3.5t horseboxes - Vauxhall/ Renault v Citroen/Fiat

[Waysandmeans]

Hiya looking for slightly older 3.5t horsebox (2000- 2007) for my daughters horse although seem to be thwarted by everything at the mo! Hes a17hh warmblood and everything so far is either too low (under 7ft 6 /230cm) or too short (less than 6ft10/205cm) or general rustbuckets - or sold before we get to see them! A lot seem to lack enough windows too.

Is there any preference for the Renault/Vauxhall versus the Fiat/Citroen/Peugeot? Seen a Citroen but it only has a 2.2cc engine which I would of though a bit underpowered? Others have been 2.5 or 2.8 - and I fear Citroen are poss ones to avoid? I wouldnt touch old Renaults or VW's and not keen on Iveco's as 3.5t as they are rarely tall enough and I think a bit unbalanced - maybe better for 5t plus?

Any advice/tips would be fabulous please Thank you

 

[webble]

You will likely struggle to get one big enough for a 17hh is a trailer an option? Do you have a licence for a 3.5t+?

Renault Master and Vauxhall Movano are basically the same vehicle

 

[Waysandmeans]

You will likely struggle to get one big enough for a 17hh is a trailer an option? Do you have a licence for a 3.5t+?

Renault Master and Vauxhall Movano are basically the same vehicle

Thanks I can drive a 7.5t and have done. I tow all the time but my daughter not keen on towing hence she wants a box. Yes I know re those being the same - its them compared to the the Fiat/Citroen/Peugeot ( which are basically the same) My partner who is a mechanic hates them all lol

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

Of all of our 2 stalls the Peugeot has been my favourite to drive. The Fiat has plenty of oomph, I'm not it's biggest fan as it is too sharp off of the clutch and accelerator even 3 years on and it's dulled down a little I still fall out the back door myself in it sometimes.

The Peugeots are just easy to drive all round but don't always have the best power.

The Renault was the most comfortable to sit in as a passenger but seriously lacked power up hills.

 

[Kaylum]

You need to look at payloads my friend had a 3.5 box for her 16.3hh had a rubbish payload and sold it. Couldn't fit her, a friend, tack and horse, fuel in within the payload. Many are well overweight seen transporters do it as well. Take two big cobs and 3 passengers plus tack to the beach in a 3.5. Totally dangerous and illegal. You will notice not many advertise payloads in their adverts for this reason.

 

[ROMANY 1959]

Look at BOSS horse boxes, but may be bit pricey and second hand hard to find. Most got payload of 1250 and I had a 17 h ID cross in mine plenty of room

 

[Lady Jane]

Which chassis depends on which mechanic you talk to, some say all much the same, others have a preference.
My is on a 2009 Master 120.35 Lwb which is a 2.5l engine and is not under powered at all and really easy to drive. I was used to driving a 2001 Iveco and to start with my problem was driving slowly enough as I wasn't used to having the ooomph

 

[Jambarissa]

Driven a few hires, I thought they were all very similar.

Agree that you need to look out for windows, one horse obvs better than 2 but they were always dripping with sweat after journeys under an hour.

I thought about getting one built, talked to some of the reputable manufacturers and was disappointed by payload. They said anything with a payload above 1 ton is likely not safely built - they'll have skimped on the floor or the bulkhead or reinforcing the sides. 1t will be just about enough if you are careful and don't go anywhere hilly!

 

[Abacus]

I’ve known several of these big enough for a 17hh horse - I’ve had three myself that easily fitted my 17hh and my friend’s 18hh (of course not at the same time). Plenty have payload over a tonne, which should be enough unless he’s enormously chunky. I’ve had a Renault, a Peugeot and a Vauxhall - all were pretty similar to drive, the main difference was the age. The Vauxhall was fabulously reliable and so far the Renault has also been good (I’ve had it for 2 years and no serious faults, it’s a 2012 plate). Didn’t have the Peugeot long as it was a long stall and I hated it.

Tricky though to find one that is old enough to be cheap, but also big enough and not too rusty.

 

[bluehorse]

I’ve got one for my 17h warmblood. He’s got plenty of headroom and travels herringbone. I have a payload of just over one tonne and he weights 650kg so plenty left for other stuff and me of course. It’s a Vauxhall movano long wheel base with an 2.29 engine and drives really well with him on board. I had it built in the end, spent so long looking for what I wanted and couldn’t find anything, plus as you’re finding I wasn’t quick enough to see the ones I was interested in before they sold.

 

[Waysandmeans]

Which chassis depends on which mechanic you talk to, some say all much the same, others have a preference.
My is on a 2009 Master 120.35 Lwb which is a 2.5l engine and is not under powered at all and really easy to drive. I was used to driving a 2001 Iveco and to start with my problem was driving slowly enough as I wasn't used to having the ooomph

My daughter drove a 2.5 Vauxhall said it was lovely! But it was only 7ft 31/2" tall although plenty long enough. Frustrating as I really liked the layout.

I’ve known several of these big enough for a 17hh horse - I’ve had three myself that easily fitted my 17hh and my friend’s 18hh (of course not at the same time). Plenty have payload over a tonne, which should be enough unless he’s enormously chunky. I’ve had a Renault, a Peugeot and a Vauxhall - all were pretty similar to drive, the main difference was the age. The Vauxhall was fabulously reliable and so far the Renault has also been good (I’ve had it for 2 years and no serious faults, it’s a 2012 plate). Didn’t have the Peugeot long as it was a long stall and I hated it.

Tricky though to find one that is old enough to be cheap, but also big enough and not too rusty.

Thanks. What head height did you source for your three boxes? I thought we could just get away with a tonne payload. They are rust badly - finding one that someone has done the welding already really! I feel like I prefer Vauxhall/Renault.

 

[Waysandmeans]

I’ve got one for my 17h warmblood. He’s got plenty of headroom and travels herringbone. I have a payload of just over one tonne and he weights 650kg so plenty left for other stuff and me of course. It’s a Vauxhall movano long wheel base with an 2.29 engine and drives really well with him on board. I had it built in the end, spent so long looking for what I wanted and couldn’t find anything, plus as you’re finding I wasn’t quick enough to see the ones I was interested in before they sold.

Thanks. What size is yours if you dont mind me asking as in head height and length? I thought we could do as you do if need be, with length but struggling to find one with head height! being in Surrey as soon as they are advertised they are sold. Unfortunately cant afford to have one built despite my partner being a mechanic - he simply hasn't the time . .

 

[Abacus]

My daughter drove a 2.5 Vauxhall said it was lovely! But it was only 7ft 31/2" tall although plenty long enough. Frustrating as I really liked the layout.

Thanks. What head height did you source for your three boxes? I thought we could just get away with a tonne payload. They are rust badly - finding one that someone has done the welding already really! I feel like I prefer Vauxhall/Renault.

I vaguely remember one of them being about 7’8 but can’t remember - I’ll measure the current one tomorrow, which has loads of headroom. I think you’d find one if you had a budget of £15k, or an older/riskier purchase at around £11k. I wouldn’t want to buy one for any less, hopefully your mechanic OH can help at least with a good check on any that you are looking at. Alternatively maybe look for a mid size box of between 4.5 and 6.5 tonnes? These tend to have much better payload and are more roomy - but more expensive to plate.

 

[Boulty]

I’d say 3.5 tons that can take one horse of that size do exist but they’re quite rare which is why you’re struggling to find them.

Would say it’s probably only worth your time looking at long wheelbase models to get the length in the horse area and would think you’d need one where the roof has specifically been made extra high. (Ie where the person who had it converted specifically wanted to put a large horse in) As for ventilation would suggest if it ticks all the other boxes you can pay someone to put extra windows & roof vents in so wouldn’t write something off for that.

May be worth looking at 4 ton as they’re more likely to have the suspension and engine to cope easily with a large horse & I think these tend to be built on long wheelbase chassis version (although could be wrong on that)

Renault master & Vauxhall movano are basically the same & both should be suitable & think Fiat Ducato should also be a good choice.

I used to have a LWB Movano that I had a 16.2 in with room to spare (even when he tried to rear in it!) it was converted by Racemaster & I think most of their conversions are pretty similar so may be a name to look out for. Think it had the bigger engine and it certainly never lacked power (not saying I ENJOYED the time I took it up Sutton Bank or the Sat Nav fails in the Peak District but it could certainly climb a hill!)

 

[Lady Jane]

@Waysandmeans - its really a case of build not whether its renault, fiat etc. Most will have 1t payload which should be OK for one big horse. But don't skimp on build quality to get the payload - throw out 'living items' eg sink/cupboard etc

 

[Toby_Zaphod]

Some of the 3.5 ton lorries/vans don't look very stable to me. I saw a Ford transit turn into a lorry park with an Ifor Williams box on the back & I really thought it was going to role over. I think the best of the bunch are the Renault & Vauxhall Morvano because the floor is between the axles rather than over the axles so the centre of gravity is low down so they are more stable. You should be able to find one that has sufficient headroom to carry your 17h horse. It's the payload that is sometimes lacking in these boxes, a good one will possibly have 1100kg payload. When you add up the weight of your horse, driver & groom, tack, water & fuel and you may only be just be within weight. You need to speak to your boss & prewarn them that you may have to go and check out a lorry without much notice. I did this when I bought both my trailers & later when I purchased both my lorries. To get the best ones you need to be quick off the mark as the best ones get snapped up quickly. I bought my last lorry in 2017, ran it for 5 years & I sold it a couple of months back for £1000 more than I bought it for. I advertised it on Marketplace & it was sold & on its way down to London with 14 hours of placing the advert.

 

[Kaylum]

The older boxes are much heavier. The chassis weight a lot before you even convert them. Make sure they have been on the weighbridge with fuel, spare wheel and fire extinguisher on board before you buy.

 

[Snapshot2016]

I have a 3.5 citroen Relay long wheel base which I had built by GB Bodybuilders (north east) about 12 years ago. Its super quick and huge inside, plenty of room for my 17.2hh who has a giraffe neck and is quite tall.

 

[Jambarissa]

The older boxes are much heavier. The chassis weight a lot before you even convert them. Make sure they have been on the weighbridge with fuel, spare wheel and fire extinguisher on board before you buy.

And rubber matting and partition! Some people are shameless!

 

[bluehorse]

Thanks. What size is yours if you dont mind me asking as in head height and length? I thought we could do as you do if need be, with length but struggling to find one with head height! being in Surrey as soon as they are advertised they are sold. Unfortunately cant afford to have one built despite my partner being a mechanic - he simply hasn't the time . .

The floor standing area between the cab wall and the lockers (I had lockers instead of a beast bar) is 7ft, that’s the max you can have without the wheel arches coming into the standing area. There is then the space above the lockers for the head and neck , I can’t actually remember what that is but I can measure if you like. From memory I’d say 2ft giving 9ft length in total. It is a bit tight for his head and neck by the time you’ve put a net in, but he does fidget a lot though which doesn’t help. That’s why I travel him herringbone, it gives him plenty of room. The partition has a telescopic arm. Height is 7’8, and is plenty high enough. I had my doubts about a 3.5t for a horse his size but I‘ve been surprised at the room I ended up with and it gives a nice stable ride as it’s so low to the ground.

 

[Waysandmeans]

The floor standing area between the cab wall and the lockers (I had lockers instead of a beast bar) is 7ft, that’s the max you can have without the wheel arches coming into the standing area. There is then the space above the lockers for the head and neck , I can’t actually remember what that is but I can measure if you like. From memory I’d say 2ft giving 9ft length in total. It is a bit tight for his head and neck by the time you’ve put a net in, but he does fidget a lot though which doesn’t help. That’s why I travel him herringbone, it gives him plenty of room. The partition has a telescopic arm. Height is 7’8, and is plenty high enough. I had my doubts about a 3.5t for a horse his size but I‘ve been surprised at the room I ended up with and it gives a nice stable ride as it’s so low to the ground.

Aww thanks for that info that's really kind of you! I see you have 7ft8 - really hard to find anything with that good a height. Most we have seen are 7ft3 - 7ft6. Though I can't believe so many people advertise a box without actually measuring it (and correctly).
We have travelled him once in a borrowed box which was 7ft6 high but a bit tight in length with no way of moving the partition, but he was quite happy for a one off once he got over travelling backwards rather than forward as usual in the trailer lol! Thanks again

 

[Squeak]

I can't remember which years but around 2007ish the Vauxhall, Citreon and Renault were a collaboration and so are actually the same engine. They have a lower point of gravity than other makes such as merc or VW hence they're so commonly used for horseboxes.

I have a 3.5t and it's great, I actually think it has more space for the horses than 7.5t's. Bit surprised by the bashing that they're taking on this thread. It's the same as the other weights of horseboxes, you need to be really careful to get a well built one so that things like the windows are in the correct place for ventilation, horses are in between the wheels etc.

 

[bluehorse]

Aww thanks for that info that's really kind of you! I see you have 7ft8 - really hard to find anything with that good a height. Most we have seen are 7ft3 - 7ft6. Though I can't believe so many people advertise a box without actually measuring it (and correctly). We have travelled him once in a borrowed box which was 7ft6 high but a bit tight in length with no way of moving the partition, but he was quite happy for a one off once he got over travelling backwards rather than forward as usual in the trailer lol! Thanks again

My old 7.5t was 7’6” and he travelled fine in it but his ears touched the roof! I think also in a 3.5t ventilation is really important and a higher roof helps with that too, plus a couple of roof vents!