Worming 7month filly?

[L&B]

I hope this is in the right place...
I am the proud new owner of a gorgeous 7mo filly and was wanting some advice on on worming her.

I am told by her breeders she has had a dose of noromectin two weeks ago.
My plan (as per vet advice) was going to be in another 3weeks a second dose of noromectin.
Then 5weeks after that a dose of panacur.
Then in 5weeks after that equest pramox.

How does that sound?
The vet then said to have an egg count taken and put her on a a regular worming routine as per other horses on the yard?
Of course I trust my my vet but I'm just gathering the opinions of others

 

[Maesfen]

Personally, I would do a 5 day course of Panacur Guard followed immediately by a tapeworm one, leave for a month and then start with Equest as I'm not a fan of Pramox for anything at all but especially under a year old; it's just too strong. But that's me, I'm sure you'll get other replies (all differing!)

 

[Fuzzypuff]

My horse didn't react well to Pramox so I will never use it again - I searched online and found a lot of people had even worse problems than me! I especially wouldn't give it to a youngster.

 

[Buddy'sMum]

I'd use Panacur (fenbendazole) rather than Noromectin (ivermectin) as the major worm to worry about in foals is roundworm and there is some roundworm resistance to ivermectin. And worm count every 8 weeks to check all ok.
Wouldn't worry about tapeworm in a foal that age.

 

[L&B]

Personally, I would do a 5 day course of Panacur Guard followed immediately by a tapeworm one, leave for a month and then start with Equest as I'm not a fan of Pramox for anything at all but especially under a year old; it's just too strong. But that's me, I'm sure you'll get other replies (all differing!)

Thankyou for the advice all. Maesfen, can you recommend one for tapeworm? And when you say 'immediately' treat with a a tapeworm one, do you mean after the 5days? No waiting 4-5weeks?
Thankyou in advance

 

[Maesfen]

I use the Equitape one as it's one syringe so no faffing and I was always told to follow on the day after with the tapeworm dose but it would depend on how healthy the foal is TBH, if you think she's under parr then I'd leave it a couple of weeks until she's picked up again. You could worm count before the routine worming starts to get some idea of what you need to use too but whatever, with a youngster, it is important to keep on top of worming correctly to ensure a healthy future for the foal.

 

[L&B]

I use the Equitape one as it's one syringe so no faffing and I was always told to follow on the day after with the tapeworm dose but it would depend on how healthy the foal is TBH, if you think she's under parr then I'd leave it a couple of weeks until she's picked up again. You could worm count before the routine worming starts to get some idea of what you need to use too but whatever, with a youngster, it is important to keep on top of worming correctly to ensure a healthy future for the foal.

Yeh, this is exactly my worry. I want want to get it right and whilst I am waiting on egg count results I hate the idea of something festering. Also, she cannot go out until she's Wormed
I have just read some horror stores on here mind, about impaction of roundworms and the panacur causing horrific blockages. So maybe I should have a count done. Hmmm.. .

 

[soloequestrian]

I'm in the same situation with a 6 month old foal. I think she was wormed with ivermectin by the breeder, but not totally sure. I'm lucky in that I can do my own egg counts, and have found that (oddly for this time of year) she had a reasonable burden of redworm but no visible roundworm. I'm going to worm her with Embotape, which is a cheap version of Pyratape. It will treat roundworm, redworm and in a double dose, tapeworm. I had a good search on the net and the most up to date information I could find recommended treating them as adults from six months on ie worm egg count and then dose accordingly. I may give something that should treat encysted redworm in the spring, but I don't trust benzimidazole so it will have to be Equest, which I'm also a bit iffy about because it is stored in body tissues. I don't actually want my foal to be 'too clean' - I want her to develop a healthy resistance to parasites. My adults are counted several times per year and then wormed once in the autumn for tapeworm, assuming their other counts are reasonable (not necessarily zero!). I will count the foal every month for a while until I get to know her pattern of infection. Don't know if that helps much, but I would always rely on egg counts. Vets are not necessarily always up to date with worming practise - you'd be better to discuss with one of the companies that do counts for instance Westgate or Intelligent Worming.

 

[Silverfire]

As Maesfen said you need to worm for encysted redworm now if you haven't already, especially with this mild wet weather. Encysted redworm do not show up in worm counts. And 6 month old foals can die of encysted redworm even if they have been wormed often if they haven't been treated with panacur 5 day or equest.

 

[soloequestrian]

And 6 month old foals can die of encysted redworm even if they have been wormed often if they haven't been treated with panacur 5 day or equest.

How? The most likely means that encysted redworm will cause disease is when they emerge en mass in the springtime. This means that the anti-encysted-redworm treatment can take place before then. I'd be very surprised if a foal that had been wormed prior to wintertime would have a large encysted burden anyway. I don't understand why people still place so much faith in benzimidazole (the five day guard) for redworm when there are such high levels of resistance to it.

 

[Maesfen]

I'd be very surprised if a foal that had been wormed prior to wintertime would have a large encysted burden anyway. I don't understand why people still place so much faith in benzimidazole (the five day guard) for redworm when there are such high levels of resistance to it.

Just because you're surprised does not mean it doesn't happen especially in some situations and also, the foal will not have built up any resistance to Panacur Guard either so it is a good one to use for them being gentle - but it works - safely whereas something like Pramox could quite likely cause colic - which it is known it has done many times, just look at the reports on here and this is just the tip of the iceberg, or rather been the cause of colic because of the mass exodus of worms it causes; dire consequences for a young horse.

 

[soloequestrian]

Just because you're surprised does not mean it doesn't happen especially in some situations and also, the foal will not have built up any resistance to Panacur Guard either so it is a good one to use for them being gentle - but it works - safely whereas something like Pramox could quite likely cause colic - which it is known it has done many times, just look at the reports on here and this is just the tip of the iceberg, or rather been the cause of colic because of the mass exodus of worms it causes; dire consequences for a young horse.

Sorry, but that is quite scary. It's not the horse that becomes resistant to the wormer, it's the worms. So a young horse can very easily have a full population of worms that are resistant to benzimidazole. I agree that Panacur is gentle but that's no use if it is totally ineffective. I am also wary of Equest, for the reason you give, so that leaves us all between a rock and a hard place with regard to encysted redworms, and is the reason I would leave as long as possible before giving Equest and would also consider not dosing for encysteds at all if the foal had had a good worming programme during its first summer.

 

[L&B]

Blimey, never have I felt more scared over worming a horse... I dont want anything bad to happen to my girly.
I think I'll just wait 3weeks and do her with panacur 5day. The vet only suggested a second dose of noromectin as they said as I'd not done it I cannot be sure it was done by breeders correctly, but tbh, trust them implicitly.
So my route is a 2-3week wait, panacur 5day and then worm/egg count.
Wish me luck and no colicky /dead foal :/ christ.

 

[Fuzzypuff]

Sorry, but that is quite scary. It's not the horse that becomes resistant to the wormer, it's the worms. So a young horse can very easily have a full population of worms that are resistant to benzimidazole. I agree that Panacur is gentle but that's no use if it is totally ineffective. I am also wary of Equest, for the reason you give, so that leaves us all between a rock and a hard place with regard to encysted redworms, and is the reason I would leave as long as possible before giving Equest and would also consider not dosing for encysteds at all if the foal had had a good worming programme during its first summer.

Exactly, it is the worms that become resistant and not the horse. However mu understanding of using Panacur is that although some worms are resistant it will still kill off some of them, thus putting the horse in a slightly better position even though they may still have worms. Also, if the risk of then giving another stronger wormer is from the reaction when the worms migrate as they die off, then this is reduced if some of the worms have already been killed off, which is why some give the Panacur first followed by a stronger wormer.

However, it is my belief that many of the reactions to wormers come from the chemicals and not from a reaction to the migration of worms, so the above won't prevent this. I would give separate wormers for tapes and encysteds some time apart to help not overload the system with chemicals. I have also given a syringe of Protexin Quick Fix at worming time with excellent results (results were seen within a few hours of giving the first dose, wore off when second dose was late, and seen again after second dose).

 

[soloequestrian]

Exactly, it is the worms that become resistant and not the horse. However mu understanding of using Panacur is that although some worms are resistant it will still kill off some of them, thus putting the horse in a slightly better position even though they may still have worms. Also, if the risk of then giving another stronger wormer is from the reaction when the worms migrate as they die off, then this is reduced if some of the worms have already been killed off, which is why some give the Panacur first followed by a stronger wormer.

However, it is my belief that many of the reactions to wormers come from the chemicals and not from a reaction to the migration of worms, so the above won't prevent this. I would give separate wormers for tapes and encysteds some time apart to help not overload the system with chemicals. I have also given a syringe of Protexin Quick Fix at worming time with excellent results (results were seen within a few hours of giving the first dose, wore off when second dose was late, and seen again after second dose).

That's a good idea! I might use Panacur just this one after all!

 

[dianchi]

Blimey, never have I felt more scared over worming a horse... I dont want anything bad to happen to my girly.
I think I'll just wait 3weeks and do her with panacur 5day. The vet only suggested a second dose of noromectin as they said as I'd not done it I cannot be sure it was done by breeders correctly, but tbh, trust them implicitly.
So my route is a 2-3week wait, panacur 5day and then worm/egg count.
Wish me luck and no colicky /dead foal :/ christ.

Sorry OP seems we all gone off the deep end here!

I have wormed my girl (now rising 3) with panacur and had no problems. I wouldn't use Pramox at all (personal choice but seems very harsh and risk of reaction seems quite high!) I will be worming her with Equest in Feb and she had panacur in Autumn.

Im sure your filly will be fine- although pictures of her so that we can all er check (ooooo and ahhhhhh) her would be good

 

[organic horse]

Congratulations on your new baby!!
I think having a egg count done by your vet was smart. It will give you a better idea of what De-wormer to use based on how many and what kind of eggs are seen.
Since some De-wormers can be more heavy hitting then other De-wormers.
If your baby has a large egg count your vet may recommend a more milder De-wormer so you are killing some of the worms and not all at once and over whelm your baby's intestinal tract which can lead to impaction.
You are essentially De-wormering check egg count De-wormering check egg count, etc. plus you are using different DE-wormers as egg count comes down. You can have a egg count done 12 weeks after the last De-wormer dose.
This is the safest and most effective way to go, that what I did with my 5 month old baby.
She was never wormed by the breeder even though they told me she was.
Her first egg count was 4000 per gram. very high for a small baby. So my vet recommended the milder de-wormer panacur for 5 days and then recheck egg count. He had me alternate between panacur and ivermectin depending on the egg count.
Her egg count continued to come down and even though she had some worms she continued to grow normally and put weight on.
She is now 18 months old and weighs 1050 lbs and is 15.2 hh tall.
She had her last egg count was done a month ago and it was 800 eggs per gram.
My vet told me to give her a heavy hitter De-wormer "Quest" to see if we could get her worm free for good. Because her egg count was only 800 eggs per gram when the De-wormer kills the worms her intestinal tract wouldn't become overwhelmed and get impacted.
She will have another egg count in March, hoping she will be worm free.
Hope this helps
Contributor of horsemoms.com and organichorsesupplements.com

 

[Silverfire]

Some information about how encysted redworm can affect horses (especially foals and yearlings) in Autumn and Spring. You need to be logged in to read it.

 

[L&B]

Sorry OP seems we all gone off the deep end here!

I have wormed my girl (now rising 3) with panacur and had no problems. I wouldn't use Pramox at all (personal choice but seems very harsh and risk of reaction seems quite high!) I will be worming her with Equest in Feb and she had panacur in Autumn.

Im sure your filly will be fine- although pictures of her so that we can all er check (ooooo and ahhhhhh) her would be good

Congratulations on your new baby!!
I think having a egg count done by your vet was smart. It will give you a better idea of what De-wormer to use based on how many and what kind of eggs are seen.
Since some De-wormers can be more heavy hitting then other De-wormers.
If your baby has a large egg count your vet may recommend a more milder De-wormer so you are killing some of the worms and not all at once and over whelm your baby's intestinal tract which can lead to impaction.
You are essentially De-wormering check egg count De-wormering check egg count, etc. plus you are using different DE-wormers as egg count comes down. You can have a egg count done 12 weeks after the last De-wormer dose.
This is the safest and most effective way to go, that what I did with my 5 month old baby.
She was never wormed by the breeder even though they told me she was.
Her first egg count was 4000 per gram. very high for a small baby. So my vet recommended the milder de-wormer panacur for 5 days and then recheck egg count. He had me alternate between panacur and ivermectin depending on the egg count.
Her egg count continued to come down and even though she had some worms she continued to grow normally and put weight on.
She is now 18 months old and weighs 1050 lbs and is 15.2 hh tall.
She had her last egg count was done a month ago and it was 800 eggs per gram.
My vet told me to give her a heavy hitter De-wormer "Quest" to see if we could get her worm free for good. Because her egg count was only 800 eggs per gram when the De-wormer kills the worms her intestinal tract wouldn't become overwhelmed and get impacted.
She will have another egg count in March, hoping she will be worm free.
Hope this helps
Contributor of horsemoms.com and organichorsesupplements.com

Lol, thanks for all the advice guys that's much more settling. Organic horse you've explained it well with the example of your girly.
I have now ordered Panacur 5day and equitape. 4weeks after the equitape I will do a count and go from there... Worming again for anything missed. This seems most sensible as I don't want to overload her gut with something stronger, nor do I want to underdo it and just assume the panacur has worked. I realise to some it may be the long way around but at least I'm not leaving her completely wormy and I will know for certain after about 12 weeks what we're up against without the panic of impaction.

Phoned another vet vet surgery and they said given she has had noromectin ; I could dose immediately with Equest pramox. But I do think that's a bit too much like anthrax for worms to start with.
Here's my girl anyway shes a dot here but don't have any up to date pics on my phone though any excuse to show her off

 

[soloequestrian]

Thanks for the info on redworm damage. The point about small redworm is that they cause damage only when they are present in relatively large numbers. The other redworm mentioned, strongylus vulgaris (large) is really dangerous but thankfully rare now and as far as I know still controlled by all the classes of chemical wormer. There often seems to be disjointed thinking about small redworm though - it would seem odd that any horse with a small redworm burden would have anything other than a small encysted burden, so horses that have been carefully treated should never have potential to suffer the type of condition mentioned in the text.
OP I think you are right to be scared, but probably in a more general way than for your foal in particular. As long as you read and learn and ask lots of people, you are likely to do the right thing. The problem is that there are so many people not doing that - still worming blindly to a time schedule rather than checking which parasites are actually present - that we are highly likely to run out of effective worming chemicals at some point in the not so distant future. That's what scares me anyway. On a positive note, I gave my baby her Embotape in her feed last night and she actually ate it! And she is fine and well this morning! Have been worried about using the syringe with her since I got her and now I don't have to - hooray!