9 month collie dog chasing my horse, help needed

meesha

meesha

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My gorgeous but frustrating 9 month old collie has started chasing the horse, circles him then if he runs she runs, she is not nipping but I feel it will progress to that. she is pretty good at all other times and will come when I whistle but I have tried various commands and using Frisbee as distraction but once she is locked on I have no hope. Not my first BC, other one used to chase but want to nip it in bud this time. Any tips or trainer recommendations in Somerset. I don't think food will work as she isn't a foody, she naturally wants to work the horse but my training isn't enough to make her stay or leave.
 
Our working collie will leave the sheep when he's told to so maybe you need to be working on his general obedience and having him on a long line when around the horses so you can pull him up when you want him to stand?
 
Myfamily 4 year old collie does this... She herds Bud up all the time. He luckily ignores her and she weirdly doesn't do it with any other horse? My BC has learnt the "lay and wait". She's very good at lay down and she'll literally sit at his gate just laying down watching him for ages. She got a lot better once I started getting her to lay down and wait at the outside of the school whilst I ride (she literally won't move - just lays staring at him) and coming out on hacks with us. A tennis ball helps to some extent as well but she literally just goes into "working dog mode" and Bud's her responsibility type thing! It's frustrating, but just correction and she'll get there. Is she spayed yet? My family BC isn't spayed yet (KC and my mothers umming and erring whether to have a litter from her or not as she's a lovely example). My nan has her sister from the same litter and se isn't quite as well put together so she was spayed at 18 months and she stopped the herding up after for some weird reason?
 
Thanks, may try the long line idea. She is not spayed yet as we are waiting for first season before doing her but we are practising the down and stay, a new thing as before I have just called back with a whistle but as this has stopped working we are trying the down and stay.

If anyone has any trainer recommendations be grateful
 
Meesha I do know of a local farmer who works collies, he runs sheepdog trials as well, if you are stuck I can recommend him but he is near Bristol.

It seems to me this dog is looking for a job to do, idle hands and all that, dont forget this is what she was bred for and in the absence of sheep/cattle she had found the next best thing, keep her on a long-line for now so you have full control and train leave it which will cover lots of things from eating horse poo to focussing on your horse.
 
Thanks Dobiegirl, she is with me down yard twice a day and I try to keep her brain engaged (when old enough will be hacking with me). Will give long line a go as of tomorrow but if could pm me farmer details be v grateful, I am in Bristol most days with work and grew up in Bristol, horses are nr wsm/Axbridge.
 
meesha, there's a basic truism regarding sheepdogs, and it's this; You will achieve nothing until you manage to 'Get a stop on the dog', in other words, it's vital that the dog acquires a set of brakes! The 'Down' and the 'Stay' won't be of use to you until you get the 'Stop' in place. The 'Down' is actually the next step from and follows, the 'Stop'. (God but I hope that this making sense!) :).

When you teach your dog the 'Down', you are doing it as the dog stands before you. The 'Stop' is what happens when the dog is at full tilt, and doing 130mph! One follows the other, and to expect a dog to lie down, whilst at a gallop, is a bit much!

It seems from your last post that the recall whistle is no longer effective. There's a reason for that, and it's because you haven't got the 'stop' in place. Certainly with young dogs, we should NEVER rely upon the recall until we've stopped the dog! Stop and Return will stand more chance of just Return. I only hope that this makes sense.

All so often, when we train dogs the temptation is to cut corners, and whilst I may be wrong, being reliant upon a simple recall, whilst the dog is 'Otherwise engaged', is asking an awful lot, and something which I wouldn't expect from an adult and highly experienced dog.

I will say this, some collies can become fixated on some animals, or footballs or even their own shadows, and before your girl becomes 'welded', I would as has been suggested, seek out someone who can demonstrate how you could make progress. If you have sufficient interest, you've no need to own sheep to have a go at Trialling, and you will find that most of those who keep working collies, can be a most amenable bunch!

I wish you well. Approached properly, you have fun in store!!

Alec.
 
Thanks Alec, will concentrate on the stop, I admit I have been focussing on the recall rather than the stop. How do you reinforce the stop? Seems the hardest command, I know I will need to start with her close and build up to a distant command but all tips welcome.
 
meesha said:
……. , I know I will need to start with her close and build up to a distant command but all tips welcome.
Click to expand...

You've got it in one! You've just answered the problem!!

Step 1. In the house, the down whistle and MEAN it!

Step 2. In the garden, the same.

Step 3. At your yard. A repeat, and THEN allow the dog to move, but reminding her that at 10 or 100 yards, you WILL be listened to!!

As a.n.other, I'd suggest that you find a competent person who will steer you. By internet it's impossible, but by demo, perhaps more easily grasped!

Alec.
 
I have two BC's, one was born to herd and one has no interest in it whatsoever. The born to herd one will follow the horses around occasionally until I remind her to be with me, and if they have a funny 5 minutes and gallop off she will attempt to follow. It is manageable by having her well under control and she loves a tennis ball so that helps.

I would love to find someone to teach us how to work sheep/ sheepdog trials so definitely take that opportunity up if you can!
 
was just about to write - you need to get a stop on that dog ! :p Mr Swan beat me to it, he’s right ;)

Would be worth contacting these people, they will be able to recommend someone in your area if you can’t go to them
http://www.devondogs.co.uk I don’t know of any sheep trials trainers but again, devon dogs should point you in the correct direction as they are collie people who understand collies . Good luck!
 
Thanks all, .you have all been very helpful... Will look up devondogs now �� poppy puppy is asleep on her dog bed/sofa upside down with her lovely pink puppy belly exposed, much too sweet for her own good.
 
Unless the OP wants to work this dog, I'd suggest teaching "Leave!" might be quicker and easier. Basically, that means "Leave that alone or the heavens will open and a shaft of lightning will strike you down".

The command is a shouted sharp "Leave" (stating the obvious!) coupled with an Act of God. The AOG is any safe but sudden shock you can administer from a distance (but forget e-collars!). My shocks are (a) a handful of gravel thrown upwards and timed to land around the dog at the moment I shout "Leave", (b) a sharp tug on a light long cord attached to the dog's collar timed so the cord tightens the same instant I shout "Leave", (c) a pinch of lead shot fired from a child's catapult with a pouch (to contain the shot) instead of the usual strip of leather, or (d) any adaption of the above I can think of that will administer a nasty surprise (e.g. light missile that can be thrown quickly and accurately. Some use a light chain)!

The essential to this is that you create a shock which the dog can only conclude has resulted from the act it is engaged in (e.g. chasing). Your shout of "Leave" was simply a friendly warning that the act the dog is about to perform could be dangerous. So if the dog works out that you've picked up the cord, thrown the gravel, fired the catapult, etc. the secret is out and you will be labelled the bad guy. The dog will simply learn to avoid YOU. (Every stray dog knows what the action of picking up a stone is followed by!). As soon as the dog has recovered, call it to you and make a big fuss of it and walk off away from what you want the dog to leave. YOU didn't cause the unpleasantness, did you? You are the good guy and would never ever do such a thing, would you? Don't forget, your weapon is shock and surprise, not pain. There is no need to hurt the dog. Very quickly, the dog will learn "Leave!" means he had better move pretty damn quickly as a lightning bolt is about to strike and chasing horses will be the last thing on his mind!

Max, my GSD pup, has already had this treatment and is now safe with free range hens and foals. He's tried chasing them but doesn't like the AOG that follows! He is so so grateful that I've warned him of what might happen! :)
 
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