to grade 3/4 almost overnight and then the ones which are a grade 2 and don't get better or worse.

As others have said, if she isn't a danger to herself at the minute I would definitely wait to see what happens

 

[5bs]

Mine was five PTS on diagnosis.

 

[AmyMay]

She does occasionally fall in the field whilst playing with my other horse and generally just gets back up and carries on. However she did get injured last winter. My feeling is that whilst she is happy in herself and not coming in from the field injured to keep her as a companion until she shows signs of being uncomfortable.

Sorry Tegan, that makes no sense.

 

[minimex2]

My 10yr horse and best friend was diagnosed with wobblers. Was given a course steriod jabs. Once diagnosed only me and an experienced yard friend would deal with him in fear of anyone getting hurt. Some days id ride and he'd rip my arms out of sockets to go. some days he couldnt get down the track. After two bad espisodes within 2 weeks and 100 steriods a day i made the decision a day too soon was better than a day too late. He was my first horse (at age of 40) and my best friend and a very proud boy. i didnt want him going down and not being able to get up. xx

 

[Gleeful Imp]

My 5 year old was diagnosed with wobblers, this was 10 years ago and I know diagnosis and treatment has moved on. He was pts on the advice of the vet at lea hurst, after running dye through his spinal cord to see the extent of the problem was. The biggest issue for me was that he was frightened, and I couldn't let him suffer. X

 

[cptrayes]

Thanks for your replies. It is good to hear other experiences and I will have a read of the recommended articles. Her problem is at C3. She is a trotter cross and has always had an unusual gait but recent lameness caused us to investigate further. As I understand it she is too old for a chance of success with a restricted diet. Our vet has said that we could hack her as long as she isn't tripping but we have decided not to risk it. She does occasionally fall in the field whilst playing with my other horse and generally just gets back up and carries on. However she did get injured last winter. My feeling is that whilst she is happy in herself and not coming in from the field injured to keep her as a companion until she shows signs of being uncomfortable.

1. Horses which know that they can't run of they need to live in a permanent state of stress whether you can see it or not.

2. How guilty are you going to feel on the morning that you go out to the field and find her down and unable to get up with a huge balls patch in the grass all around her where she has tried and tested all night until she was exhausted. This is a REAL possibility, not an exaggeration.

3. Unless your friend is being what she wants to hear, or the vet is unaware of the horse falling in the field, then be wants shooting for suggesting that you put your lives in danger by riding this horse.

 

[cptrayes]

Thanks for your replies. It is good to hear other experiences and I will have a read of the recommended articles. Her problem is at C3. She is a trotter cross and has always had an unusual gait but recent lameness caused us to investigate further. As I understand it she is too old for a chance of success with a restricted diet. Our vet has said that we could hack her as long as she isn't tripping but we have decided not to risk it. She does occasionally fall in the field whilst playing with my other horse and generally just gets back up and carries on. However she did get injured last winter. My feeling is that whilst she is happy in herself and not coming in from the field injured to keep her as a companion until she shows signs of being uncomfortable.

1. Horses which know that they can't run if they need to live in a permanent state of stress whether you can see it or not.

2. How guilty are you going to feel on the morning that you go out to the field and find her down and unable to get up with a huge bald patch in the grass all around her where she has tried and tried to stand up all night until she was exhausted? This is a REAL possibility, not an exaggeration.

3. Unless your friend is hearing what she wants to hear, or the vet is unaware of the horse falling in the field, then he wants shooting for suggesting that you put your lives in danger by riding this horse.

I'm sorry to be so blunt, but I think your love for the horse is preventing you from hearing what most people on this thread are saying.

 

[cptrayes]

Just in case anyone is in doubt, the term 'wants shooting' in the above post is a figure of speech, possibly unwise, that I am too late to edit.

 

[DD265]

1. Horses which know that they can't run if they need to live in a permanent state of stress whether you can see it or not.

2. How guilty are you going to feel on the morning that you go out to the field and find her down and unable to get up with a huge bald patch in the grass all around her where she has tried and tried to stand up all night until she was exhausted? This is a REAL possibility, not an exaggeration.

3. Unless your friend is hearing what she wants to hear, or the vet is unaware of the horse falling in the field, then he wants shooting for suggesting that you put your lives in danger by riding this horse.

I'm sorry to be so blunt, but I think your love for the horse is preventing you from hearing what most people on this thread are saying.

I do agree with you - I think you have to take each case on face value and be objective which we all know is hard when it comes to our beloved horses. I was exceptionally lucky with my boy because his case was so mild and easily improved but as this thread shows the majority don't have the same options that I did.

 

[Tegan]

Thanks for your replies. I should have been clearer about the falls. The falls in the field we have seen were as a 2 yr old and before the diagnosis when she slipped charging around. She is now 4 and I haven't seen her fall or any signs or a fall recently. However she did come in from the field injured last winter and we do not know happened. She was not muddy so it didn't look like she had fallen.

We will be keeping her as a companion until she shows any signs of deteriorating in which case she will be PTS.

 

[cptrayes]

The falls at two will probably be related. Narrowing at C3 is congenital, she will have been born with it. I am so glad no-one is going to try and ride her.

Please bear the expression in mind if her condition progresses 'better a week too soon than a day too late'

I hope she has many happy days.