4yr old behind leg and above the bit

[taraj]

I have recently bought a 4yr old ISH, he was backed in Ireland and has seen a bit, mainly in canter it seems!
Obviously I don't expect too much from him at his age but he finds trotting hard, he doesn't like going forwards, or taking a contact and has a naturally high head carriage (ears up nose). His go to if he doesn't understand is to stop. Back/saddle/teeth all ok (was slightly tight behind saddle). Any suggestions, maybe a differant bit? Excercises that may help him lower his head, relax his back and work his bum!. If anything I am a little soft on him as don't want him to not enjoy his work, but don't want bad habits either.

 

[Starzaan]

Hacking, hacking and more hacking. All you want at this stage is for him to get out and start enjoying work. It will get him to relax, use his back end, move forward and enjoy his job.

 

[TheMule]

Sounds like he wasn’t broken very well- he hasn’t been given a mouth or educated to the leg. It therefore depends on your experience level, you might consider sending him for 4 weeks somewhere that will do that bit of the education for you. I so agree that hacking is the best thing for a weak baby, but it won’t magically put those things into him if you havent done it before.

 

[taraj]

Hacking, hacking and more hacking. All you want at this stage is for him to get out and start enjoying work. It will get him to relax, use his back end, move forward and enjoy his job.

This is currently my thinking, keep things enjoyable. Have 30yrs of experience but have always backed my own and concentrated on getting them moving forwards from the word go so this is all new to me.

 

[Pinkvboots]

It sounds typical of a too tight saddle I would get it checked again, thing is if it's caused muscle wastage it's really hard to get a saddle to fit, often fitters don't recognise this and fit to the damaged back and it will still put pressure on the damaged bits, you may need more of a remedial fit as in wider with shims for a while to allow the muscle to come back.

 

[taraj]

It sounds typical of a too tight saddle I would get it checked again, thing is if it's caused muscle wastage it's really hard to get a saddle to fit, often fitters don't recognise this and fit to the damaged back and it will still put pressure on the damaged bits, you may need more of a remedial fit as in wider with shims for a while to allow the muscle to come back.

I have my normal fitter out again In a couple of weeks. I had to use a differant lady before who I'm sure is very good but it will be nice for a second opinion. If anything his saddle is currently a little wide and i am using prolite type pad. But agree (as did the physio) that his previous saddle was most probably a bad fit which caused the back tightness.

 

[maya2008]

Basic schooling - all the stuff beyond ‘the horse will let me sit on it while it moves and I can steer and stop’. That takes months and it sounds like your horse has never had that schooling. A new bit won’t teach your horse to carry itself properly, schooling will. If you need help, find an instructor who is experienced with young horses.

For what it’s worth, I didn’t ask any of mine to carry themselves in an outline until they were 4. Once I started asking, it took less than a week. I asked, they got it, we built up time with them carrying themselves like that a few minutes at a time with lots of breaks. Many professional riders do this as part of the backing process.

 

[Cortez]

If I were you I would send the horse away for some schooling by a pro. It is very likely that he has had the most basic of backings, Ireland is not renowned for the sophistication of it's training and he's probably just been backed and jumped around a course of fences with nothing else explained to him.

 

[Pinkvboots]

I have my normal fitter out again In a couple of weeks. I had to use a differant lady before who I'm sure is very good but it will be nice for a second opinion. If anything his saddle is currently a little wide and i am using prolite type pad. But agree (as did the physio) that his previous saddle was most probably a bad fit which caused the back tightness.

See prolite pads have there uses I have used one on a horse with muscle wastage but you need to really look at his back, if there are any hollows or dips especially behind the shoulder the saddle with sit down and tight on those bits stopping the muscle to come back, you might need to shim it in front to lift it off for now and a wider saddle is what is needed for shims.

What's he like without the saddle like on the lunge?

 

[taraj]

All very helpful, Thankyou
As said before I have always started my own from the word go and never had this issue so want to get it right without pushing him too much.
His such an honest little chap, and yes he will canter and jump what ever is put in front of him!
Sending away is an option but I find it hard to trust anyone (i have worked for a few "pros" in the past that I wouldn't send a hamster too, all very eye opening) any recommendations in the South?
Saddle pad is a lemieux version (I call them all prolites!) with the extra size shims you can add to the front/back so I may be able to play more with it, maybe he needs confidence that this saddle isn't going to hurt him?.
Erm lunge, what's that!? He doesn't understand that yet (i try not to lunge young horses too much as i believe it puts too much strain on the joints but agree it could be helpful!) long reins nicely!

 

[tristar]

lunging, long reining, just the normal things that help them know what we want

 

[LEC]

Sounds like he wasn’t broken very well- he hasn’t been given a mouth or educated to the leg. It therefore depends on your experience level, you might consider sending him for 4 weeks somewhere that will do that bit of the education for you. I so agree that hacking is the best thing for a weak baby, but it won’t magically put those things into him if you havent done it before.

It will also depend on physical as well. The dreaded 5yo has taken ages to get off the leg and I don't even touch her mouth until we have forwards (which we do not have in canter) purely because she finds it so hard. The more she strengthens up and I am tough with her about being off the leg the better it has got.

 

[Tihamandturkey]

Lots of hacking to get him going forward and lunging to help with balance before you ask too much of him in the school ?

 

[Batgirl]

My big man was stopping due to poor balance - helped with balance and straightness (asking and allowing forward, being very supportive with outside rein, outside foot etc) and the stopping reduced and has almost stopped. Though mine is 5, at 4 I did very little but hacking, hacking and more hacking. But still strict on the forward

Though echo some of what the other says - if you don't have the skills to 're-back/reeducate' it could be worth sending away, or if you can afford it lots of lessons to help.

 

[taraj]

Had a lesson for the first time in years, just to give me the confidance that it's ok to ask a little more.
Done a few excercise to help him understand what the leg means and that he can hold a light contact without stopping.
Been hacking working on the same excercises and he is already improving loads. Was just having a wobble I think! Saddle fitter is still coming out to double check saddle this week