Youngster still making a fuss about his bit, 6months late WWYD?

[Kallibear]

Roo hates his bit. He accepts having it in because Mummy Said So but he doesn't like it. He's 3.5yrs old ISH who's lightly backed and does a little hacking.

He head shakes and itches at it, spends ages flapping his lips and and generally huffs and puffs over it.

Like thus. First time sat on after a spring of long reining. Mullen mouth this time and a pretty average reaction. He does it regardless of contact or not.

It sounds and looks like he's never worn a bit before but he has, honest. He's been wearing one for over 6months, at least a couple of times a week. He's done all the 'correct' introduction: worn it loads of times, been feed with it in, long reins in it and ridden lightly in it. Yet still behaves like a baby's first time with a bit in.

He's a Spoilt Horse and has a bit collection to make The Bit Bank jealous. Straight, ported, mullen, single jointed, double jointed, even waterford: he's tried them all and is equally distasteful of them. He's currently in a NS Team Up loose ring and isn't much better. I've not yet used a noseband as I'd prefer he chooses to accept it rather than forced.

When asked to do something via the bit (stop, turn etc) he's responsive and don't usually make a fuss unless asked too hard (and therefore perfectly within his rights too!). He's easily distracted (oooo, a leaf. Ooo, a dog. Oooo, my feet) but as soon as he's got a second he's flips his nose about, gurns, yaps and generally makes me feel bad.

In the past I've broken all mine a headcollar and ridden off that for 6months before introducing a bit and never had an issue. Since Roo is destined to be a Proper Horse, he's started off with a bit.

What would you do next? Ignore him and wait for him to get over it? Strap his mouth shut? Tell him off? Let him go bitless until he's grown up a little? He's got such a happy, fun outlook on life that I don't want to ruin it by getting it wrong. I'm currently ignoring it for want of a better plan.

P.s dentist said teeth were fine.

 

[DabDab]

I'm not sure I have any real answer to your question because I've never met one like that, but I am intrigued. If you don't mind me asking for curiosity sake - does he go forwards well? By which I mean, does he move into the contact or back off from it?

 

[Pearlsasinger]

He does look uncomfortable, would you consider having a 2nd dentist opinion?
The only other thing that springs to mind, that you haven't addressed in your OP is the material the bits are made of (and I know you've tried Salox). If the majority of your bits are stainless steel, I'd try a variety of other materials and see how he copes with them. I agree that you really shouldn't strap his mouth shut.

 

[Kallibear]

He doesn't 'search' for a contact but he doesn't back off at all when I taken a light contact and, as he's very forward thinking, he has no hestitation to go forwards and he finds one. He's slightly better with a contact as his mind isn't free to wander quite so much. But as he's three and we mainly hack (due to facilties) so little schooling at the moment, I want/need him to stop faffing about when the reins are loose too!

 

[Kallibear]

He does look uncomfortable, would you consider having a 2nd dentist opinion?
The only other thing that springs to mind, that you haven't addressed in your OP is the material the bits are made of (and I know you've tried Salox). If the majority of your bits are stainless steel, I'd try a variety of other materials and see how he copes with them. I agree that you really shouldn't strap his mouth shut.

Rubber, nathe, metal. All the same. He just doesn't like things in his mouth apparently. He's very very mouthy anyways and chews EVERYTHING and also carries things about. I honestly don't think he's uncomfortable (as in painful) as he's often 'happy' whilst messing about with it (if that makes sense). It's more like the bit's a distraction and an annoyance that he just can't leave alone. I will get the vet to check his teeth again though, under sedation next month when he's vaccinated.

 

[Buds_mum]

Have you done much post reining with him?

Some I have helped break were double tied and left to work on the bit for half hour or more at a time. Daily for a few weeks.

They learn to accept it. Honest.

Daily is the key.

That or a drop/flash to close his gob.

Or both.

 

[Persephone]

Have you tried experimenting with raising/dropping it a hole? Might just be the pic but it looks a little low to me.

Otherwise maybe see about getting a bit expert? To look at it in situ and maybe make suggestions.

Good luck with it

 

[Kallibear]

What's 'post reining'? I've never heard of it. He's done plenty of long reining. Ditto 'double tied'? As in cross tying?

He's done the 'half hour with a bit in daily' for a good few weeks in the spring. He still faffs with it now. He forgets about it for a while then starts again.

 

[snooples]

Have you tried experimenting with raising/dropping it a hole? Might just be the pic but it looks a little low to me.

This is what I was going to say too, it might be worth moving the bit around as what works for one horse might for another!

 

[twiggy2]

looks a tad low in his mouth to me i would raise the bit by a hole each side also raise your halter so that his skin cannot get caught between the 2, then if he was mine i would ride/long rein etc of the halter with the bit in his mouth (no reins) but doing nothing. when he accepts that i would add the rope line to the bit rings but not use them so he can get used to some weight on the bit, again once he settles with that i would start introducing the use of the bit gradually on hacks.

give him plenty of time to accept the bit as you want him to be happy in it. if he is plying with it a lot go for something that is more static either a fulmer fixed ring or an eggbut snaffle both with lozenge and single joint. when she was first backed at 3 my mare was much happier in a single joint not she is 6 and we have progressed to a miler starting bit from a lozenge kk as everything else rubs her fleshy lips.

also rememberathis age his mouth is constantly changing and it may be wise having a dentist or bitting expert as often as every3 months

 

[Buds_mum]

Yeah cross tie them, clip to head collar, through bit rings and leave him to work on it, backwards, forwards.
Although if he's done it all then I would def progress him to a noseband, drop imo.

 

[Kallibear]

looks a tad low in his mouth to me i would raise the bit by a hole each side also raise your halter so that his skin cannot get caught between the 2, then if he was mine i would ride/long rein etc of the halter with the bit in his mouth (no reins) but doing nothing. when he accepts that i would add the rope line to the bit rings but not use them so he can get used to some weight on the bit, again once he settles with that i would start introducing the use of the bit gradually on hacks.

give him plenty of time to accept the bit as you want him to be happy in it. if he is plying with it a lot go for something that is more static either a fulmer fixed ring or an eggbut snaffle both with lozenge and single joint. when she was first backed at 3 my mare was much happier in a single joint not she is 6 and we have progressed to a miler starting bit from a lozenge kk as everything else rubs her fleshy lips.

also rememberathis age his mouth is constantly changing and it may be wise having a dentist or bitting expert as often as every3 months

Thanks. That's a Happy Mouth mullen, his most hated bit so far! It was really hard to get the height right on it. Sitting stationary is wrinkled both sides rather more than I like. Then when he wrinkle up his nose like that and yaps, it hang loose. Sigh. He's not worn it since that day. He's in a NS Team Up now and so far happiest with it fairly snug. I've established he hates no joint and doesn't like a single joint. But having just spent £60 on the Team Up and he's not quite so bad, I'd prefer to stay with that. Have you seen to price of the hanging cheek NS bits?!?!

Is there a noseband attachement anyone can think off that would stablize it a little?

You've suggested exactly what I did with previous horses. I didn't with Roo as he's a Real Horse (as opposed to a fat cob) and felt he needs to be more traditional if he's to do a traditional job (event and hunt). Don't know why really and thinking I may need to rethink.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I certainly wouldn't strap his mouth shut - that would just result in a resentful horse, imo.
The bit could be rather low and I notice you are using a loose ring in the pic, if you haven't already, I would try an eggbutt or fulmer to keep the bit steadier in his mouth.

 

[Costypop]

A friend had a youngster like yours, turned out to be a nerve run just under his gum where the bit sat. Vet said it could be easily operated on but she choose to go bit less with him.

Another horse I've met that was difficult to bit had a broken lower jaw that didn't heal properly, but the reaction to that one was pretty violent at times. Not all the time, took the vet/dentist months to diagnose that one.

 

[Costypop]

As for a stabling noseband you could go for a Worcester noseband or you could try the Rambo mickmel (sp?) bridle with the bit clips

 

[JanetGeorge]

P.s dentist said teeth were fine.

Was that AFTER the 'dentist' had done them?? Because I've never known a 3 year old whose teeth didn't need doing - even if it was JUST sharp edges. The vast majority of mine have had wolf teeth taken out (I see no point in waiting to see if the damn things cause trouble!) and many have had retained caps that needed removing.

 

[NZJenny]

I have a 15 year old who spent most of his life being ridden bitless for endurance. When I retired him from that and started dressage, we had to do the bit thing. Four years later and he still hates it. Yes, he accepts it, but i still get some resistance, a bit of head tossing, chewing, itching etc (sounds like you know the drill !). Trying to strap his mouth shut did no good and his teeth are fine.

I find he is more comfortable in a small bit, rather than a thick one, so I ride him in a bridoon eggbutt snaffle. He also went well in the sprenger double jointed thingy, that I can't rememember the name of. However he goes best in a bitless bridle and if it wasn't for the stupid dressage rules that say you can't compete in one, I would do all my riding in that. I still hack and jump in one.

 

[FfionWinnie]

My mare has now been ridden for 18 months and only now would I say she has accepted a bit in her mouth. When I bought her she was so bad she was bridle lame and she chewed and moved her head constantly. She is a lot better now, jointed bits do not please her at all, I have her in a myler snaffle with a forward shaped port (its not really a port but I don't know what else to call it!). I have spent several hundreds of pounds trying to make her happy. A Micklem bridle, the right shape and type of bit and lots of lunging (draw reins over the back method) and a lot of time is what worked for her. She cannot stand it moving in her mouth and the Micklem does not strap her mouth shut but supports the bit.

 

[HBM1]

My four year old was quite mouthyat first. He had had his teeth done in October 2012, so didn't think teeth could be the problem. I did get them checked again though (July this year) and apparently they were awful. Sharp edges, caps etc. He was much better after. I bought him a Micklem bridle and he loves it.

 

[budley95]

You say he investigates everything with his mouth, have you worked his mouth without a bit in at all? Im probably way off, but I find it helps a lot. I started doing it when my old youngster had a thing for zips and snapping them off anything and everything! He is only a baby though so he's going to investigate. If you've found a bit that suits his mouth, maybe with the help of a bitting expert, I'd keep him in it for a few months and let him become desensitized to it rather than switching it up a lot. But thats me. I tend to find one and stick with it!

 

[quirky]

This is my horse to a tee.
I too tried lots of bits in various materials foot about a year. I never tried strapping her mouth shut as it isn't a normal yawing type thing, she really isn't happy, it would've been cruel!
We have been bitless 4 years, she is 8 now.
I still try to bit her every now and then as I'd like to do a bit of dressage but it just isn't happening.
Thanfully, she goes beautifully bitless.

 

[Clodagh]

I would get his teeth done every 3 months, that is what my vet suggested for Piper. She also took out his wolf teeth.
I have yet to have a horse that doesn't like JP curved french link, it is very thin, Piper's mum had a small mouth and a big tongue so less was more.
I really wouldn't tie his mouth shut, like you say he is a happy boy, why try to make him miserable?

 

[Wheels]

There are so many changes going on in a 3-4 year old horses mouth. What the dentist saw as fine one week might not be fine the next week and the dentist can't see what's going on beyond the gum line. Sounds like your horse is using the bit as a teething ring to me. The chewing other things and face rubbing are teething issues.

I had similar bitting issues with my horse last year as a 3 yr old. I decided to ditch the bit temporarily and rode and long reined in a dually which he was fine with. When he came back into work this spring as a 4 yr old I re-bitted him and we haven't had any issues this year.

Please don't strap his mouth shut, he is opening it to get away from discomfort and will resent not bring able to do that.

 

[twiggy2]

my mare is going to be a 'proper horse' but I started her with a 'dead bit' in her mouth whilst riding and she has taken to it all really well, she was fairly difficult to bit- she hated rubber, nathe happy mouth type bits prefers a lump of metal but she was really static and tense through her jaw, i used a sweet iron bit to help with that and know as she goes really sweetly in a myler staring bit.

one of the ponies at work pulled faces like roo whenever you put the bit in her mouth and would be like that everytime she was bitted up - she wore a flash when she came to us and still does, I hat putting on and it has in my eyes been soley responsible for the fact that she is now so tense through her jaw and neck when working, she is very talented but very very tense now when ridden-if you remove the flash she does what roo does all the time (I have tried) her teeth have been checked but as she does not do it and you have control in a flash no-one looks to make her happier very sad as she is so honest.

dont be scared to playaround regardless of what job you are aiming for cos if he is happy he will be better at that job and have more trust in you.

a micklem might be a good idea to try as it stabilizes the bit-i had toyed with the idea of one but for now we are both happy

Thanks. That's a Happy Mouth mullen, his most hated bit so far! It was really hard to get the height right on it. Sitting stationary is wrinkled both sides rather more than I like. Then when he wrinkle up his nose like that and yaps, it hang loose. Sigh. He's not worn it since that day. He's in a NS Team Up now and so far happiest with it fairly snug. I've established he hates no joint and doesn't like a single joint. But having just spent £60 on the Team Up and he's not quite so bad, I'd prefer to stay with that. Have you seen to price of the hanging cheek NS bits?!?!

Is there a noseband attachement anyone can think off that would stablize it a little?

You've suggested exactly what I did with previous horses. I didn't with Roo as he's a Real Horse (as opposed to a fat cob) and felt he needs to be more traditional if he's to do a traditional job (event and hunt). Don't know why really and thinking I may need to rethink.

 

[Alyth]

I would be trying different mouthpieces, snaffles with a lozenge, half moon snaffes, thin and thick mouthpieces without using the reins, just to see if he is happier with one!! Ride bitless for a while while you are trying them out! Good luck!

 

[gwniver]

omg you sound exactly like me a couple of months ago !! my 4 year old hated the bit like you any bit we tried went in the bin , so I rode bitless for a year in just a plain English hack , and about a month ago I tried him in a plain French link loose ring snaffle and he went great in it , we are now working on getting a outline and working from behind - it is slow progress but he loves it - I feel for you it is soo frustrating but just give him time , I think some horses just need more time to mature
good luck

 

[Kallibear]

You say he investigates everything with his mouth, have you worked his mouth without a bit in at all? Im probably way off, but I find it helps a lot. I started doing it when my old youngster had a thing for zips and snapping them off anything and everything! He is only a baby though so he's going to investigate. If youu've found a bit that suits his mouth, maybe with the help of a bitting expert, I'd keep him in it for a few months and let him become desensitized to it rather than switching it up a lot. But thats me. I tend to find one and stick with it!

Worked his mouth? He let's me stick my hand in his mouth and hold his tounge. In fact he quite like me to itch it. He thinks it's a brilliant game! He so far seems best in the NS so I stick with it for the last two months.

I think I'll ride in a halter until his teeth are done again next month. Last time he had a few slightly sharp edges and caps that weren't ready to come off yet. Nothing that caused him much discomfort. He has no wolf teeth although I'll get them to double check.