Your cancellable takes...
- Thread starter duncollector
- Start date
[153312]
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popcorn, anyone....?
blitznbobs
Well-Known Member
A horse never allowed to eat grass again to
Me is cruel i would rather pts
And
The biggest horsey mistake ive ever made was letting multiple vets emotionally blackmail me into colic surgery - never again
Me is cruel i would rather pts
And
The biggest horsey mistake ive ever made was letting multiple vets emotionally blackmail me into colic surgery - never again
blitznbobs
Well-Known Member
Go on be brave
Mrs B
Well-Known Member
Mrs B
Well-Known Member
Well, a biological woman has 2 XX chromosomes.
Other than that, any sex can self-identify as anything they want. Whatever they feel comfortable with.
So a transitioning/ed man can self-identify as a woman or of no sex or as a cat if they like, but is not a biological woman nor ever can be.
stangs
Well-Known Member
What about women with AIS, who have XY chromosomes but female genitals?
littleshetland
Well-Known Member
Speaking as a yard owner, would it be very much frowned upon to request that when potential new livery's come to view the yard.....they bring a a recent, comprehensive psychiatric report with them...?
Caol Ila
Well-Known Member
I derailed my own point by using Rowling as an example. Sorry about that. Should have used someone else!
My argument remains that being 'cancelled' is more of a right wing dogwhistle than anything else -- most of these celebrities still have platforms, social media followers, and zillions of dollars/pounds -- and virtually none of the horsey posts on this thread are things that would cause you to lose millions of Twitter followers or your Netflix show. If a famous trainer said, "I believe in beating horses until they jump," then they might lose their column in a syndicated magazine. That's kind of what getting "cancelled" means. It just annoys me that the word is now being used to describe any vaguely controversial or slightly off-the-wall opinion about something.
My argument remains that being 'cancelled' is more of a right wing dogwhistle than anything else -- most of these celebrities still have platforms, social media followers, and zillions of dollars/pounds -- and virtually none of the horsey posts on this thread are things that would cause you to lose millions of Twitter followers or your Netflix show. If a famous trainer said, "I believe in beating horses until they jump," then they might lose their column in a syndicated magazine. That's kind of what getting "cancelled" means. It just annoys me that the word is now being used to describe any vaguely controversial or slightly off-the-wall opinion about something.
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
Can people start a new thread for this transgender discussion please. It's a very important debate and it's derailing a fun thread.
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ponynutz
Well-Known Member
I agree with you, genuinally I do. They won't ever be a biological woman but they will be a woman and (as you say) they have every right to do that!
To be honest I wasn't expecting to agree with you but I'm very glad I do.
)Gender's a social constuct, horses dont know if theyre male or female or what for example.
Am also sensitive to the fact that knowing biologically you can't change must be very scary and upsetting if you feel you are not what you were born as though, so bringing attention to it probably isn't the best idea either. Wouldn't put it past medicine now though - it's surprising what hormone therapy can do!
We'll agree to disagree on our interpretation of JK Rowling's views, think it's easier to leave OPs thread alone for this ?
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Mrs B
Well-Known Member
I would refer to them as individuals with AIS, but I assume they would identify as whatever they wished.
blitznbobs
Well-Known Member
Or a person with XO ‘turner’s syndrome’??
cauda equina
Well-Known Member
Or Klinefelter syndrome, XXY
But we all know that's not what we're talking about here
But we all know that's not what we're talking about here
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
[153312]
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Equine controversial take: sometimes, a short sharp wallop is absolutely necessary. Ideal? No. But necessary, for the safety of the horse and the handler? Yeah. Dunno if it's going to be disapproved of here or not. But anyway.
Also, sometimes social media/internet/other owners etc DO know more than vets/farriers/other professionals about certain things.
Also, sometimes social media/internet/other owners etc DO know more than vets/farriers/other professionals about certain things.
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
Well that's me and maybe 75+% of the horse owning population in court then ?
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Cortez
Tough but Fair
Those are hermaphrodites and vanishingly rare. How many hermaphrodites do you know?
Elf On A Shelf
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There is a German racehorse that is one! Bizarrely enough!
https://paulickreport.com/news/the-...odite-faces-disqualification-from-group-race/
Cortez
Tough but Fair
I agree with you, genuinally I do. They won't ever be a biological woman but they will be a woman and (as you say) they have every right to do that!
To be honest I wasn't expecting to agree with you but I'm very glad I do.
Gender's a social constuct, horses dont know if theyre male or female or what for example.
Am also sensitive to the fact that knowing biologically you can't change must be very scary and upsetting if you feel you are not what you were born as though, so bringing attention to it probably isn't the best idea either. Wouldn't put it past medicine now though - it's surprising what hormone therapy can do!
We'll agree to disagree on our interpretation of JK Rowling's views, think it's easier to leave OPs thread alone for this ?
Horses absolutely know if they are male or female, what on earth makes you think they don't? Bizarre.
Gloi
Too little time, too much to read.
bouncing_ball
Well-Known Member
They are more common than you think but not well publicised. My mother was a midwife and health visitor (over sees children of preschool age), and saw a number over her career. Generally not widely spoken of.
ycbm
Einstein would be proud of my Insanity...
Cortez
Tough but Fair
I keep sheep. They know what sex they are (I have no penguin experience, however....).
0.0012% of births are hermaphrodite, apparently.
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Parksmum3
Well-Known Member
totally agree, didn’t mean to point the finger directly at the racing industr
ponynutz
Well-Known Member
They're animals? Animals only know instinct. They know if they're hungry, thirsty, tired, in pain, whatever. They probably know what bits they have and, the males especially, know what they want to do with them. (bit crude, sorry, but point stands). They might even know whether another animal is the same or not the same as them through pheromones but they still wouldn't think about it like we do.
They might have gender roles but again that comes to them from instinct/hormones telling them that, not 'Oh, I'm a mare this is my societal role'.
Animals are not intelligent creatures? Humans are. Animals don't know what 'male' or 'female' is. They only know what their hormones and instincts tell them. Therefore they don't understand the concept of gender. Sex, maybe they know that but not in the same way we do.
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Cortez
Tough but Fair
You what? Have you ever even met an animal? "Animals are not intelligent creatures": I vehemently dispute your assertion, as well as your contention that they don't know the difference between male and female. Horses (and any of the higher animals) most certainly know what sex they are, and recognise it in others of their species. I have no idea how you can believe that they don't.
ponynutz
Well-Known Member
Ok, we disagree. That's not what I was actually saying though, maybe I wasn't clear enough.
Not going to repeat myself... worried others might think bit of a pointless argument to be having on a fun thread seeing as it was already disrailed a bit (which I didn't help with I'll admit).
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MereChristmas
riding reluctantly into the sunset
Thank you.
I know nothing about Twitter except that it exists. I don’t read any “celebrity” news, watch any reality tv, have never read or watched Harry Potter, wouldn’t recognise J.K. thingy if she walked in my living room so for once I am glad I am old.
Caol Ila
Well-Known Member
What an interesting turn this thread has taken!
I think gender recognition, both self-reflexive and as regards to other individuals, in non-human animals is a really interesting conversation. Obviously we can't get into their heads and ask, "How does it feel to be a gelding/mare/stallion?" Nor can we ever know if a male horse feels like he should have been female, or vice versa. We don't know if animals see gender roles as social constructs -- but probably not? I think that's what ponynutz was trying to get at. It doesn't mean animals aren't intelligent, but gender roles (the jobs of stallions v. mares in a wild herd, say) seem determined by biology, hormones, and yes, learned behaviour. But do horses have the cognitive ability to question the basic premises and structure of their society?
I think gender recognition, both self-reflexive and as regards to other individuals, in non-human animals is a really interesting conversation. Obviously we can't get into their heads and ask, "How does it feel to be a gelding/mare/stallion?" Nor can we ever know if a male horse feels like he should have been female, or vice versa. We don't know if animals see gender roles as social constructs -- but probably not? I think that's what ponynutz was trying to get at. It doesn't mean animals aren't intelligent, but gender roles (the jobs of stallions v. mares in a wild herd, say) seem determined by biology, hormones, and yes, learned behaviour. But do horses have the cognitive ability to question the basic premises and structure of their society?