Young Horse above my ability - WWYD?

[rachyblue]

I have a beautiful 3 yr old warmblood, who is freshly backed and as you can imagine, is a typical young wb, very sharp and a bit random.

I've had someone more capable than me schooling him on, and he is going great now, but before that he had me off a couple of times, and I'm hesitant about riding him again. I used to be an ok rider, but had a couple of year gap after my old boy passed away, and he has knocked what little is left of my confidence. I don't think I'll be doing him any favours riding him as I feel he needs someone more confident.

The only problem being I am a soft ****** and am quite attached to him (had him since a yearling) and he is a carebear to handle and very affectionate - in short I love him to bits.

I have several options;

1. Grow a pair, sell him and replace with something more sensible (though I really don't want to sell him).
2. Put him on long term loan, and get myself something more sensible on loan (but who wants to loan a baby?).

I can't really afford to keep two at the same time.

What would you do? I would really prefer not to sell, the ideal would be someone who has "outgrown" their more sensible ned and is after a new challenge, but like me is attached and doesn't want to lose touch. But that never happens in real life

 

[Kokopelli]

Sort of a similar situation to you, when I was 15 going on 16 my grandma very kindly bought me my first horse after years on ponies. He was a cracking 16hh tb x welshie. Competing at elem dressage and jumping foxhunters with his eyes shut. Needless to say we paid a good amount of money for him. He was far too much for me at the time (i'm 5ft and petite) and he was big and chunky and soon realised this and took the mic. We got a lovely lady to ride and sell him for us and we made a big loss but I then got my wonderful boy.

However, if I had him now being a lot more experienced and ballsy I would be soo happy as in a million years I wouldn't be able to afford a horse like him again. In hindsight I should have put him on loan for a few years until I was capable of dealing with him and then found myself a loan horse or buy something cheapish.

I don't think you should jump at selling him if you think in a few years you will be well up to competing him as you may totally regret it like I did.

 

[Wheels]

What I would do is turn him away, he is only 3!

Get yourself a nice safe but forward horse (buy/loan/lease/share or whatever) and get your confidence up a bit and then in a year start working with your horse that you love and a good instructor. If you used to be a good rider then that is still with you, just make everything you do be geared towards getting yourself back on track so you can enjoy your horse

 

[rachyblue]

He is turned away at the moment, but I can't afford livery for two, or I would have another one on loan already, even grass livery is an extra £100+ a month and I doubt he would winter out.

 

[Dubsie]

Could you find a very competent sharer to ride him 2-3 x a week to ensure he remains well schooled by someone confident for a nominal amount, and use that nominal amount to put towards lessons for yourself on him to gain your confidence?

 

[Wheels]

Share then? Or just ask around to try and get rides, any friends who need help etc?

I am talking from experience, I lost my confidence quite badly when something rotten happened to me in my personal life coupled with a few nasty falls. Bought a weanling and took a sensible confidence giver on loan for 6 months then helped a friend out with her more forward horses.

Worked for me, where's there a will & all that

 

[Bestdogdash]

If he were mine, in your situation (and not wanting to sell) I would send him To a nearby reputable professional for a period of 4 - 6 months for basic training and schooling, in the proviso that you went to 'have a lesson' on him once a week. That way he is brought on properly, you will get used to him, gain confidence and take him home sane with a few tips on bringing him on. You can always pop back for top ups when necessary.

I would say though that 3 is very young, especially if he is likely to end up a big guy - why not wait until he is 4 ?

 

[D66]

Pony club website? - swap your professionally schooled prospect for an outgrown school master. Only if your horse is seriously good though.
I was in a similar position - have a wb/tb youngster, fabulous paces, would make a good eventer, - I had her broken to harness and I'm going to do driving trials. She is also broken to ride and I hack her out on my own, still can count canters on one hand! I hope to "not spoil her", so that if she has to be sold she can be schooled on to do anything.

 

[be positive]

I think you would struggle to find anyone capable of bringing him on properly that is prepared to take on a 3 year old when they will not be able to do much this year and not compete until next year when he is 4, if they have the ability and desire they will probably be able to buy one rather than loan, even if it is less quality than yours it will be their asset at the end not something to hand back to the owner.
If they are not good enough your lovely young horse potentially gets spoilt and you are worse off than you are at the moment.

I think I would invest in him in the short term, get some help and see how he settles once he gets more established, which will obviously take time and money, he may then be the horse for you, if not he would be ready to sell and you could go and buy a more suitable horse.

 

[TarrSteps]

I think that's sensible advice from be positive. Unfortunately you will have to spend some money no matter which course of action you end up pursuing, the trick is to spend it most wisely.

I take the minority view (although drawn from experience with many horses and people in similar situations) that not every horse suits every rider, no matter how hard everyone applies themselves and there is no shame - just the opposite - if you decide it's better for both of you to move on.

You are by no means alone! There are posts on here about all sorts of variations on this subject and just the other day I read this http://www.horsejunkiesunited.com/?p=59491 - not quite the same situation but just to let you know that there are lots of people who don't advocate continuing at all costs.

 

[Goldenstar]

It's no fun being and feeling overhorsed however the three year old stage is difficult and often when you are through it they are very different.
I would be tempted to stick with him until he's through this stage then turn him away then as a four year get him back into work with help , then you will get a better idea of who he's going to be if as a four year he's not for you he's a great age to find an excellent home.
You will of course have to spend a bit more on him, while this is going on I would ride every horse you can perhaps consider a share to get you going and take some lessons to work on yourself so you are really ready to ride at the top of your game when he's four.
Good luck I hope it all works about happily what ever you do

 

[Daytona]

I would turn away till he 4, pay a pro to bring him back I to work next year for say a month or two, the you get on and do some gentle hacking and see how you feel about it then, if happy then great, if still green maybe depending on finances keep with pro or at least get lots of help / lessons.

3 is very young to be riding. I'd let him grow.

 

[Daytona]

Ps I was in a similar situation with a 4 year old, 18 months later me and him get on well though I still get alot of professional help. I've also spent a large amount on him being pro schooled, but he is worth it too me and I could afford the investment. Had I not had the money I'd of cut my losses as what else could I'd of done , I'd already had a serious injury and no horse is worth risking your life for.

But my story came good for me so have faith , read some of my old threads , I got some very good advice.

 

[rachyblue]

Thanks all. I will in all likelihood leave him until he is 4, it's just frustrating sometimes that I have the cash to improve him or me, but not both, so I guess he comes first until I can.

Lessons on school horses are great, and sometimes remind me that I can ride, I just struggle to ride him, but something as a loan/share I think is more what I need to get me going again, riding regularly.

He was backed by a pro, and has been schooled on by another, more locally, he has done 12 weeks roughly in total and is currently doing nothing but eating and growing, which is what I'm happy with, but both pro's have advised he has 6 weeks off and then hack him out, but I wonder if I would be better leaving him until next year, but they say he will be too big/strong and not to leave it that long. He should mature out at about 16.2hh, so he isn't exactly a giant and for a hann he is quite lightly built.

Maybe I should give myself (and him) a break and worry about it next year? Try and get a share in the meantime?

 

[weebarney]

I'm in a similar situation as you, got a youngster who I'm feeling overwhelmed with. Everyday I change my mind whether to sell or pay someone to bring him on. I know that in a couple of years time I probably wouldn't be able to afford a horse like him. Somedays I feel like giving up horses completely. If I were you I'd agree with the others who say turn away and then pay someone to get him going again. I don't think his size or strength should be a problem to a good horseman/woman.
Ps he will live out as long as he's warm and got plenty food in his tummy. I've got 2 thoroughbreds who live out all year, one doesn't even have a rug.

 

[BlairandAzria]

Come and ride sully once a week over summer

I think you've had some good advice on here. I remember ludoctro's posts from last year where she was struggling and didn't know what to do with her big talented youngster and now her happy and successful posts recently have shown what a bit of investment / time can do.

I havent seen you both in a while, but I know you think the world of this horse, you just need to find your mojo again - and you absolutely will

 

[rachyblue]

Come and ride sully once a week over summer

Haha am I that obvious? I miss having you to obsess to You'll have to come and see him - I swear he's grown again...

 

[BlairandAzria]

I will come and see you! I'm serious about coming to ride sul, you're more than welcome, might be good to just get some habitual riding in?

I hope you feel honoured I "outed" myself to you"

 

[BlairandAzria]

Darn it stupid phone I hadn't finished!!

I miss our late night chats too

 

[rachyblue]

Haha this is turning into a right soppy love-in

I will definitely come and see/ride Mr Sull, you'll have to own up to where he is now tho

Text me

 

[Kallibear]

He's 3yrs old and most likely only just three. Sounds like he's done a hell of a lot of a slow developing breed. How he is now is very different from how he'll be next year!

Turn him away for a year on cheap livery and save those pennies for schooling next year.

In the meantime find a horse to share/exercise. Either one below your ability where you'll bring it on (and therefore prob not need to pay much) or try and find something more advanced for you to develop your riding (and expect to have to pay more)

 

[LEC]

I would take the pros advise. Sharp horses need work as they just get sharper doing nothing. Gentle hacking in walk is not going to be a detriment to his health. Lunging it into the ground at 4 just to sit on it might be.

I totally agree with Tarr Steps. I have read so many stories on here over the years where riders have struggled on and though they think they have managed to get a horse they can ride they are still never having real fun and often the horse suffers in the process (though all the intentions are good).

I am a fairly sticky rider and yet I can not deal with sharp horses. I do not have the facilities or the time. I am a confident rider because I spend more time on the horse than on the floor.

What are his bloodlines?

 

[TarrSteps]

To clarify, I'm not saying 'definitely sell' I'm saying consider the whole situation and make a sensible choice, not just one based on emotion and what other people think you should do. I don't think it's true that struggling on through always benefits a horse, in fact I see quite a few instances where it very decidedly does not. Sometimes those situations can be reversed but not always.

Not to be mean, Ludoctro, but to the point of the thread, despite all your hard work, willingness to get help and money spent, you have still had two major injuries requiring hospitalisation and resulting in ongoing problems, from your young horse. Great that it's all going better now but that's quite a high cost and one I think people should factor in to their decision making. Yes, injuries happen riding but risk management has to play some part in most people's lives.

Anyway, OP, good luck. Let us know how you get on.

 

[Daytona]

Totally agree Tarrsteps but my first Injury occurred before I knew I'd bought without my means so to me that one does not really count, that was the one that woke me up to the risk of having a young horse and my second one was just a normal fall , something that could happen to anyone. No rider can own a horse and expect never to fall from it , horse riding is a risky sport ESP if you are SJ/XC etc.

OP I think if you have the money to invest you have nothing to lose, get a good pro you trust next year to bring your horse on, watch you ride it. If they turn round and say look this is not the horse for you having seen you riding it and knowing the horse then fine go with there advice

You can't really ever take advice from strangers off the net who don't know you or the horse . The pro would be who I'd listen too and who I did listen too with my issues

The ones I got supported me saying you are good enough for this horse you both just need some help , which I got. Either way I'm pretty sure you will fall off at some point hopefully you won't pick up a injury

I was recently down at a International SJ with my horse for 4 days of training and watch his staff thrown from a youngster a few times in 2 days, no deal was made about it, just dusted themself off and got back on

Horses are dangerous and you take a bigger risk with young ones but I'm sure you knew that before you got the horse.

But me personally I've picked up nasty Injuries on every horse I've ever owned going right back to being a kid but that's because I've always done jumping and things and had points were I've fell off.

I'd go speak to someone who knows you and the horse , it's all well writing on a forum but remember you don't know who replies if they have a clue what they speaking about and also they know nothing about you or horse, it's just there view.

Things in my eyes turned out well for me, my support network of a dressage and SJ pro are happy with my progress and my horses and I look forward to riding my horse and to me that's the main thing. Is that I'm having fun.

 

[kerilli]

tbh it depends totally on the individual horse and on your confidence and competence, which only someone who has eyes on both of you (and can be trusted to have no other agenda, such as "i'd like the ride" or "i'd like to sell her this one instead" etc etc) can advise you on.
what's his breeding? sire and dam's names, not just overall breed. there are certain lines that are known for being easier, and others that are not.
in my experience the thing with high-bred warmbloods is that they are just that much more athletic than average horses, which is of course great when you want it, but not when they use it unasked for, be it just high jinks, or deliberate...
I'd chuck him away for a bit longer, and get some schoolmaster lessons, and an honest appraisal of your abilities. I'd ride as much as you can in the interim, and see how he goes when he is brought back into work.
I'd be very wary of loaning, tbh you'd have to pay well for a good rider to do the work on a young horse which they know they're going to lose the ride on in a year or two, imho, otherwise what is in it for them?

 

[Dukey]

A few months ago I posted on here as I was having the same problem. I have a brilliant 6yo who has a very natural jump, with toe flicks and everything I competed upto Novice BE with my safe and reliable Irish and then had a break of 18months to have a baby. I brought the horse as a not so special four year old but over this winter he has really shown his ability. So much so, I was offered £7k for him by someone who saw him jumping. However, I'm still feeling nervous and a little insecure in my seat etc for feel I let him down when I ride. For example, I have a brilliant professional who schools him and they fly around the Novice fences at my local XC but then I will go up to a 90cm log and he will pull in a stop because Ive taken my leg off
Anyway after getting some advice on here I chose to not sell but stick with it. We are learning together and although he could be doing X, Y and Z with a stronger rider I need him to help me be a stronger rider and together I am sure we'll get there but it might take us a few more years.
Someone said to me that he doesnt care what level he competes at as long as he is being loved, cared for and has fun!
Enjoy you horse, yes he is talented but you will be able to enjoy that talent one day. I won't lie with young horses its a lot of ups and downs, hard work and stress!
Be determined, get professional help and when you come up against a brick wall break it all down and start again.

I always thought that if I sold my boy I would be left with lots of what ifs and if the next horse I brought turned out to be not as good I would be gutted. Take it slow, turn him away and learn to trust him...

 

[xloopylozzax]

Could you find a very competent sharer to ride him 2-3 x a week to ensure he remains well schooled by someone confident for a nominal amount, and use that nominal amount to put towards lessons for yourself on him to gain your confidence?


Just quoting this on my phone so it's a bit messy
Buuuuutttt

This annoys me a little bit- so you want someone to risk injury (more so than on a horse that's going well and isn't 3, I fully appreciate accidents can happen on them all) and bring on your horse knowing full well they arent going to keep the ride even probably next year and PAY for the pleasure?!

Fwiw I think if he's sharp and been ridden by pros you've got 2 options.
I'd keep him ticking over this summer, turn away over winter and start again next year.

If you are having a wobble, leave him now before you teach him any bad habits, or wobble his confidence aswell (very easy with young horses) turn him away, ride something else and re-evaluate next spring.

You can then sell as a 4 year old, professionally broken turned away and ready to be brought on. It would only take about 4-6 weeks schooling livery to get him back sat on and going sweetly and he should sell if he's priced right. Horses are meant to be fun

 

[Daytona]

A few months ago I posted on here as I was having the same problem. I have a brilliant 6yo who has a very natural jump, with toe flicks and everything I competed upto Novice BE with my safe and reliable Irish and then had a break of 18months to have a baby. I brought the horse as a not so special four year old but over this winter he has really shown his ability. So much so, I was offered £7k for him by someone who saw him jumping. However, I'm still feeling nervous and a little insecure in my seat etc for feel I let him down when I ride. For example, I have a brilliant professional who schools him and they fly around the Novice fences at my local XC but then I will go up to a 90cm log and he will pull in a stop because Ive taken my leg off
Anyway after getting some advice on here I chose to not sell but stick with it. We are learning together and although he could be doing X, Y and Z with a stronger rider I need him to help me be a stronger rider and together I am sure we'll get there but it might take us a few more years.
Someone said to me that he doesnt care what level he competes at as long as he is being loved, cared for and has fun!
Enjoy you horse, yes he is talented but you will be able to enjoy that talent one day. I won't lie with young horses its a lot of ups and downs, hard work and stress!
Be determined, get professional help and when you come up against a brick wall break it all down and start again.

I always thought that if I sold my boy I would be left with lots of what ifs and if the next horse I brought turned out to be not as good I would be gutted. Take it slow, turn him away and learn to trust him...

That's exactly how I felt too and how things have turned out for me , I don't believe horse have ambition , and as long as both the rider and horse are happy that's all that matters, very please to hear things worked out for you too, you have to believe in yourself and the horse though I think that's a major factor. Yes people over horse them selfs , often by mistake but with correct support you can learn to ride these horses, not always the case , each one is individual but some do and I'm sure go on to have a lot of success.

OP you ultimately have to decide what's right for you and your horse , hopefully wi the correct input you will make the right choice.

I truly wish you the best of luck

Take pride in how far you have come, and have faith in how far you can go.


Wise words I was once told, not just to do with horses but life in general.

 

[~ Clear Light ~]

Its a tricky one as you need to be totally realistic about your riding abilities. Its easy to think that after a few years training he will be easier for you to ride but often sharp horses are still sharp whether aged 3 or 6 or even older, and need tactful riding.

If you decided to definitely keep him and wanted to be as involved along the way as possible I would pay someone to school him a few times a week rather than send him away hoping he'll come back "fixed" for you. I have found riding owners youngsters in their own surroundings gives the owner so much more confidence to get on and have a sit for even a few minutes at the end. It may take time, but it often provides a better environment for both of you, and as you say you want to be involved with this horse with the aim of taking over the ride. If not the horse is still nicely schooled at the end and you've seen the whole process which is beneficial for you in the future too.

Schooling livery is useful at times, but I love seeing owners excited when we are planning the next session, and they may have some homework to do in between etc so are very much involved. And besides, a 3 or 4 year old shouldn't be schooled more than a few times a week anyway, so you can save your money and lunge or do ground work on the other days, or even have schoolmaster lessons.

Good luck with whatever you decide to do

 

[Bantry]

Just to add that on these sort of threads there's always a lot of talk about "don't worry the horse doesn't know his potential" and "you can learn together" and "its a journey" etc which is true but what about the potential and learning of the rider? A non professional, one/two horse owner can either spend years "on a journey" with a less than suitable horse or they can buy a safer more experienced horse which they, as a rider, can fulfil their potential. There's no shame in wanting to be successful and you don't have to go through the blood, sweat and tears of a young horse. It fine for experienced producers because while they're producing a youngster they'll usually have an older horse which they can compete at a higher level and keep their eye in.

If you consider that it could take 3+ years to bring a 3/4 yr old to BS newcomers or BE novice. The same rider could be confidently competing at that level in 12 months with the right horse and its that sort of experience that would put you in a far better position to produce a young horse next time round. I'm not saying its impossible but if its supposed to be a hobby then its ok to enjoy it and take an easier route!