A tale of buzzards, doves and horse communication

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happy-appy

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I very rarely post on H &H although would like to share what has to one of my strangest horsey moments!

One of my horses shares his stable with some nesting white doves (beautiful but messy damn things who moved in from the farm next door!). One of the young fledglings has been out on the yard for the last couple of days being fed by its parents and growing up. I have kept an eye on it and provided it with a pallet for some extra cover. Sadly, I went out to the stables this morning and the fledgling had disappeared ..only a couple of white feathers remained ..I put this down to a cat/fox/whatever.

I turned out the horses, then mucked out, and then decided to go back into the field to poo-pick and enjoy the sun. As I went back to the field with my barrow..one of horses began trying to get my attention with frantic 'nods'. This was not a horsey invitation to play, this seemed more intense. I have only seen this in horses 3 times in my life..(having spent most of my 50 plus years with horses!) and each time was in an 'urgent' circumstance (when a horse close to another had been pts, when a horse was worried by a helicopter flying low over his field, and when a horse had been very frightened by a trip away to a 'rough' so called trainer).

Anyhow, the nodding certainly caught me attention and I went to him. He looked from me to the sky and stared and then looked at me and continued to 'nod' and then looked up at the sky again. Looking up there were two buzzards circling, and unusually they seemed to be hunting in a pair. There are alpacas and lambs in the next field and the alpacas then also began making distress calls and running in to protect the lambs.

I watched the buzzards as they hunted the flock of doves..who were flying in panic...and then realised that this was why my horse was upset. The doves are his stable mates and his friends! His friends were being taken ...and he needed to tell me! (I am guessing that the fledgling may have been buzzard breakfast).

Anyhow I returned to the yard to open top stable doors to provide as much cover fore the doves as poss...and also put the dogs in the garden to try and deter the buzzards. The buzzards are nesting in a wood at the top of my field and keen on feeding their chicks right now I should imagine.

If any ethologists, horse behaviourists, animal communicators or those with any similar experiences would like to comment, I would love to hear your thoughts!

Strange but true ..and don't know where else to post this!

Thank you :)
 
That's really interesting, it sounds as though your horse was definitely picking up on the crisis. I wonder if its because they get used to the bird sounds around the stables so recognise the calls of distress.

I walked out into my garden just after 6am last week, to find a buzzard just about to start eating a big pigeon it had just killed. On seeing me he took off almost vertically clutching the full fat pigeon in his claws. It looked like a double decker bird as it flew away, I guess he would find a rooftop somewhere to finish his breakfast.
 
The buzzards certainly seem very active at the moment Wandamare, it is sad..but the great circle of life I suppose. Having read your post about the 'big' pigeon I have just gone back out and locked the chickens away! Now worried about the cat..hahaha :)


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It's also a nice thought that the horse would look to the human for help, or comfort or whatever they were looking for. It certainly makes it seem like s/he's had a nice life. :)
 
Horses are amazing creatures, and some can be incredibly clever. It sounds like your horse has learnt that you will take note and this sounds like it is a very close partnership.
 
Wow :(

Your poor horse, and poor doves..... We have a pair of collared doves living at home and I love their noises....

Fiona
 
I once saw a horse charge at a flock of agitated chickens. I thought they were wound up because of the horse until a weasel belted away across the field. I wonder if your horse had seen the fledgling taken earlier. Weird one!!
 
Not entirely the same but if my dog starts barking when she is outside my horses will both look out of there stables to see what's going on, if they are in the field they will run over to the gate or in the direction of where the dog is barking it's like they know the dog is concerned so they should be too.
 
SEL said:
I once saw a horse charge at a flock of agitated chickens. I thought they were wound up because of the horse until a weasel belted away across the field. I wonder if your horse had seen the fledgling taken earlier. Weird one!!
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...this might sound silly..but did the horse 'know' the chickens? :) I have had horses be protective of me (e.g. chase away other horses when they are crowding me at a field entrance) ,,and I wonder whether they see the chickens or doves as part of their 'herd' and they become protective of them?
 
They really are lovely little things aren't they! I think my horse must be quite attached to them to be so worried about what was happening.
 
Buzzards aren't birds of prey so doubt they took your dove. They are " opportunists", and eat carrion, or will catch mice on the fields. You only have to watch crows buzz bomb them. More likely a falcon or a fox took your dove. We have a pair of buzzards on our farm, with a variety of ducks, ducklings, partridge and their chicks, and the buzzards aren't interested. Look elsewhere for the culprit!
 
Seville said:
Buzzards aren't birds of prey so doubt they took your dove. They are " opportunists", and eat carrion, or will catch mice on the fields. You only have to watch crows buzz bomb them. More likely a falcon or a fox took your dove. We have a pair of buzzards on our farm, with a variety of ducks, ducklings, partridge and their chicks, and the buzzards aren't interested. Look elsewhere for the culprit!
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I have been studying videos of birds of prey..they are large and look like buzzards. They have white bars (distinctive) under their wings and one of them is above my house again this evening hunting the doves (who are flying as a flock swooping to escape them).

Please see the below: (an excerpt from Nottingham Wildlife Trust..near to where I live).

"Buzzards hunt mainly small mammals, such as voles and rabbits, and birds such as crows or pigeons. They will also take smaller prey such as earthworms, insects or small reptiles. Buzzards will also eat “carrion” (already dead animals) which they find in their territory. This has led them to be unfairly blamed and persecuted by farmers and gamekeepers".

It seems possible that with buzzards becoming increasingly common that they may be adapting hunting habits which they previously utilised more rarely. Any ornithologists on here may be able to help out with this one.

If not a buzzard, then definitely a very large raptor ..and it is at it again!
 
happy-appy said:
...this might sound silly..but did the horse 'know' the chickens? :) I have had horses be protective of me (e.g. chase away other horses when they are crowding me at a field entrance) ,,and I wonder whether they see the chickens or doves as part of their 'herd' and they become protective of them?
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The chickens were always in the horse's field & I'd never seen him charge at them before.....
 
I always find different species of animals communicating really interesting. I wonder would we be better at communicating with them if we weren't able to speak. I'm sure there's a lot of body language we're oblivious to because we focus so much on speech.
 
Seville said:
Buzzards aren't birds of prey so doubt they took your dove. They are " opportunists", and eat carrion, or will catch mice on the fields. You only have to watch crows buzz bomb them. More likely a falcon or a fox took your dove. We have a pair of buzzards on our farm, with a variety of ducks, ducklings, partridge and their chicks, and the buzzards aren't interested. Look elsewhere for the culprit!
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I get what Seville means...... yes buzzards are definitely birds of prey by definition, but just as Seville suggests they are not predators in the same way as (for example) peregrine falcons or goshawks might be? The key is the size of the feet - buzzards have small weak feet which shows that generally they feed on carrion, worms, easy prey rather than trying to exterminate the local wildlife? It is not unknown for them to take prey, but it is very unusual
 
mule said:
I always find different species of animals communicating really interesting. I wonder would we be better at communicating with them if we weren't able to speak. I'm sure there's a lot of body language we're oblivious to because we focus so much on speech.
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I must admit to being a bit of an animal communication geek :) ( I have 2 parrots who use cognitive 'human' speech with each other to converse!). I have done a lot of loose schooling with this horse in the past, using very fine cues..and he is used to me relating to him non-verbally, but he has not 'communicated' with me in this context before. I think there is so much about interspecies relationships and communication that remains untapped...and as humans I am sure that we have an awful lot to learn from other animals about inter-species communication, relationships and emotional intelligence.
 
Lévrier;13789319 said:
I get what Seville means...... yes buzzards are definitely birds of prey by definition, but just as Seville suggests they are not predators in the same way as (for example) peregrine falcons or goshawks might be? The key is the size of the feet - buzzards have small weak feet which shows that generally they feed on carrion, worms, easy prey rather than trying to exterminate the local wildlife? It is not unknown for them to take prey, but it is very unusual
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Thank you for that ..will try and get a short video/pic of them flying above for ID purposes if I can, as I can see you are interested in a definitive identification (and I am not an ornithologist). I do however feel sure that the horse just sees them as big flying predators ,,and at risk of being flippant I do not think that the doves care much for what they are called :) It is always good to hear from knowledgeable folks on H and H..and I am hoping to hear more about similar incidents...the one above about the chickens is really interesting too isn't it?
 
happy-appy said:
Thank you for that ..will try and get a short video/pic of them flying above for ID purposes if I can, as I can see you are interested in a definitive identification (and I am not an ornithologist). I do however feel sure that the horse just sees them as big flying predators ,,and at risk of being flippant I do not think that the doves care much for what they are called :) It is always good to hear from knowledgeable folks on H and H..and I am hoping to hear more about similar incidents...the one above about the chickens is really interesting too isn't it?
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I can absolutely believe that they are buzzards from your description - relatively short blunt rounded wings, with 'fingers' at the end of the wings as the individual feathers, and a rounded tail? They are usually mainly brown, but they can come in an amazing variety of white streaks/variations :) Sorry I am a total birds of prey geek, apologies :) The weasel story is also amazing, it is quite fascinating how animals behave without human intervention :)
 
Buzzards will take chickens, and young pheasants, I think an adult dove would be too much for them , they are not quick or agile. Red kites are far more athletic, and of a similar size, although different in shape and flight movement. I know people say buzzards only eat worms and carrion but I can only speak for what I have seen.

Lovely that your horse includes the doves in his 'family' or at least acknowledges them.
 
We've a lot (and I mean a lot) of definitively identified buzzards round here, and I have frequently seen them take small mammals, especially young rabbits from the big warren at the edge of the village. And occasionally you see them eating roadkill.

I have a rookery at the bottom of my garden. I spend far too much time examining the social behaviour of rooks - they are well used to me being in the garden with my three dogs, and they normally don't take much notice. They avoid the terrace area at the back of the house, but like walking on the roof and in the gutters. But if something goes wrong, such as an injured rook landing in the flowerbed a few weeks ago, or a young rook getting stuck in the brambles on the river bank today, they come and "tell" me about it, swooping round the terrace and making a heck of a racket, while others sit in the branches above the casualty and squawk like mad until I come and see what's happening. The injured rook was too damaged to save, but once I'd despatched and removed it, the others went back into the trees and went quiet. The young one today was fine once I'd hooked him out of the brambles, and there was a lot of chattering when he returned to the trees.

I find them fascinating, so intelligent.
 
Clodagh said:
Buzzards will take chickens, and young pheasants, I think an adult dove would be too much for them , they are not quick or agile. Red kites are far more athletic, and of a similar size, although different in shape and flight movement. I know people say buzzards only eat worms and carrion but I can only speak for what I have seen.

Lovely that your horse includes the doves in his 'family' or at least acknowledges them.
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Thanks for that Clodagh..I did think Red Kite as another possibility as they too have distinctive white bars under their wings)...although I certainly did believe they were buzzards as I have seen them perched on occasion before (although I am not an ornithologist!). It is a good job I shut my chickens away then if they take them too:). I understood that buzzards sometimes take pigeons on the wing...and the white doves are a lot smaller than my chickens (and the same size as common pigeons)!

Anyhow, I did not intend this to be a post about ornithology..it is supposed to be something beautiful about how horses can have empathy for other species and communicate. It was a special moment of connection for me and my horse, and I hope that others will read my post in the spirit in which it is intended, and share their own special horsey experiences. thank you for that.
 
Rowreach said:
We've a lot (and I mean a lot) of definitively identified buzzards round here, and I have frequently seen them take small mammals, especially young rabbits from the big warren at the edge of the village. And occasionally you see them eating roadkill.

I have a rookery at the bottom of my garden. I spend far too much time examining the social behaviour of rooks - they are well used to me being in the garden with my three dogs, and they normally don't take much notice. They avoid the terrace area at the back of the house, but like walking on the roof and in the gutters. But if something goes wrong, such as an injured rook landing in the flowerbed a few weeks ago, or a young rook getting stuck in the brambles on the river bank today, they come and "tell" me about it, swooping round the terrace and making a heck of a racket, while others sit in the branches above the casualty and squawk like mad until I come and see what's happening. The injured rook was too damaged to save, but once I'd despatched and removed it, the others went back into the trees and went quiet. The young one today was fine once I'd hooked him out of the brambles, and there was a lot of chattering when he returned to the trees.

I find them fascinating, so intelligent.
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Rooks and crows are incredible aren't they! Driving home last night a dead magpie was laid on the road..and 3 others were gathered around it...apparently this family of birds (and other corvids) actually mourn the dead.. maybe that is why yours went quiet? Can depend on H and H to deliver interesting info on the widest range of topics :)
 
happy-appy said:
Thanks for that Clodagh..I did think Red Kite as another possibility as they too have distinctive white bars under their wings)...although I certainly did believe they were buzzards as I have seen them perched on occasion before (although I am not an ornithologist!). It is a good job I shut my chickens away then if they take them too:). I understood that buzzards sometimes take pigeons on the wing...and the white doves are a lot smaller than my chickens (and the same size as common pigeons)!

Anyhow, I did not intend this to be a post about ornithology..it is supposed to be something beautiful about how horses can have empathy for other species and communicate. It was a special moment of connection for me and my horse, and I hope that others will read my post in the spirit in which it is intended, and share their own special horsey experiences. thank you for that.
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We have both red kite and buzzards where we live, although many more kite as we are close to the M4/M40 corridor where they have been reintroduced. It's easy to tell the difference between the two if you take a look at their tails - buzzards have stubby rounded tails, kite have forked tails. Interesting story though. :) x
 
nikicb said:
We have both red kite and buzzards where we live, although many more kite as we are close to the M4/M40 corridor where they have been reintroduced. It's easy to tell the difference between the two if you take a look at their tails - buzzards have stubby rounded tails, kite have forked tails. Interesting story though. :) x
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Thank you! That is really helpful..will look at the tail and report back! :) x
 
Rowreach said:
We've a lot (and I mean a lot) of definitively identified buzzards round here, and I have frequently seen them take small mammals, especially young rabbits from the big warren at the edge of the village. And occasionally you see them eating roadkill.

I have a rookery at the bottom of my garden. I spend far too much time examining the social behaviour of rooks - they are well used to me being in the garden with my three dogs, and they normally don't take much notice. They avoid the terrace area at the back of the house, but like walking on the roof and in the gutters. But if something goes wrong, such as an injured rook landing in the flowerbed a few weeks ago, or a young rook getting stuck in the brambles on the river bank today, they come and "tell" me about it, swooping round the terrace and making a heck of a racket, while others sit in the branches above the casualty and squawk like mad until I come and see what's happening. The injured rook was too damaged to save, but once I'd despatched and removed it, the others went back into the trees and went quiet. The young one today was fine once I'd hooked him out of the brambles, and there was a lot of chattering when he returned to the trees.

I find them fascinating, so intelligent.
Click to expand...

Oh my goodness I have just read this again more closely. Yes it seems to be the same thing! Wow...do you think that they see you as part of their flock? Or as some kind of protector? Absolutely fascinating...so sorry did not 'get it' on first read. intrigued.
 
happy-appy said:
Oh my goodness I have just read this again more closely. Yes it seems to be the same thing! Wow...do you think that they see you as part of their flock? Or as some kind of protector? Absolutely fascinating...so sorry did not 'get it' on first read. intrigued.
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They seem to know that I'm not a threat (and nor are the dogs) and that I can do things they can't. In fact when I heard them squawking today and I went to look, the rooks were in the branches above the riverbank, not where they usually would be, and the dogs were underneath them, all looking at where the young rook was stuck.

The house was derelict and the garden completely overgrown for about 15 years. I've recently been in touch with the people who lived here last, and the mother of the family told me that she was known as the Crow Lady because of her relationship with them (they are rooks but round here anything black is a crow), so I'm wondering if the rook family vibe has continued through the generations and they "know" that the woman of the household is a friend.

Oh, and the lady before her (who was her mother in law) had a lot of dogs ...
 
Rowreach said:
They seem to know that I'm not a threat (and nor are the dogs) and that I can do things they can't. In fact when I heard them squawking today and I went to look, the rooks were in the branches above the riverbank, not where they usually would be, and the dogs were underneath them, all looking at where the young rook was stuck.

The house was derelict and the garden completely overgrown for about 15 years. I've recently been in touch with the people who lived here last, and the mother of the family told me that she was known as the Crow Lady because of her relationship with them (they are rooks but round here anything black is a crow), so I'm wondering if the rook family vibe has continued through the generations and they "know" that the woman of the household is a friend.

Oh, and the lady before her (who was her mother in law) had a lot of dogs ...
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There seems to be stuff about nowadays about genetic memory although I know little about it, save that it is said by some to exist. I guess if 15 years has passed then some of the rooks may still be alive? Not sure of lifespan...but the dogs that were there the generation before? That is really so interesting. Also, what you say about the rooks seeing you as a person who they can trust and that can do things that they cannot? That takes some intellectual capacity (and I understand that corvids have plenty of that!). The horse who 'spoke' to me has absolute trust in me, and he is also the most intelligent horse that I have ever come across by some margin...I wonder if he too wanted me to go fix the situation for him? I am sort of embarrassed to be typing this as it seems a bit 'out there'..but I guess that unless we expand our thinking to outside of the conventional boxes we can never grow (..and it seems that the animals around us have no fear of doing this!). Thank you so much for this post Rowreach, quite remarkable.
 
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